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trial in his federal election interference case, and for the very first time revealing a key case against donald trump. for months now, questions house world about how much donald trump's state of mind matters in this case. did he actually believe that the election was stolen from him, and prosecutors need to show that the ex president knew he had lost the election? well washington post is now reporting this. the justice department weighed in on thedete for the first ti saying that what they need to prove it is not that trump liev the big lie of the election being stolen, but that he knowinglyspread associated lies in a criminal scheme stay in power. so from the special counsel's filing,quot just as the president of a company may be guilty of fraudfor using knowingly false statements of facts to defraud investors, even if he subjectively believes that his company will entuly succeed, the defendant may be guilty of ing deceit to obstruct the government function by which the results of thepresidential election are collected, and counted, and certified, even if he provides evidence that he subjectively believed that the election was rigged. prosecutors saying that trump's words go beyond first amendment protected speech, as trump's attorneys claim, because trump peddled specific false claims of voter fraud in order to commit crimes. again,om this remarkable filing, quote, as the indictmentcognes, the defendant quote had a right like every american to speak publicut t 2020 presidential election and even to claim,faely, that there had en outcome terminative fraud dunghe election and that he had one. d t defendant done no more, his statements pertain to political matters of public importance whatever maned protected under the first amendment, even a false. bu defendant did not stop there. instead, he made dozens of specific claims that there had been substantialfraud in certain states, such as that large numbers of dead, nonresident, noncitizen, or otherwise ineligible voters had cast ballots. or that voting machines had changed votes for the defendant to vote for biden. the defendant then used those lies as the instruments of his for criminal offenses. now this argument is just one of many points. that jack smith is making in his push to urge the courts to reject donald trump's kitchen sink approach to try to stop the federal election trial before it begins for that case entirely. prosecutors warning judge chutkan of what they say is trump's, quote, newest a late tactic. his request to stop all proceedings into the courts have weighed in, and whether donald trump is immune from prosecution because he was president and he tried to reverse his defeat in the 2020 election. the special counsel's office urging judge chutkan to prioritize a ruling on this because it may d before the supreme court. they write, this quote, the defendants actions made clear that his ultate objective with the state motion, as has consistently been the case in this in other matters, is to delay trial at all costs and for as long as possible. the special counsel urging the courts to reject trump's tactics of deceit, all designed to delay this trial, and that is where we begin today with some of our favorite reporters and friends. former acting u.s. solicitor general -- here, plus national investigative reporter for the washington post caroline is here, and the editor at large for the bulwark, charlie sykes is here. charlie, it always felt like trump's, i think you called a lizard, brain and i've always called it his reptilian survival sense, would inform him that this criminal trial is very dangerous for him. and i don't know if it is his performative meltdowns in the civil fraud trial in new york city, but these filings on trump's part have a desperation to them, a desperation to not see trump stand trial for his election interference. >> well, and i think that is obvious. it has been the strategy and the pattern of practice for donald trump. i think you saw the illicit brain in full in new york, but he has a different set of lawyers, in washington d.c.. there are some grown-ups. and of course this is the part of his strategy. because he knows that there is a very real chance that he will be convicted of this case. judge chutkan, if she continues to move ahead at the speed and the seriousness with which she has so far, there is a chance that he will be a convicted felon by the time of the republican convention. when his main hope now is to delay, two of his skate, to obstruct to the point where this will be pushed past the election, and the election is all about keeping himself out of jail. and he can make this all go away. so we do have the lizard brain donald trump, but also we have the donald trump that knows that the only way that he is going to describe this is to push this back as far as possible, and that is not complete. the rational decision on his part, is? it >> no. but it certainly makes the indictment in d.c. and the charges and investigation into january six, i think it is important, as the four of us have always intuited they would be should this moment come to pass. and i want to press you, neal katyal, on the final east them selves. what are we learning about jack smith's team and their case on these filings? >> i think we learned that jack smith's team is professional, competent, analytic, and the like. i think really the thing that we are learning is from the trump team's final east because they basically threw every argument that they could think of against the wall to see what might stick. and what jack smith's team did is meticulously sort through this mess, to use the best descriptive word, and explain why the judge should all let this fall to the floor. jack smith's team picked the motions with surgical, surgical precision. just to take one trump filing, this crazy idea that he is immune from criminal prosecution because he is but president. that is an insane concept, as jack smith's lawyers pointed. out if that was true, the president could commit murder or engage in any number of fraudulent acts to try and subvert an election, canceled the election entirely. the idea that the president is immune from criminal law is insane. now there is an argument that a sitting president cannot be indicted. that is something that has been the case since 1973, but last i checked, trump is not a sitting president. and so it is an embarrassing filing, and i think jack smith called it as much. what i really like in these filings is that he is calling trump out on what the strategy is. it is not to win. but absolute immunity or first amendment or double jeopardy. try and delay the trial, so take an appeal to the court of appeals for the d.c. circuit, and then the u.s. supreme court with the hope that that will delay things. and the u.s. supreme court i don't think is going to hear these arguments. these are pathetic arguments to put it mildly. >> i want to say this, but caroline, there seems to be a benefit eyeglass to going after the mueller team. jack smith teams filing suggest that they operate in a world that is not hermetically sealed from a political climate. they are cognizant of the my cousin vinny legal arguments, they may lose in court, but prevail in the political arena. and so i'm not trying to suggest or positive that jack smith is playing in the political arena, but the filing suggests a keen awareness that everything about this trial suggests that trump's lies polluted both the political arena and, at the time, the constitutional one. the official proceeding that it thwarted. and i wonder what you make of what we are learning and what is being revealed from jack smith's team through the language of these filings? >> i think you are picking up on something so subtle and yet so profound about the way that jack smith is speaking both through his deputies and through these pleadings. let's be clear, he is using declarative sentences, and as neil said, calling out the president for the actual tactic at play here to delay and delay. it is true that the argument that a president is immune from all laws sounds laughable, and yet, it could be in some respects donald trump's -- to put things off in that technical word that we use in court reporting, -- appeal. going up to the appellate court, there is a two-part process and then there is a third process for the supreme court. it can all be glacial in terms of the amount of time that it takes, and it can push this back in a way that donald trump hopes that it can. we will see. but there is something really important about the way that smith is using his words in these extremely lengthy but also clear filings. for example, tom wyndham, one of the first prosecutors assigned by the justice department, to look at the january [silence] january [inaudible] >> carol leonnig as frozen, we will make sure that she is unfrozen before we go back to her. can you hear, us carol? did you hear us? >> yes, can you hear me, i'm so sorry. >> no, you are good. we got you. >> no, you are good. we got you >> for example, you have tom wynden, the first prosecutor assigned to this case by the department justice to look at the white collar potential crimes of the effort to block the election and this occasion, forgive me, of the election on january six. he is the one writing, when he takes it very clear umbrage at donald trump's claim that this is a group of corrupt cronies, and says that these are prosecutors with decades of experience who have taken an oath to the constitution, to follow the facts where they lead, and of course i'm paraphrasing here, but you can hear the grinding of teeth and that pleading saying, you better back off, mr. trump, because that is not what we are. this is not a rigged investigation. you can hear it in mali gaston, another early prosecutor from the u.s. attorney's rastas, when she writes and her pleading that donald trump is personally responsible for what happened on january 6th. there is no fluttering or indirect or passive language. she says that his actions were -- led to the culmination of what happened in the riot on the capitol and ultimately the violence that day. again, i'm paraphrasing. but how much more interestingly clear is that compared to for example robert mueller's very methodical report, which had a lot of legalese, and often was not declarative. >> and look, jack smith's benefits from going, let's see, there was the mueller volume one, there was mueller volume two, and they've been to impeachment trials. he benefits from going fifth, sixth, or seventh, whatever number we are on. but there was such a overwhelming volume of material to use to bolster jackson's legal arguments with trump's own words. i just want to read more from the filing, because i think that to the degree that we are all desperate to know what is going on behind the stores, they are revealing a lot and the substance of these filings. i want to send this to you, charlie. this is the response to trump's motion to s. quote, the inctment belies that assertion, showing that the defendants lies ncerned not philosophy, religion, history, the soal sciences, the arts and the like, but insteadconcrete specific statementh he knew were false. 3600on citizens had voted arizona, more than 10,300 dead people had voted in georgia, and illicit dump of more than 100,000 ballots detroit. there had been 205,0 more votes thanots in pennsylvania. ther h been tens of thousands ofaw fill votes in with constant. moreover, those false statements were used to conspire, to defraud, and obstruct. nor is there any basis for the defendants suggestion that proving he committed fraud through false statements would be akin to dictating what he is required to believe. i read this section because i was on the air when he was lying about these things, and there was this feeling of falling with no bottom, right? that as a democracy, we were just free falling, into this earth to. i talk about it as earth one and earth 2. over on earth 2, there is no consequence for telling those lies. jack smith seems to be saying, how about them apples? i got you. and i wonder, charlie, if you have this sense that's the entire sort of body of lies, and the entire body of ill intent has caught up with trump in this moment? >> well we will see, but i think there expert is a perfect example of what carroll just described. you have the declarative sentences, you have the very very direct language, the very very clear language. one of the problems, and this goes back to your question, with the mueller investigation versus donald trump is that there was a certain asymmetry. they were playing by a certain set of rules. jack smith has watch the way that donald trump attacks, undermines, obstruct these investigations. the way that the office gates. and he has decided that he is not going to make the same mistake. he has figured out what he needs to do, or what is necessary, to take on donald trump. in taking on donald trump means speaking very, very clearly. laying out the lies with real specificity. and i think that the clarity and the directness of his response is an indication that he has learned from that asymmetrical warfare between donald trump and miller and others, which is not a criticism. it is just a recognition that, with donald trump, you are dealing with somebody who you need to bring your a game, and to neil's point, this filing is an indication of just what ineffective team he has put together, and how aggressive they are prepared to be, because this is what it is going to take. if you go after donald trump, you cannot pull your punches. you cannot assume that he is going to play by the old rules. you are going to have to be this blunt, this direct, this clear. >> and just to not to my own awareness of what is being, what is popularly the right-wing ecosystem, this is a line i guess of reasoning that is going around, right. around right-wing media, around my cousin tv lawyer in, where they're saying oh, they can't prove intent. and what jack smith's, the filing i read from the beginning, is articulating is that these specific lies deployed to carry out specific elements of a criminal conspiracy are neither protected speech nor are they excusable or non crimes if you actually believe them. i mean neal, can you just flush that out for us? l, can you just >> first of, alk up on charlie's excellent point, when i have a big huge legal case, and there are three audiences. one is the court as an audience, in the second is the american public, in third is the audience of history. and what i think smith has done so effectively in these filings is he has taken these trump filings, which are pathetic on their face and not calculated for the first -- at all, and he's not going to win in any court of law, but it is relate to the second, and what jack is doing, what jack smith is doing is he is saying, well i'm going to educate the public in the reverse. so that is why you have that beautiful language about all of the different lies that you just put up on the screen. the goal here is to use trump's filings and a way against him by basically demonstrating how ridiculous and absurd that they are and how simple and straightforward the case is for smith. and so when you get to something like criminal intent, this is a complicated legal concept, but the basic idea is that the criminal law requires you to have a bad intent. it's not enough to just do something bad. and the question is, what is about intent that you have to show? here, the prosecutors as you said in the opening segment, use the word deceit. indeed they use the word to seat 46 times in a filings yesterday. and what they are saying is that we do not needed to prove that trump genuinely did not believe the big lie. we do not need a mind reader for trump. all we need to do is show that he knowingly spread lies to try and stay in power. that is it. and so the things like the baseless allegations that dead people are casting ballots when that voting machines were changed from trump to biden, things like that, all of that suffices to show that trump committed a crime. that is what is going on here. they're absolutely right on the wall. and i don't expect that this filing is calculate to do anything about trump except try to speak to his base. >> with all of that sort of out of the way, carol, i want to read the special counsel's response in opposition to trump's motion to dismiss for vindictive prosecution. i guess it speaks for itself, right? quote, the defendants theory of discriminatory purpose is that the incumbent president, joe biden, directed the defendant's prosecution to defeat him in the next election. the defendant fails to bring any evidence to support this claim. that is because there is no such evidence. the incumbent president has no role in this case, and the career prosecutors handling this matter would not participate in this part to prosecution if it were otherwise. i guess i remember a time when that would be so obvious. you would not have to say it or put it in writing. but this is to me both an indication of how clear trumps projection of what he would want the justice department to do on his behalf is, and the jack smith even has to acknowledge that this is not the case with him, and perhaps a nod to the most dangerous element of actually taking trump to trial in march. what do you think when you see that? >> you, know actually was thinking so much about the way that you asked the question, because donald trump we all know is a famous projection or. always imagining that what he would do means that that is sort of the nefarious or machiavellian strategy that another person with shoes. and he accuses people of it before they have ever indicated in any way that they are doing that considering it, or if there is any -- of them considering it. because it is probably what he would have liked to do, but i also have to stress to you, it is not just donald trump projecting possibly what we think he would like to do in a justice department in the future, a worrisome thought, but it is what he actually did when he was president. he did interfere multiple times and the department of justice's work. he did bully, pressure, and harangue his attorney general. both of them to do things that he thought would help him politically. and so it is not a shocker that he thinks, hey, eric holder looked out for president obama and merrick garland in his view is looking out for joe biden getting reelected, but i can tell you from reporting that nothing could be further from the case. i say this with no partisan interest. it is just not true. if anything, merrick garland and joe biden have kept so far apart from each other to avoid any possible implication that they could discuss this and any moment. they have kept such a distance from one another, as have their aides. based on our reporting, merrick garland has kept the farthest from jack smith. so the notion that these prosecutors are -- by anything other than the evidence is hard for me to imagine based on the lack of connection between any of these three main entities. the white house, the attorney general, and the special counsel appointed to run this case precisely because it had to be kept separate from the direct line of the chain of command of the department. >> carol, mike schmidt made a similar point yesterday that for all of the extraordinary reporting, it's your paper at the times about what trump would do if you were there again, you already did all of this. and so i want to ask you to name names. as you are talking,, he sought lisa page, he sought to prosecute hillary clinton and half an vesta gate a comey -- were investigated. the arrested extraordinary audits of comey and mccabe. to your point, he already did this. it seems like the very important sort of fact check for ourselves. and we do it instinctively when we talk about political violence, that we live in a post january six america and a post paul pelosi -- paul pelosi attack. we also live in a post using doj to prosecute your ones perceived and it enemies, and i wonder if anyone's proceeding on that? list >> i am thinking about the ways in which he has, there is pressure campaign will president, has made the fbi -- shy, and people we have spoken to just writ large have talked about, as i reported and the story, in the summertime, they talk about the dead bodies and the ground in the wake of the hurricane. there are peoples whose careers obviously were if not maimed, ruined. if not, ruined maimed. forgive me by the president continually coming after those, the names he learned were involved in a straight up standard criminal investigation. i have to say, in fairness, there were mistakes and some of that criminal destination, but there was also frightening evidence that donald trump's campaign was in regular contact with russian operatives and also gleefully soliciting or at least encouraging the help of the russian government. and so there's nothing wrong about investigating that and being concerned about that as a counter intelligence investigation. however, it has left a lot of people wary of basically dancing with this individual. >> it is such an important point, and such an important correction. look carol leonnig, like you first artemis off. neal and charlie, stick around, because i want to show both of you what trump says after he has been told he is dealing with bad information. the lies he tells after learning the truth. we will dive into what that might mean he would sound like or look like as a witness and this trial. we will also dive back into trump's big day yesterday on the witness stand in the fraud trial that could take down his business, put it in air quotes, empire. the testimony yesterday. and so that's what his defense team does next in that case. later in the broadcast, it is election day,number of states in this country today will look at the issues driving people to the polls and this off year election. steve kornacki will have the first indication of how people voted today for us later on the broadcast. all those stories and more when deadline: white house continues after a quick break. do not go anywhere. anywhere g up, i've got symptom relief. ♪ ♪ control of my crohn's means everything to me. ♪ ♪ control is everything to me. ♪ feel significant symptom relief at 4 weeks with skyrizi, including less abdominal pain and fewer bowel movements. skyrizi is the first il-23 inhibitor that can deliver remission and visibly improve damage of the intestinal lining. and the majority of people experienced long-lasting remission at one year. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, had a vaccine or plan to. liver problems may occur in crohn's disease. ♪ now's the time to ask your gastroenterologist how you can take control of your crohn's with skyrizi. ♪ ♪ control is everything to me. ♪ ♪ learn how abbvie could help you save. want a smarter way to mop? 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to find peace. - [narrator] and as each warrior's needs evolve, so do we. because these last 20 years are just the beginning. we're back with neal and charlie. i wanna show you something, and neal i want your information on this. this is evidence that we found through public testimony of the january six committee of people closest to telling the truth, and then what trump said afterward. watch. >> i specifically raise that dominion voting machines, which i found to be among the most disturbing allegations, disturbing in the sense that i saw absolutely zero basis for the allegations. i told him that it was crazy stuff, and they were wasting their time on that. i was doing a great disservice to the country. >> we have a company that is very suspect. its name is dominion. with the turn of the dial or the change of a chip, you can press a button for trump and the vote goes to biden. what kind of a system is this? >> we definite talked about antrim county again. that was sort of done at that point. because antrim county had been done and all of that. but we cited backed that to say, you know, this is an example of what people are telling you in what is being filed in some of these court filings that are just not supported by evidence. >> in one michigan county alone, 6000 votes were switched from trump to biden, and the same systems are used in the majority of states and our country. es and our country. >> what you just showed, nick, all over the last two minutes is example a of why the prosecution is going to win this case. donald trump is going to go into this with the presumption of innocence, and they will prove it beyond a reasonable doubt. the highest and in the law, the highest burden of proof. they're going to commits all 12 jurors that trump committed fraud, and yet those video clips show exactly that. trump has been holding on to the idea that he can just convince the jury that he genuinely believed he won the election. and what jack smith's filing yesterday did is saying, all right, big guy, that is not actually what we said. we don't need to show that. we probably can't prove that, but we don't need to prove. that we just need to prove that these individual instances where they committed fraud. you are told one thing about suitcases or number of voters or voting machines. you are told that by authoritative sources, including your own attorney general, you blew that off and told the american public a lie . and that is the essence of the crime. that's where i think prosecutors, ask you flashed this at the start of your show, i had such an important point about basically they had an example, which is the ceo, almost like a sam bankman-fried figure, he's going to be guilty of fraud if he makes knowingly false statements that defraud its investors, even if he thinks that the company is going to succeed. even if it isn't just minor stuff, but if you're putting out that false information into the ecosystem, that's the crime. even if at the end of the day your intent might be pure, but that's the way in which criminal law operates. trump is trying to conflate and merge a bunch of different things. it's not going to work. and i think the prosecutors are going to show those clips that you showed at the start of the trial, and i think trump is going to have a very hard time trying to weasel himself out of that. >> now with you say survival instinct. i look the at the polls, not a big fan of polls. while being charged is something trump can survive or thrive in politically, being convicted isn't. and i think that i'm not saying he sat down calmly and been given a legal analysis, that rep till yan part of himself, the evidence is so obvious and remits such peril to him that the filings and back and forth to do anything in his power to delay the trial before the judge for election interference is existential for him. >> yeah, it is. and just going back to that montage you have, what a glimpse into what a murky place donald trump's mind is in the upside down universe, even asking the question, did he believe something was true or not seems to be missing the point. donald trump doesn't care whether something is true or not. this is the annihilation of truth. so the question is at some point, will he be held accountable for this? will he be held accountable by the court of public opinion? these polls are ominous, but it is important to recognize that the vast majority of americans -- many americans have not followed this as religiously as we have. they have not been paying that close attention and may even be in denial about whether or not 2024 will be a replay of biden vs. trump, but there's something about that kind of evidence that does focus the mind, and "the new york times" poll, which is almost all bad news for joe biden, does say a substantial portion of trump voters would abandon him if he was convicted. that would be the reality check here. and i think that that does seem -- that's enough to swing the election. and that's what donald trump recognizes. donald trump's mind may not be able to distinguish or care about what is true and what is false. confronted with the stark evidence of his own lies, of his own deception, is and a criminal conviction that that's going to be problematic for him going into 2024. >> understatement of the hour. i'll let that be the last word. thank you for your time. after the break for us, the new york attorney general's office gets ready to rest its case against the ex-president. what to expect as that trial moves to the next stage, we'll tell yo, next. s to the next stal tell yo, next. sleep more deeply. and wake up rejuvenated. with purple's new mattresses- fall asleep 20% faster have less aches and pains and sleep uninterrupted. right now save up to $900 off mattress sets during purple's black friday sale. visit purple.com or a store n♪ar you today. shelves. shelves that know what taste buds want. shelves smart enough to see, sense, react, restock. ♪ so caramel swirl is always there for the taking. the new york attorney general's office hands the case to donald trump's legal team in the $250 million civil fraud lawsuit. one witness left. it's not trump. he did his thing yesterday, as we all remember in rath juvenile fashion. it's ivanka. she's due on the stand tomorrow. despite her failed last-minute appeal that such an appearance, she will be the final witness in the a.g. office's final questioning. then the tables will turn and the trump team will begin call ing their witnesses in the case, which lint collude, according to trump's testimony yesterday, the bankers, very big bankers, end quote. joining our coverage, ed toir and msnbc political analyst tim o'brien joins us. what does that mean? >> this idea that ivanka trump couldn't afford to pay her nanny in order to make the court appearance got tossed out 37 she's going to get put on the stand and she's going to get facts put in front of her, which is always challenging for everyone in the trump family. they are used to spinning tales about their business and tales about their success and their banking relationship and their relationship with authorities and insurers in the court of public opinion. but it's a very different matter when you are put under oath and given documents for your own testimony. in this case, it's a credence. it's adding to all of this evidence that has already been presented in court that the trumps routinely inflated the value of their assets when it was useful for them to do, and deflated when it was useful with the tax authority. and ivanka has been quoted in multiple news articles, dan alexander has done some great work on this, in which she detailed a part of their business and what they said in previous statements, sos there's a strong likelihood she will just get cornered and carved up a little bit as prosecutors do. and i think that's what is to watch for here. and this tension with her father, all of the children are captive to donald trump. they don't really exist comfortably outside his orbit she has a particularly strange relationship with him, that as we all know, he's has sexualized at times, uncomfortably. so the whole thing just makes for quite a show in the courtroom. >> it does add a creepy element to it, the things he said about her physical attractiveness. i wonderer what did she doo for the company? what was the substance of the line of questioning? >> she was involved in transmitting information about the value of those deals and the current value of the property to the bank. all of them have tried to distance themselves from the idea when they gave valations for what they owned to banks, they simply relied on their accountants. but the reality is accountants refused to sign off on these financial statements because they were comicbook. they were art from reality. they were not sophisticated documents. the trumps knew that because they were trying to hoodwink the people they did business with. and that's the core sub tans of what they are going to get at with her. >> there is something so flag rant about trump's strategy yesterday. i'm not in real estate, and i'm not a lawyer, but you can easily explain to someone like me how exaggerating by a factor of three the size oftry plex is fraud. the judge has already found liable for fraud. what is your sense of what this effort is about for the family? is it all politics and optics, as we have been discussing? >> there's a lot of politics and there's a the lot of optics. there's the trump indignation playing the alpha victim to convince people he is being persecuted. but also you can see he's really angry. he is angry and he is the rattled. this goes at the heart of his self-image, his wealth, his success. so on one level, you see the trump strategy. on the other level, don't overplay that. this was a man who was losing during his testimony. donald trump behaving as you'd expect with the bluster. but you're also seeing donald trump squirming and raging at the fact he's being held accountable. and he is full facts. >> the dangerous game he has been play and is still playing. the private meeting they are right now behind closed doors. i have moderate to severe plaque psoriasis. thanks to skyrizi i'm playing with clearer skin. 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months. and skyrizi is just 4 doses a year after 2 starter doses. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, had a vaccine, or plan to. with skyrizi, nothing on my skin means everything! ♪ nothing is everything ♪ ask your dermatologist about skyrizi. learn how abbvie could help you save. hi, my name is damion clark. if you have both medicare and medicaid, i have some really encouraging news that you'll definitely want to hear. depending on the plans available in your area, you may be eligible to get extra 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say don't worry are the dayness, with all due respect for my colleagues, it was a national security suicide mission it became. >> important thing about that clip is that that wasn't a democrat. it wasn't a pentagon official. it wasn't a national security expert. that was a republican calling out the another republican. that was dan sullivan slamming tubby tuberville last week. after letting a former football coach's hold on hundreds of high-level military promotions over the pentagon's abortion health care travel policy go unchallenged for months, senate republicans are looking for an escape hatch, some way forward this week. the caucus is holding a special conference meeting requested by tuberville at this hour to discuss the next step. it comes as the senate rules committee will meet next week to consider a change in the rules that would allow promotions to be voted on as a large group instead of one by one by one, which is what tuberville is requesting. the democrats have said individual votes on promotions would take months for the senate to complete. doing nothing about our readiness problem as diagnosed there by a republican. joining our conversation is political analyst our dear friend former senator claire mccaskill. let's deal with the national security piece and enthey want we'll deal with the political piece. how do you fix this and get the military back to readiness, back to functional? >> well, the reason tuberville asked for a meeting today is the rule change is being proposed. they just need nine republicans. and they've got them. >> the sound came from the republicans. >> they have the nine votes. so the rule would change. they would do these nominations in bloc, which would allow schumer to call up 100 of them at once. it would really limit the ability of tuberville to do what he has done for months on end. you're right, the most interesting part about this is, first of all, he picked the military, which is just amazing to me that a republican from alabama, this guy has to be one of the dumbest people to have ever walked the earth in terms of political decisions. of all places to choose, he has all these executive agecy ises, he chose the military, where he's going to have the least support among his party from doing what he was doing. and secondly, these republicans have said we have had had enough. they don't have the assistance they need to do their job. you can look the at the middle east right now and realize that military readiness is pretty darn important. and i think he's lost the vast majority of his colleagues on this. but they are they see it as a slippery slope. >> they have been writing on reporting on drone attacks, on military installations. we are just at a moment of horribleness. we are in a moment where u.s. military assets are under attack by america's enemies. do you think -- is this for nine months? do you think that changed the republican's position or do you think there's a political fall kwout from tuberville's position? >> i'm not seeing any polling from alabama. i know his colleague in the senate, who is a brand new senator, is well liked in the senate already. she has worked in a way that nobody in the democratic side has particularly bad things to say about. i'm not saying she votes with the democrats, but i do think he has become more and more isolated as time has gone on. and more and more stubborn. i think they thought, well, he'll get over this and we'll move on. and i think the other thing is he's so ignorant about what this means for the military. if you think about the people up for promotion, think about their families. think about the disruption. just imagine if you had three children in middle school and high school and you were being moved to another post. and all of a sudden, you're treading water for months and months on end. it's so disruptive to the families of these leaders, and over all, military moral. everybody thinks you want to move up as a career, and now they are looking at moving up as this quagmire. so it has to get fixed soon. >> everybody has talked about how dumb he is. i love football so much, i have a hard time believing he's as dumb as i say he is. how does someone who is described as being not dumb do so much damage for so long to an institution pretty universally revered by most americans? >> damn good question. and i think the united states senate has to answer that question. and the republicans have to answer that question. and now they find themselves dragged into this quagmire by one of their members the fact that this has dragged on for nine months is appalling, but it apparently took the war in the middle east, attacks on u.s. troops, the heart attack by the marine corp. to shake thunderstorm out of their studenter. but this is not simply about moral in the military. this is about radiness. i can't explain to you, other than the fact that tommy tuberrorvill is the dumbest member of the united states senate, a senator from alabama would choose to take this stand to undermine the u.s. military over a policy issue. if he disagrees with a policy is issue, change the policy issue. do not undermine the readiness of the u.s. military. >> i think it's also notable whenever another norm is annihilated. it's always by republicans. it's always by some maga extension of the republican party that another norm, something viewed as sacred is obliterated. in this case, a fight that impacted combat reainess. that's remarkable. thank you for spending the hour with us. claire sticks around. when we come back, it's election day in america. we'll look at what's driving americanss to the polls. the next hour starts after a very short break. don't go anywhere. don't go anywhere. meet the jennifers. each planning their future through the chase mobile app. hellooo new apartment. one bank for now. for later. for life. chase. make more of what's yours. your record label is taking off. but so is your sound engineer. you need to hire. i need indeed. indeed you do. indeed instant match instantly delivers quality candidates matching your job description. visit indeed.com/hire ien can't imagine also having to worry about if the government had been involved in that type of a decision when i was having conversations with my doctor about what needed to be done with my body. >> i recently purchased property in ohio. bills like this make me regret that. it's a great investment but it feels bad to be pouring money into a state that doesn't respect me as a woman. >> it's about freedom. how dare they try to take away the freedom of more than half of the state of ohio. this is not a thing that the government should be involved in. this is a personal decision that we should make about our health care. and it should be anyone else's opinion. >> it's now 5:00 in new york on election day in america, where voters in a handful of states will tell us a lot. and where our country stands ahead of the presidential contest. protecting abortion rights, which has been a galvanizing issue for democrats since roe was overturned. in fact, every time that abortion rights have been on the ballot since dobbs was decided is it has won. it's a question in front of the the voters in ohio, where the passage of issue one, would the abortion ban went into effect right after the supreme court's dobbs decision. it would allow abortions up to the point of evil liability. when the ban was in effect, we told you about a 10-year-old rape victim. she had to travel across state lines to indiana to get ab abortion because there were no exceptions in ohio for cases of rape or incest. ing indicates that issue one is expected to pass. a recent state poll find that 58% of likely voters in ohio were in favor of it which would mean the ranks of the half a dozen other states that have voted to affirm women's reproductive health care rights since roe was overturned. concerned about this trend earlier in the year, republicans in the state tried to subvert the role of people. they tried to change the rules. they attemed to change the rules of the game by increasing the threshold required for passing constitutional amendments. that move was rejected by voters as well. meanwhile, republicans in virginia are testing whether they can reframe the entire conversation about abortion. republican governor glenn youngkin has pledged to sign a 15-week limit refusing to call it what it is, which a 15-week ban on abortions in the state. ifment republicans take control of that state's legislature. in kentucky the democratic governor has campaigned heavily on access to abortion, health care rights as he fights to win reelection. women's reproductive health care on the ballot in our country is where we begin the hour with some of our favorite experts and friends. the president and ceo of reproductive freedom for all joins us. plus with me at the table is the host of fast politics podcast molly fax is here. and claire is still with us. i don't want to point you to any one state or contest, i want to ask you to take me around what you're watching today and tonight. >> thanks for that. starting with ohio, we're not taking anything for granted. there's an extensive disinformation campaign in the state led by governor and his party, lying what's on the ballot. putting really problematic language on the ballot. despite all of those efforts, we're seeing really good news. i was just on the phone with my organizers in ohio and all the major counties we're seeing really great turnout. we're seeing really great energy on the doors and we're feeling cautiously optimistic about ohio. given the a stakes, ohio is a red state. and this is a first time we're taking an affirmative measure in a red state. so odds were stacked against us because we're feeling good because the people in ohio as the interviews showed are really fighting for freedom there. we're also paying close attention to virginia. governor youngkin is and his messaging to try to shift a 15-week abortion ban to a so-called limit or compromise is dangerous. it has to be stopped in virginia right now. we can't let that messaging take hold across the country. we're very ax to see if andy could pull this off. we're also looking at pennsylvania where abortion could be on the line. but we have a lot of tough fights in other places as well. >> so sort of root this in the public's opinion about these issues. which always get that on election days to be legal in most or or some cases. these are the states that have voted in favor of abortion rights since dobbs. california, kansas, kentucky, michigan, montana and vermont. it would appear that the depiction of abortion is a divisive issue needs to be thrown out. it is not. it does not divide the american people. it does not divide people in red states from blue states. it doesn't even really based on the numbers divide generationally the way a lot of other things do. it seems to be uniting a whole lot of people more than the issue has ever been discussed as doipg. >> we have been working as a movement to make sure weren't eroding and losing abortion access, which is what led to the dobbs decision. but the dobbs decision really catalyzed where americans sat on abortion. it was really hard to message to americans while roe is the standard that this was a risk. but now that we have seen the horror stories from states with total bans and near bans, we now have educated the american people at what's at risk and also abortion has become the canary in the coal mine for what's at risk in our democracy. you have to remember the sentiment around abortion is hand and glove with the sentiment about fear of erosion of our democracy. >> this is really important. the ads have been powerful. a young girl was raped by her stepfather. his opponent favors a total ban. these are all legislative races. so people for the first time were going to see how powerful can this issue be when it is use ed as a messaging tool by candidates as opposed to the issue itself being on the ballot. we have not had that yet. both in kentucky and this is the kind of powerful message that should be used. >> i think when you're saying is so profound because we watch politicians get gummed up with these issues that don't breakthrough. i since i have been alive, the number has not been 85% that support legalized abortion rights in 8 5% of the time in some or all instances. that's extraordinary. that has nothing to do with anything a politician said or did. it has to do with the rights that the supreme court took away. >> they have using viability. in my state, i looked at polling and there's a lot of conversations going on right now about what should be put on the ballot next year. what will pass in missouri. it is a very conservative state. the majority of people in missouri think it should be illegal late term for sure. and there should be no taxpayer funding, which is hard for me because i think that's discriminatory against women. but it will be interesting to see if this viability is opposed to a leak passes by a huge margin. we'll be interesting to see what the margin is because it's viability and a set number of leaks, whereas youngkin has picked out 15 weeks for a reason. it's because it polls well. most people think it's reasonable. 15 weeks is a enough time for a woman to consider all of her options and make a decision. so we'll see. >> there's something that politicians get wrong over and over again. they get it wrong again even when voters try to send their message. the other piece is we now have a body of fd that eternal mortality is on the rise. it's a pathetic. if you focus right on those numbers, how dangerous it is to be pregnant in america, to be pregnant, poor, and black in america, it's a scandal. >> it is a scandal. and i have to say that these republicans who are youngkin is pushing this 15-week ban, the reality of the world post roe is what we're seeing is doctors afraid to treat. doctors who feel they can't treat these women, whatever week they are, because they are worried about losing their licenses. so actually, a 15-week ban doesn't necessarily solve ta problem. doctors come back with the fetus is no longer alive and they are sent home. we are in a country where that should not be the standard of care. and remember, there's a risk there we don't talk about. so i think women see not only that this is about freedom, but also this is about medical care. this is about being in a country where we get the best medicine or what's closest to the best. >> i know we have had a lot of conversations about amanda, who gave voice to this tragedy or this piece of the tragedy. amanda was pregnant with her daughter will low, have much a wanted pregnancy, but when that pregnancy became unviable, the way by she wanted, the pregnancy almost killed her. the stories are thot in the closet. the women have given voice to, have answered these nine questions. they have seen these stories. think these women. >> this is so important. this is why we have seen the public move to the number, which i agree is astonishing. 85% in all circumstances. this is important because folk understand that you could have a crisis in your pregnancy. it's past 15 weeks. this is the most egregious stories we have heard have been later-term pregnancies. so this shifts the whole conversation around is it six-week ban a compassionate compromise, 15 weeks? our argument in virginia has been clear. it's reasonable to put a ban on any of these procedures when you're not centering the patient. it's not compassionate. it's not reasonable. a ban is a ban. and these exceptions, while i get the political utility of them in any of the states, the exceptions actually effectively don't work. we see states where you have exceptions, and yet folks are still being turned away for medical care. that's really important for ed a vo indicates on my side to make sure americans understand and i think thr getting that message loud and clear, which is why you're seeing the public opinion shift so dramatically. >> your first answer was about voters seeing this issue as tied to democracy. and seeing this issue and being able the to wade through the disinformation. will you see a little more about both of those. >> ohio is such a beautiful example of what happened. you talked about it earlier. they tried. republicans knew that the polling was against them. they had a really hard shot at winning this. so thaw tried to change the rules. in august, an election at a time in an off year in an off month where they didn't really expect there to be a big turnout. ohioanss showed up to protect their democracy. they said we want the threshold to remain the threshold. they were trying to remember the threshold to get past the referendum passing in the state. so ohioans stood up for democracy in the state and understood it was about abortions. and that really has helped drive the energy and enthusiasm for this moment. but more broadly, since dobbs, we have seen story after story about a supreme court that's lost its credibility. a supreme court that's been compromised. we see americans unwilling to let anymore of their freedoms be dismabt theed by their court. our job is to shift sentiment to american sentiment for democracy and frr democrats to uphold those values and freedoms. >> if clarence thomas said you want to spend more time in my rv with my friend tomorrow and went away, and if this the supreme court said come over and look at all my transactions, and if the supreme court tomorrow went beyond every ethics expert's relations, it could not repair the damage done to it in the mind of the american people quickly enough to save republicans' rear ends. the supreme court has fallen in terms of public deemed farther and fast than any civic life. it has dropped farther than congress, than the republican party, than any individual named politician. and i wonder how much this feeling that the supreme court is accountable to no one also a accrues to democrats' benefit the epa trying to limit the clean water act, they are really out on a limb. and they also have these ethics issues you can hear the beep, beep, beep. somehow we had to back to the republican and see what they played as related to women in domestic violence. they are property. this is really a problem. they say government should have nothing to say about somebody who has tried to harm his spouse or his girlfriend and shot off guns and cleared danger. by the way, we're going to put and republicans that are kind of into no government get that part. that's where these things are voting for abortion rights, they don't like in control of anything, much of let's of what goes on in the bedroom. >> the new speaker of the house. >> i have to agree. mike johnson is such a fascinating choice for the republican caucus. >> it gives us a the lot of options for 2024 to draw a clear contrast and finish the job of taking back the house, holding the senate and winning the white house. so we can have what we need to codify at the federal level. this is what this is all leading into. >> i adopt know what you have planned for tomorrow between 1k34k 6:00, but save us a time slot to see where we are at this point tomorrow. thank you for spending time with us today. everyone else sticks around. when we come back, our first exit poll with a focus on what we're talking about. what ohio voters are thinking as they go to the polls to cast ballots on the referendum to enshrine abortion rights into the constitution. steve kornacki will be here at the big board, after a short break. later in the hour, we'll turn to the middle east, where israeli prime minister benjamin netanyahu now says he's open to short periodic pauses in the israeli military operation against hamas. we'll get a live report from our correspondent in tel aviv, and we'll also check in with our dear friend for the mood and the dialics as ukrainians lo to keep the attention on their struggle and their fight and their war for their own freedoms against russian's brutal invasion. more after a quick break. don't go anywhere. invasion. more after a quick break don't go anywhere. ♪(uplifting music)♪ ♪nothing is everything♪ i'm celebrating my clearer skin... my way. with skyrizi, 3 out of 4 people achieved 90% clearer skin at 4 months. in another study, most people had 90% clearer skin, even at 5 years. and skyrizi is just 4 doses a year, after 2 starter doses. serious allergic reactions and an increased risk of infections or a lower ability to fight them may occur. tell your doctor if you have an infection or symptoms, had a vaccine, or plan to. thanks to clearer skin with skyrizi - this is my moment. there's nothing on my skin and that means everything! ♪nothing is everything♪ now's the time. ask your doctor about skyrizi, the #1 dermatologist-prescribed biologic in psoriasis. learn 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( ♪♪ ) constant contact. helping the small stand tall. c'mon, we're right there. c'mon baby. constant contact. it's the only we need. go, go, go, go! ah! touchdown baby! -touchdown! are your neighbors watching the same game? yeah, my 5g home internet delays the game a bit. but you get used to it. try these. they're noise cancelling earmuffs. i stole them from an airport. it's always something with you, man. great! solid! -greek salad? exactly! don't delay the game with verizon or t-mobile 5g home internet. catch it on the xfinity 10g network. with polls closing in the east a few hours, we're getting our first indications in the quay races we have been watching, including exit polling from the ballot initiative in ohio we have been talking about that will determine abortion access in the state. let's bring in the man of the whole night, national political correspondent steve kornacki is at the big board. steve, what do are you watching? >> it was a test. that went down in flames. a lot of people have been wondering was that a proxy vote. that's one thing we are look sfrg here in ohio as the night goes on and the returns come in, that's what we're going to be doing. as the county returns come in, we'll show how the counties voted on that august vote. we'll compare it to tonight. and is there a gap that develops between them. that will tell us if we're headed towards any kind of a different outcome. so we do have ohio is a state we'll have an exit poll. specifically on this question of abortion. we're getting our first wave of data from ohio. polls are still open. so we're a little limited in what we can show you from that, but let me show you what we can in terms of our preliminary. i stress preliminary look at the exit the polling. so start with this. this is a boys line question. this is a state that donald trump carried both times. he beat biden by 8 points here in 2020. so what's biden's job approval. who came out today, 41 approve, 57 disapprove. that's overall the kind of electorate we're talking about here. let's get to more questions when it comes to the issue of abortion. take a look here. let's see if we can glet that one called up here. the supreme court decision to overroe. this in our first wave of the exit poll, 39 rs% said it made them angry. 29% were dissatisfied. that means a 60% were either angry or dissatisfied with a supreme court decision. 18% said they were enthusiastic. 17% said they were satisied. so that is the baseline gap on attitude among this electorate toward overturning roe v. wade. i can show you a couple other numbers. i think we're looking here at by party at attitudes towards abortion. let's take a look here. this is democrats and they are voters today. 93% said their basic attitude is should be legal. they said should be illegal. 93 among democrats. how about among republicans. let's call that one up. what are their basic attitudes. the legal stts of abortion. what do they think it should be. take a look at republicans said. see if we get that one called up. there's almost unanimity among republicans in our exit poll. 72% say it should be illegal. but a quarter of 25% say it should be legal. if you have a bit of a gap there, we have a couple other questions that are interesting to look at. that we asked voters in this instance. this is bigger picture. but we're talking about a state of ohio. it used to be a swing state. now it's more of a red state. but some attitudes heading into 2024. we asked this should donald trump be running for president in 2024. two-thirds almost said no donald trump should not be running for president. they carried by 8 points last time around on thursday. 34% said yes. we turned around and said, okay. should "morning joe" be running for president in 2024. he had that 42% approval rating. here only a quarter of 26% of ohioans saying in the polls that joe biden should be running for reelection. 72% say he should not be running for reelection. we have a state where oe biden is not popular. they trended republican in the last two elections heavily. but a state that is sending signals that it's i dis satisfied but it's not enthusiastic about that prospect of a biden/trump rematch. again, this is our first wave. polls are still 0e7. we'll learn more when they close and the results start to come in. but that's your first look. >> let me ask you something. the 60% that don't approve overturning roe. how does that track with the final tallies in kansas and other places where the red states with red state views on policy. rejected efforts to limit access to abortion and health care. >> so we didn't have an exit poll there we could fell you the actual number. but in kansas, what was on the ballot, this was the sum after the supreme court decision. kansas was the first state where this issue is on the ballot in the post roe environment. and it was abortion opponents who got it on the ballot and basically would have said that the they were asking voters to approve the state constitution in kansas is not provide for a legal right to abortion. which could have opened the door then to a republican legislature passing restrictions, bans, what it might be on abortion. this is kansas, a much redder state than ohio. it went down 57 to 43 in kansas. a similar ballot initiative was on the ballot in kentucky. coup voted for donald trump by 26 points. that lost in kentucky. and it's notable, we're not going to have an exit poll out of kentucky tonight, butt governor's race, ann duh beshear, the democrat running for reelection against the republican challenger, beshear, the democrat in kentucky has tried to make abortion an issue in the campaign. he sees the message as a winning message basically saying that, hey, daniel cameron is going to be far too restrictive on abortion. that's the message from the beshear campaign. and it's in ads making that case on his behalf. so he sees the idea of saying my opponent is the candidate of severe extreme limits on abortion. you don't want that. he sees that as a winning message in kentucky because he's been affirmatively bringing it up, paying money to get that message on the air waves. that will be a very interesting test there. kentucky is a state that rejected narrowly, but rejected a year ago the proposition that the state constitution did not provide for a legal right to abortion. >> this is interesting. abortion is a plus 20 issue in ohio. that's an electorate that is 20% more of the electorate than supports joe biden opposes. >> there's no question that this really is now they don't know what to do with it. republicans rather than realizing it, and trying to find middle ground. and trying to monitor women's period track etc. and sending people to try to get records in states where the abortion is legal to try to prove people across state lines. they are going further and further and it's going to get them in trouble. and what level of financing has there been on this issue? has this been wall to wall, social media ads in ohio and has this issue been that prominent in virginia? have they put paid ads behind this 15-week ban that youngkin is proposing in virginia? i know beshear has spent a lot of money pushing the message of extremism around abortion. is it true in the other states too? >> it's interesting. in virginia, this is the virginia, it's state legislative elections. is youngkin trying to get control of both houses of the legislature and saying that if he does, what he is prepared to move on his abortion legal until 15 weeks, and then only in the case of rape, incest and danger to a mother's life. he thinks in this post roe environment, that is sort of the moderate stance that republicans can run on and can be exportable to other states. so tonight is sort of a test of that. it's a governor previously identified sort of as pro life, i think reading the political climate that we have seen since roe vflt wade was take down saying, okay, let's move to 15 weeks and see if that's the position that republicans can run on. that's part of what is being tested in virginia. it's interesting because democrats, both parties support a fortune into the virginia races. you're talking about state legislative races, and you're seeing $2 million spent by one candidate in one race. these are unheard of sums of money for state legislative races, but the democrats have focused a lot more of that money and a lot more of their messaging on abortion in virginia than the republicans have. but i to think it's notable here to compare virginia and ohio in terms of where this issue is going in the future. because it was the sort of anti-abortion side in virginia that's moved that youngkin is trying to move to say it's allowable up to 15 weeks. his idea of the cob session needs to be made politically. in ohio, it does put -- it does put in the state constitution a right to an abortion, but the concession it makes is it can be banned after 22 or 24 weeks. the point of fetal viability. we haven't seen that in other states. it's interesting putting that in language in ohio. i thus you're going to see it in a lot of swing states. >> is steve kornacki, the night is so young for you. we wish you caffeine and hydration and bathroom breaks. we'll be riveted by you all night long. thank you very much. thank you for being here. we need to button this tomorrow. so you'll be horror with me. >> not tonight. >> tweet out your schedule. i get questioned all the time. we're here. a public service aa announce the. we'll get serious again. it has been exactly one month since the horrific hamas terrorist attack on civilians took place. their new developments to tell you about today in the military operation against hamas. we'll get to all of that in a live report after a quick break. don't go anywhere. eport after a. don't go anywhere. we all know that words have power. they set things in motion and make us happy or sad. but there's one word that stands out, 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surrounded and they say they have isolated the northern half of the gaza strip in their search and destroy mission for hamas terrorists and terrorist infrastructure. the state department says 400 americans saws that more were expected to leaf. >> today marks the end of the 30-day mourning period, a jewish tradition. while the official mourning may be over here in israel following the horrific october 7th attacks, the grieving process is really all it had been a attacked on october 7th planting israeli flgs in defiance. one volunteer telling me that doing this act of defiance made him feel more secure because it was showing the world, he said, that he feels safe in israel. the fact of the matter is so many israelis do not feel safe here given the war underway. i was speaking to a couple that survived the october 7th attacks barricaded in their bedroom as hamas stormed their kibbutz, killing their neighbors. they told me they are too afraid to go back. they will not go back home unless hamas is removed from power. it's this viewpoint that is informing the israeli government's decisions why we're seeing this sort of hardened viewpoint on the part of the israeli prime minister taking that cease-fire off the table unless all hostages are removed. something is at odds with the white house. the white house continues to press for this humanitarian pause in order to allow some relief there in gaza for the pal stint yan civilians. but it seems that there is a bridge between what the israeli government wants and what the white house wants on more than one issue. >> it seems in the early days this everyone that we talk to knew someone who had lost someone in the terrorist attack. now it seems that everyone has someone serving on the front lines and this is now a country at war. but it still has complicated feelings about its own government. can you speak to the mood of the people? >> many israelis are absolutely outraged at the government's response, not only at the fact that this happened, that hamas terrorists were able to come over the border from gaza to storm the kibbutzes, to kill israelis, but they are also furious at the government's response in the wake of that attack. the lack of the basic services, the lack of understanding of the overall situation, the fact that so many of these families are still in the dark in terms of where their loved ones ar the hostages in gaza, what that process is going to look like going forward. people here are absolutely furious, which is why the israeli government really is on thin ice when it comes to the war, when it comes to this issue. so it's hard. i spoke to one man who used to be a passes vitz, but now he believes in the war. it helps to explain why the israeli government is really going so hard on gaza at this point. >> erbe mclaughlin, thank you for stay ugh for us. when we come back, with so much of the world's attention here focused on the events in the middle east, the people of ukraine remain in an existential fight for their existence in the war against russia. our dear friend will be our guest to tell us everything happening in kyiv, a after a short break. don't no anywhere. short break. don't no anywhere. hi, my name is damion clark. if you have both medicare and medicaid, i have some really encouraging news that you'll definitely want to hear. depending on the plans available in your area, you may be eligible to get extra benefits with a humana medicare advantage dual-eligible special needs plan. all of these plans include a healthy options allowance, a monthly allowance to help pay for eligible groceries, utilities, rent, and over-the-counter items. the healthy options allowance is loaded onto a prepaid card each month. and whatever you don't spend, carries over from each month. other benefits on these plans include free rides to and from your medical appointments. and our large networks of doctors, hospitals and pharmacies. so, call the number on your screen now and ask about a humana medicare advantage dual-eligible special needs plan. humana. a more human way to healthcare. what was it like before viasat satellite internet? two words: not fun. times up. sharing's caring! but now with viasat's new plans, we have plenty of internet. for everyone! learn more about our plans at viasat.com [city ambience sounds] [car screech] [car door slam] [camera shutter sfx] introducing ned's plaque psoriasis. 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[ting] ♪♪ live in the moment. ask your doctor about otezla. one month into the israel-hamas war and we must not lose sight of what is still happening in ukraine. the hot war, away has been happening for more than 20 months since russia began its full-scale invasion there. in "the new york times" today, ukrainian writer writes a powerful honest piece about the battle for the world's attention. i try once again to persuade readers that they should not look away from my homeland's struggle for survival. even as another part of the world is erupting an unspeakable violence. but the words won't come. i refuse to compete for attention. ukraiians fight in full knowledge that no compromise of evil will contain it. this is the truth that our allies need to contemplate, absorb and act upon without having to be reminded of it. let's bring in our dear friend, former at vierz to president in. i want to know what you think of that, but i want to first ask how you're doing. >> doing well. i have a bit of a cold, so i apologize for my voice. we have been okay. it was relatively quiet in kyiv for two months but we're not get our hopes up for the winter. everyone's expecting massive strikes, blackouts. for us, the war is not even on pause in kyiv, and heavy fighting is going on on the front lines so. the war hasn't gone away just because of another war erupting in israel. >> so much of our shared conversations and connection -- i know it might be real for you -- is knowing and seeing what life might be like for and your family and i think watching your leader, your president command the world's attention and rally the world to ukraine's side in this fight against russia. just bluntly, what happens when that goes away, when our attention zooms somewhere else? >> well, first of all i need to make a very important point. you said it's one month since the attack on israel. that happened october 7th. you know what else happened october 7th, putin's birthday. parts of the hamas terror groups have been trained by the wagner mercenaries fighting in ukraine. north korea is providing munitions for iraq to fight in ukraine. the point i'm trying to make here, these are not separate wars. i would probably even classify it as a hybrid version of world war iii, and it's already happening. just prisoning these are two separate wars that will gather -- get this civilized world nowhere. we need to support each other in that, hence my t-shirt. >> i want to see the whole thing. you may have to give us a better view. i see. this is right, and i think this is how u.s. national security experts see it as well, that iran -- iranian-backed hezbollah and their loose affiliation, association with hamas that aims to destroy israel and hamas and russia providing drones that are being used in your country on civilians the common link. you are one of the best sort of messages and communicators. where are we coming up short in sort of articulating those sort of acts of alliances? >> well, to be honest, i think the real problem here is -- the real victim of this hybrid world war iii is not ukraine, it's not even israel. it's first and foremost the united states, because you have an election year coming up, and to be honest, if you allow yourself to be this divided, if you allow yourself certain radical politicians to plan hatred, to divide israel and ukraine, there will be another country they'll divide and conquer as much as they need to to distract you from the end goal. i would say, to be honest, pearl harbor in a sense already happened. it's just a hybrid pearl harbor, and your society is being divided as we speak. if you allow yourselves to be distracted and be divided, you're going to lose this war without firing a single shot. >> i think you understand our politics as well as anybody here. what are your thoughts about the debates that rage and about cleaving off aid from ukraine for aid for israel? >> to be honest, i'm not surprised at all, because a number of politicians, a number of tv personalities throughout have been kind of trying to push that effort since, like, a year ago, more than a year ago. so to be honest, i'm not surprised at all, but i'm definitely worried that people are falling for it, because what's going to happen, you're going take away the ukrainian aid and russia wins. then they're going to start another conflict. by them i mean russia, iran, north korea, and everyone else, and distract your attention from israel. so, you know, the terrorists win there. and so on and so forth, until you divide it enough to be conquered. and it's not going to be, you know, a land invasion. they're just going to divide your society and conquer your politics, then change your constitution, whatever. this is a war against the united states. >> igor, tell me what life is like in kyiv right now. you told me earlier it was an indian summer. >> it is an indian summer and, that's one of the reasons we're not getting bombed just yet, because russia is saving up on missiles and waiting for the cold weather to arrive, but because of climate change, there's only -- one benefit of climate change, and that the fact that it's mid november but still 15 centigrade and obviously there's no point in bombing our critical infrastructure just yet. >> igor, that you haven't lost your sense of humor, that you haven't lost your patience with us is something we'll be grateful for. good to see you. we won't let this much time pass before our next conversation. thank you for joining us today. quick break for us. we'll be right back. we'll be ri. and here. not so much here. farxiga reduces the risk of kidney failure which can lead to dialysis. ♪far-xi-ga♪ farxiga can cause serious side effects, including ketoacidosis that may be fatal, dehydration, urinary tract or genital yeast infections, and low blood sugar. a rare, life-threatening bacterial infection in the skin of the perineum could occur. stop taking farxiga and call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of this infection, an allergic reaction, or ketoacidosis. when you have chronic kidney disease, it's time to ask your doctor for farxiga. because there are places you want to be. if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help. ♪far-xi-ga♪ (carolers) ♪ iphone 15 pro for your husband! iphone 15 pro — ♪ (wife) carolers! to tell me you want a new iphone? 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(inspirational music) today the supreme court heard oral arguments in a case that could further strip away protections against gun violence. the case involves a law that says that someone who is subject to a domestic violence restraining order cannot own firearms, with broad implications for the government's liability. during aments, the justices seemed inclined to uphold the law. justice elena kagan savaging the lawyer against it saying the imposition of your argument have are so untenable that you have to say no, that's not my argument. it's obvious you don't give guns to people who have the history of domestic violence your client has. i'm asking to you clarify your argument because you seem to be run away from it because you can't stand what the consequences of it are. the court will issue a decision on this this summer. thanks to let us into your hopes. "the beat" with ari melber starts right now. >> thanks so much. i'm ari melber. welcome to "the beat."

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