Transcripts For MSNBCW The 20240702

lawrence. good evening, ali. >> good moving, alex, thank you, and we should talk next week, have a good weekend. >> sure. well ek have a>> a washington d.c. appes court issued a stay on a gag order placed on donald trump in the 2020 election case brought by special counsel jack smith. a three judge panel made up of two trump appointees and a biden appointee scheduled oral arguments on a gag order on november 20th. until then, trump remains free to her verbal attacks against the special counsel and a. federal judge tanya chutkan found that the gag order is necessary because trump's verbal attack on witnesses and others could inspire violence from his supporters, which is exactly what happened on january six. we are so accustomed to following the day-to-day legal action in trump's constant unhinged social media grants about being persecuted by the justice system and biden administration, that we have become numb to just how abnormal this really is. ranting by fringe characters is normal in politics. donald trump is not a fringe character. he's a former president at the united states, a current front runner for the republican nomination, and he is trying to de-fake the country or at least a majority of 2020 voters to believe that an event that we all watched on live tv, his effort to steal the 2020 election and stay in power, did not have been. today, there is new reporting about the location that trump chose to kick off his 2024 campaign, waco, texas. waco, of course, is where a stand up between federal agents and a cult called the branch davidians, can't to a tragic and, when cold member set fire to a building, rather than surrender to the fbi. reporter jonathan karl writes in the atlantic, shortly after the rally was announced, i asked steve bannon, who served as the ceo of trump's 2016 campaign and once again emerged as one of trump's most important advisers, why did president would go to waco for his big campaign reboot? he was not coy. quote, we are the trump the vineyards, he told me, with a laugh. and here is how one trum supporter in texas understood trump's choice, let's call it, of waco. trump is making a statement, i believe, by coming to the stumping grounds, where the federal government and fbi late seats at the community, just like a late seat on mar-a-lago and went in and focused stuff. charles pace, a branch dividend ian pastor, who left the compound several years before the deadly fire, told the texas tribune. certainly before the waco kickoff rally, trump tried out what is alarming, even for his 2024 campaign lead. >> i am your retribution. >> now, that phrase, amour retribution, it's not a coincidence. jonathan carl reports that when i spoke with bannon a few days later he would not stop touting trump's performance referring to it as his quote come retribution speech. what i did not realize was that come retribution, according to civil war historians, served as the code words for the confederate secret service spot to take hostage and eventually assassinate president abraham lincoln. today, the former trump appointee, federico cline, was sentenced to more than five years in federal prison for assaulting capitol police officers on january six. the trump appointed judge who sentenced him said he was disturbed that klein who worked in the state department considered it his duty to go to trump's rally to join to protesters at the capitol the trump supporter who ripped the gas mask off capitol police officer daniel hodges in one of the most harrowing january six videos, was sentenced to more than several years in federal prison. meanwhile, two states are currently weighing whether donald trump is disqualified from appearing on the 2024 ballot, under the insurrection closs, the 14th amendment of the constitution, section three. and last night, donald trump, once again, took to the stage at a rally, two songs that were some bad criminals, who attacked the capital, where he said. >> i call them the j six hostages, not prisoners. >> joining us now is ryan reilly, justice reporter for nbc news. he is the author of the new book, sedition hunters, out january 6th broke the justice system. as well as ruth ben-ghiat, a history professor at nyu and author of strongmen, mussolini to the president. welcome to both of you, thank you for being with us. ryan, my good friend, i have been waiting for a long time to talk to you about your important book and all the work that you have done. but big developments today, this week in terms of the sentencing of the january six participants. where are we on this? >> right now, we're at the point where there are 1100 people arrested, but the scope of people that could be arrested as more than 3000. will not get to that number based on the statute of limitations that expires in two years, now because we are three years into the statute of limitations. these cases need to take a little bit of a kick in the pants. i think that is something that the online sleuths have been focusing on, pressuring the fbi to bring more cases forward, because there are dozens of people who have been identified, who have still not yet be been arrested, including violent offenders. recent arrests this week, but they say the pace has to pick up in order to get to all of the individuals who have committed violent, awful acts on january six, still not yet have been arrested. they are kicking away at this today. >> ruth, give historical context on this, because when we look at people in the past who had to fight democracy, what is the relevance of these people that ryan has been judiciously reporting on the last couple of years, being arrested, charged and convicted, while donald trump has still not been convicted? >> yeah, any accountability is a very important, but as you know, ali, i do see trump as not just an authoritarian but a cult leader, and january six was a cult leader rescue operation. he called out to them to stress to save him, and they came. and so, until the cold leader, his power is deflated, or he's banned from politics, which is what they did to bolsonaro, after his insurrection, the danger remains. >> ryan, let's talk about federico klein. he was a state appointee. this is part of the problem that ruth is talking about. there are people who were even within the government, a lot of these people who have been arrested, that you reported, on who are outsiders. they were fodder for donald trump, and they have set so much in court, but then you've got people, all the way from john eastman down to this guy, who worked for the government. they were inside the government, and they thought it in some sense, it was their responsibility to try to fix whatever was broken and the 2024 election? >> i think the sort of give away in this case is that federal clouded not speak during his sentencing. what that tells me, based on trying to question him afterwards about what she thought of the sentencing, whether he thought that the january six, rather, whether he's thought to be the election was stolen, whether he had regrets about january six, and he declined to answer any one of those questions. seems to me that he still believes the election was stolen, and that is why his lawyer was not a great idea for him to speak in court, and the judge found that there was no evidence of remorse in his case. i think that is illustrative. it's interesting when you have these cases, when they ultimately get to the sentencing point, to hear from the defendants about what they actually believe. a lot of them are realizing, i got fooled and tricked. i fell for this online garbage and what donald trump stymie about the 2023 election, but there are plenty of defendants who still in the heart believed that he, and the reason and logic won't get to them. that is where they see their role, as, okay, the reason why they won breakthrough, they're not convinced people that the election was not stolen, and convince them that they were sort of calmed and the situation. we have to make sure that there will be consequences for individuals who choose to violate the law to bring forward and tried to bring about this, overturn the election based upon misinformation that they read on the internet. >> so, ruth, historical context there, some of these people come out, and they are remorseful and crying. we have heard from their families about how they were misguided, and they went down these rabbit holes, but there are some who are not. how does this play out, because there are a whole bunch of people who believe that they too are martyrs for the cause. donald trump likes to speak with himself as a martyr and some ice, but there are people who still think that there are is a cause to be moderate for. >> that's right, and it is very disturbing, his whole conversion narrative of january six with these thugs who attacked the capital, being now political prisoners. by the way, when he came off his presidential campaign in waco, he already started talking about them as political prisoners, and he introduced this idea of january six choir. that has a kind of church like association, so it makes it people into positive figures into kind of the trump liturgy. all of this is very fascists. it reminds me after the march on room in 1922 in italy, those who were harmed or imprisoned, they were called murder, and it was a whole liturgy that came up around the people. the message is that the insurrectionists are continuing, and these people are the heroes, and that is dangerous for our democracy. >> ryan, you and i were together. time -- you gave me a copy of the book, and i have been dying to ask you since then, as you follow this so closely and see every one of these trials or, at least most of them. what is your takeaway right now? where are we in this process of these people, who as you say, some fell into the rabbit hole, and some are still believers. where are we in the pursuit of justice, because we're coming up on the next election? >> yeah, obviously, if donald trump is elected, this is all out the window. a lot of cases will be dismissed, and a lot of people who go free, because there are 1000 people who have been identified right now who have not yet been arrested. he can bring cases against him tomorrow, the system cannot handle that. you gotta spread it out over the next two years, it's the approach that they need to take. there are people who really violently assaulted officers, who have already been identified, not yet been charged, and they have that to your timeline to get this done, but i think big picture-wise, it really as brought up deeper issues within the fbi, especially when it comes to open source intelligence and how they are looking at all of these things. it was a massive failure before january six, and they are not necessarily doing everything they can at this point to bring these cases forward. they've had big success, some conspiracy trials, were really historic, but there are a number of people, thugs, who really assaulted offices that they, who have not yet been held accountable for their actions. >> ryan, it's an important book. it will be the cannon of our dark time in history. thank you for the work that you put into it. ryan riley, the new book is sedition and theirs. ruth ben-ghiat, as always, thank you for the analysis. ruth ben-ghiat is a professor at nyu. all right, we'll take a quick break. when we come back, we'll continue with the latest on donald trump's fraud trial. we got gag order news in that civil fraud trial, which is proving to be -- of another donald trump mid, donald trump billionaire creation story, stay with us. ry, stay with us 12 hours!! not coughing? 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[ cheers ] yeah! woho! running up and down that field looks tough. it's a pitch. get way more into what you're into >> welcome back, we have gag when you stream on the xfinity 10g network. order nuisance the trump civil fraud trial, which is proving to be a demonstration of another trump mid, the trump billionaire creation story. in trump's civil fraud trial in new york, not only does the former president asked to abide by a gag order, but now, so do his attorneys. this follows just a day seated exchange between justice arthur engoron, and trump lawyers over a comment that one of trump's attorneys had made about the judges clerk, the same clerk that trump had been barred from speaking about, and just like their client, the attorneys are now barred from making comments about the clerk, with the judge writing that, quote, failure to abide by this directive shout result in serious sanctions. eric trump finished his testimony today, and that is trump's scheduled to take the senate on monday, where he will be grilled by the same prosecutors that he made attacks from behind the protective screen of his social media account. joining us now is adam klasfeld, a senior legal correspondent for the messenger. he was in the courtroom for today's proceedings. adam, this is one of those cases that a lot of people were not paying attention to. this is not one of the big ones that everybody thought would take down donald trump, but between the prosecution, the attorney general of new york and the judge in this case, it's another be an interesting case. >> absolutely, and someone paying close attention from the start was, of course, donald trump. i have seen donald trump at his arraignments. i've seen him a civil court. and as i believe i sit on the show before, he was unhappier in civil court, because this goes to his legacy, his origin story, as you noted, ali. it has proven to be an important case, a case with many linkages to the other legal trials that he is facing in criminal court. we saw that when michael cohen testified, and two of trump's criminal defense attorneys in the hush money case were there to witness that. they were clearly doing their research. the lead attorney for trump in this case is christopher hice. he, of course, is one of the attorneys within the classified documents case. we're seeing some of the same patterns that we have seen in the criminal cases play out. and the gag order that you just introduced the segment with, it could be seen as an effort to undermine proceedings. at heart, they are accusing the judges clerk of bias in a kind of indirect way to discredit the proceedings more broadly. trump has attacked the judge. trump has attacked the clerk. it's the same a.g., this in pattern that we see play out and the january 6th place. it's partly the reason why that the gag order issued in this case was such a bell weather, because it was this case that first broke that it was the first gag order ever issued, and then the one in d.c. followed up. >> i got the puck side illegal part for a second, because the fundamentals of this case have largely been deterred. the stuff to come is having to do with the penalties. and some other legal matters. there's something about the case that is getting under donald trump skin, and it could be one of a few things. you mention michael cohen, it was the first time that they had seen each other face to face since michael cohen's legal trials. there is fish main, who doesn't really dislikes. and there is the judge, arthur engoron, who seems to be taking no -- from trump and as attorney. something is bothering donald trump. he stormed out of the courtroom the other day. what is it that is getting under his skin about this case specifically? >> it's as he said at the beginning of the segment, ali, this goes to his origin story, to the story of his wealth. he has railed on social media, on his platform truth social about his assets were wildly inflated to the tunes of billions over two years. his network was even higher, he claims, but evidence is kept brought the court undermining the assertions. you see the evaluations brought into evidence, every single property is coming under a microscope, and his former accountants are taking the stand, former executives are taking the stand. every member of his family is taking the stand. that is what makes this case extremely frustrating to trump. as he pointed out, ali, at the beginning of the segment, we have started this trial with a major -- known as a corporate death penalty. if he does not overturn it on appeal, his new york business empire will be dissolved. it will go into a receivership, and now, the stakes remain high. the stakes are, will he, his children and two of his close business associates be forever barred from doing business in new york state, and will they have to pay up to hundreds of millions of dollars in discouragement. it's a serious case, even though it's civil. >> adam, thank you as always for your great analysis and a reporting. adam klasfeld. coming up, the latest job report is, quote, as good as it gets. find out who said that, and find out how good the economy is really doing. that is next. s next makers of the world's comfiest wireless bras. for revolutionary support without underwires, and sizes up to a g-cup, find your new favorite bra today at knix.com take a moment to pause and ask, why did you get vaccinated against pneumococcal pneumonia? 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customize and save with liberty bibberty. he doesn't even have a mustache. only pay for what you need. ♪ liberty. liberty. liberty. liberty. ♪ are you still struggling with your bra? it's time for you to try knix. makers of the world's comfiest wireless bras. for revolutionary support without underwires, and sizes up to a g-cup, find your new favorite bra today at knix.com >> wow, what a great week for ♪♪ no. ♪♪ -no. -nuh-uh. ♪♪ yeah. oh. yes. ♪♪ oh yeah. yes. isn't this great? yeeaahhhh!! ♪♪ yeah, i could do a cartwheel in here. oh hey! would you like to join us? no. we would love to join you. ♪♪ the economy. the october jobs report was as good as it gets, that is a quote, not my words, not even joe biden's words. that is the assessment of moody's chief economist, mark zandi, whose previous job included being economic adviser for john mccain's campaign during the great recession. 150,000 jobs were added last month on the heels of a nearly 5% jump in economic growth. here is president biden's economic takeaway. quote, it shows that bidenomics is growing the economy from the middle out and the bottom up, not the top down, and quote. the president started the week celebrating the landmark victory with the striking united auto workers union one with its tentative contract deal, with general motors, ford and stellantis. >> it's a critical piece of work or power and showing our collective bargaining works. workers seized the table to honor their contributions to their employers success. by securing pay and benefits that can raise a family on and retire with dignity and respect. >> now, you'll recall that back in september, president biden became the first sitting president to join a picket line, when he joined the striking autoworkers. just one day later, donald trump spoke to workers at a non-union auto worker parts factory in michigan, with the uplifting message that the uaw strike was useless, because, quote your job is only going to be for two or three years, and quote. and that the uaw president, shawn fain, is quote, not doing a good job. shawn fain and the united auto workers won 25% wage increases for their workers. cnbc reports the race and benefits such as cost of living adjustments accumulatively raised the top wage to more than $42 an hour, including an increase of 70% for starting wages, to over $30 an hour. chrysler worker tenisha hodges told a new york times that the union deal will be a changing for her. she was making roughly $16 an hour in pretax income, as a so-called temp worker, though she often worked six days a week. quote, i still have to work amazon flex doing deliveries two or three days out of the week, missile just set. under a tentative contract agreement negotiated by the united auto workers, temporary employees like massages will be allowed to gain permanent status, after 90 days, and can't rise to the top with the wage scale in just two years. for miss hodges, that could mean a jump to over $40 an hour and pay, and quote. it puts me in a position where i can afford to drive a vehicle for the company that i work for. that is a very proud thing for me. joining us now is gene sperling, a senior adviser to the president. jeanne, good to see you, thank you for joining us. donald trump quote, i don't really understand why during the strike you went to a non-union shop it, defies logic, where he said it's pointless and does not work. i remember talking to shawn fain about this, and i remember the uaw strike before that where they asked for the large wage increases because they said, your companies are profitable, your ceos take these similar wage hikes, why can't we the workers get them? and people thought it was ridiculous, and then the uaw got their contract, and then before, that u.p.s. teamsters got their contract. with the make of this? >> well, i think it's interesting when you look at this historic victory by the united auto workers. it's interesting to see how much it refutes virtually every single argument from the conservative wing, the most conservative wing of the republican party. first of all, ali, it's hard to understand what the strategy was. seems to me that he should go back to the trump years, where we sit on the sidelines and let china eat our lunch on the electric vehicles of the future. if you try issued president biden has, is going to be bad for everyone. let's look at what happened. wages are going down, went up, as he said, 25%, well over 30% with inflation protections, more in the next four and a half years than the previous 22 years combined. instead of investment going down, we are seeing the big three announced a disagreement over 30 billion in new investment products, plants, factories, jobs and job security instead of being more at risk, you see almost complete job security for all 150,000 uaw workers. and the last point, i had to come back to what the president said in the spot you aired, when he said, when the union does well, everyone does well. that seems like a nice line, but just this week, a few weeks after, toyota waged -- raised wages, 9%, and put the time that you get to the topper injustice -- in half. if you want clear evidence that when unions do, will they truly build the middle class, you have it. i don't know what the conservative argument is, the biden strategy to have it auto feature made in america now. >> jeanne, let's talk about other things going on and economy. we still have a low unemployment rate, which does contribute to higher wages, which guys like you and me thinks works out overtime, that prices will be higher because there are places that paid more for labor, but we're all earning more as a result of that. it should even. now where do you think that we are in terms of inflation as it relates to unemployment? >> listen, i think what these three years are showing is that the biden strategy of investing in people and doing so in a strong and sustained way pace off. what is it doing, when you get everybody working, it gives a resilience to the economy, gives a bit of spending power to the economy, that helps us survive, even the bumps in the road, like the variants from the pandemic, or the war, it reduces the amount of pain from long term unemployment, but look at the benefits that we are seeing. i just have to mention, 21 months in a row, under 4% unemployment, that has happened in over 50 years. the jobs, i mean, ali, you and i did a lot of shows before i went back into office time. if i told you there independent mick that 70% interest loans in the first term, there whatever covered all the lost jobs from depend them up and added four and a half million. i'll give you one stat to. all of this is happening while the inflation measure that the federal reserve looks at the most, which is called core pce, has been on a two and a half percent the last few months. think of this, in the g7 countries, europe, japan, united states, and the g7 countries, the in that estates now has the highest growth and the lowest inflation at the same time. i know people are still struggling and hurting from the pandemic, and that there was global inflation that we did not escape, so i understand people are still frustrated and hurting, but when you look at the numbers, you have to conclude that the biden investment in america strategy really have proven to show, give the economy significant resilience and has made a stronger than any of our competitors. >> jeanne, i want to have more of a conversation with you, so we'll have the schedule more time. there are a lot of things that we need to talk about in the economy, it's good to see you, my friend, thank you. >> thank you for having us. >> gene sperling is a senior adviser to president biden. coming up, secretary of state anthony blinken brought frank advice to prime minister benjamin netanyahu in israel today, i think that toll in gaza rises. will netanyahu be moot by america, can he be moved? and one of the 1990 dream of a two-state solution? a top two ronen bergman, an expert and commentator on israeli politics and history when we come back. e come back. ...there are places you'd like to be. like here. and here. not so much here. farxiga reduces the risk of kidney failure which can lead to dialysis. ♪far-xi-ga♪ farxiga can cause serious side effects, including ketoacidosis that may be fatal, dehydration, urinary tract or genital yeast infections, and low blood sugar. a rare, life-threatening bacterial infection in the skin of the perineum could occur. stop taking farxiga and call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of this infection, an allergic reaction, or ketoacidosis. when you have chronic kidney disease, it's time to ask your doctor for farxiga. because there are places you want to be. if you can't afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help. ♪far-xi-ga♪ my mental health was much better. but i struggled with uncontrollable movements called td, tardive dyskinesia. td can be caused by some mental health meds. and it's unlikely to improve without treatment. i felt like my movements were in the spotlight. #1-prescribed ingrezza is the only td treatment for adults that's always one pill, once daily. ingrezza 80 mg is proven to reduce td movements in 7 out of 10 people. people taking ingrezza can stay on most mental health meds. ingrezza can cause depression, suicidal thoughts, or actions in patients with huntington's disease. pay close attention to and call your doctor if you become depressed, have sudden changes in mood, behaviors, feelings, or have thoughts of suicide. don't take ingrezza if you're allergic to its ingredients. ingrezza may cause serious side effects, including angioedema, potential heart rhythm problems, and abnormal movements. report fevers, stiff muscles, or problems thinking as these may be life threatening. sleepiness is the most common side effect. it's nice. people focus more on me. ask your doctor about #1 prescribed, once-daily ingrezza. ♪ ingrezza ♪ woman: who's that, who is that? 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>> how can we not? today, the secretary of state anthony blinken went to tel aviv for another meeting with the israeli prime minister netanyahu and israeli officials, with a markedly different message around israel's actions to defend itself in response to the october 7th attacks. secretary blinken explicitly supported a pause in the fighting, not the cease-fire, that many americans are calling for, to allow hostages to be released and for humanitarian aid to get into gaza. >> we are absolutely focused on getting hostages back, and getting them back from their families safely, and we believe that among other things, a humanitarian pause could help the effort. >> and the american secretary of state summarized a different device that he delivered to prime minister benjamin netanyahu, saying that america was looking for concrete steps to minimize civilian casualties. >> hamas does not care on second or one iota for the well-being for palestinian people. cynically and much rusty, uses them as human shields, putting his commanders in command posts, its weapons and ammunitions within or beneath residential buildings, schools, mosque, hospitals. but civilians should not suffer the consequences for its inhumanity and brutality. we provided israel advice to only the best offense can offer on how to minimize civilian deaths while still achieving its objectives of finding and finishing hamas terrorists and their violence. today, i spoke with prime minister netanyahu, and other senior officials about congress subsided. >> tonight, clashes between israeli troops and hamas fighters are raging as the israeli military says it has cut off all main roads and gaza city, the most populated place in the gaza strip, where more than nine dozen people are reported by the palestinian health ministry. two have been killed. nbc news cannot independently confirm that figure, but the images suggest that the number of civilian deaths are high, causing israel to face growing pressure. in response to secretary blinken's advice from a friend, israeli prime minister netanyahu refused the temporary cease-fire, unless all hostages held by hamas were released force and said that israel continued its military operation with, quote, all of its power, and quote. secretary blinken scheduled to travel -- to meet with arab foreign ministers tomorrow. we'll see how division for post gaza war of middle east peace's received. >> the united states continues to believe that the best viable path, indeed the only path, is through a two state solution. that is the only guarantor of the secure, jewish and democratic israel. the only guarantor of palestinians realizing they're legitimate right to live in a state of her own, with joint measures of security, freedom, opportunity and dignity. the only way to mend a cycle of violence, once and for all. >> joining us now from tel aviv 's ronen bergman, an investigative journalist and commentator on israeli politics and history. he is a senior politics analysts, for israelis newspapers as well as a reporter for the near times. he is the author of a number of important books, including rise and killed first, the secrecy of israel's targeted assassinations. ronen bergman, it's good to see you. look, i believe that the secretary of state means well and is trying to achieve something through his shuffled diplomacy, but there are people in the united states and israel who think that sort of talk about, hey, let's get back to a two state solution, is naive, giving that an increasing number of israelis are not interested in a two state solution, and an increasing number of palestinians, both in the west bank and gaza, are not interested in a two state solution. i only say this to you because what is practical? but can anthony blinken actually do with benjamin netanyahu and with the foreign ministers that he is meeting tomorrow? >> hi, ali, thank you. first of all, i think that the main contribution so far to american diplomacy is convincing israel to open the gates of the gaza strip, any kind of humanitarian aid impossible for the gaza strip. this is significant. they've had some difficulties with this at the beginning, because some at the humanitarian aid would go to hamas. hamas is demanding fuel. israel should evidence that hamas has massive stocks of fuel, and, yes, they are still not sharing them with the population, demonstrating a little pair for the suffering. this is one. the second is, i think, as my colleague published today in the dark times, something that they called secret police, so secret, that they are on the front page of the new york times, but have some policies that will enable the situation with the people, bringing aid into the northern part. this has been circulated by under siege of israel, freedom of some of the hostages. israel says -- until some hostages are free. basically, putting this request from the u.s. as part of the negotiation, on one hand. there is no connection, of course, and how someone can refuse giving help to refugees people who need. on the other hand, hamas is not holding those 230 hostages, israel is demanding to give aid, but hamas is not even giving them a, not just freedom. i think the u.s. for now, has capability to influence how aggressive israel will be, maybe, on those secret pauses, i don't think that both sides, both hamas or the decline will a joined offer by qatar and egypt and israel, ripe for any kind of temporary step, a cease-fire or major dealing with the hostages. >> ronan, what is your sense tomorrow will be a month since the tragedy of october 7th, what is your sense of how this is playing out internally in israel? in america it's affecting domestic american politics. it's affecting israeli domestic politics even more. >> yeah, well if you talk about politics i think that all polls show now is he was political buried by many political analysts, i will not make the same mistake again. his situation in the polls is severe, 75% accusing him accusing him of leading the series of fiascoes that led to october 7th. i think his political career, at least as viewed from the -- on the other hand, i think there is a consensus among many israelis that the only, that the preferred reply, maybe the only up reply, to the atrocities of murdering 1400 people, calling causing them great agony, torture, kidnapping those people, leaving the evacuation of hundreds of thousands of israelis south and north, the only possible reaction would be the dismantling of the hamas infrastructure militarily and militarily. this cannot be achieved. i think the israeli statement and military leaders are not very clear, the words they are saying. there is no way to dismantle hamas. there is no way to destroy the subterranean bonkers. there's no way to kill the leaders of hamas unless of full -- of the gaza strip. the price, the unbelievable price in collateral damage, in human lives. >> ronen, you've written a book that's important for people to. read written about how the israelis have the ability to undertake these surgical strikes and it becomes more relevant with each passing day. ronen, thanks for joining us tonight. ronen bergman as a staff writer with new york magazine. he traveled biden traveled to lewiston maine. the mayor of -- carl sheline, will join us next. ll join us next ♪ at each day's staaart. ♪ ♪ as time went on it was easy to seee. ♪ ♪ i'm lowering my a1c. ♪ jardiance works 24/7 in your body to flush out some sugar! and for adults with type 2 diabetes and known heart disease, jardiance can lower the risk of cardiovascular death, too. jardiance may cause serious side effects including ketoacidosis that may be fatal, dehydration, that can lead to sudden worsening of kidney function, and genital yeast or urinary tract infections. a rare, life-threatening bacterial infection in the skin of the perineum could occur. stop taking jardiance and call your doctor right away if you have symptoms of this infection, ketoacidosis, or an allergic reaction, and don't take it if you're on dialysis. taking jardiance with a sulfonylurea or insulin may cause low blood sugar. ♪ jardiance is really swell, ♪ ♪ the little pill with a big story to tell. ♪ shingles. some describe it as an intense burning sensation or an unbearable itch. this painful, blistering rash can disrupt your life for weeks. it could make your workday feel impossible. the virus that causes shingles is likely already inside of you. if you're 50 years or older, ask your doctor or pharmacist about shingles. a mystery! jessie loves playing detective. but the real mystery was her irritated skin. so, we switched to tide pods free & gentle. it cleans better, and doesn't leave behind irritating residues. and it's gentle on her skin. tide free & gentle is epa safer choice certified. it's got to be tide. >> as we mourn today in maine, this tragedy opens a painful, painful wound across the country. too many americans have lost loved ones or survived the trauma of gun violence. i know, because jill and i have met with them in buffalo, in uvalde, in monterey park, in sandy hook. jill and i are here, though, on behalf of the american people, to grieve with you and to make sure that you know they are not alone. >> president biden offering his condolences to the people of lewiston, maine. the most recent town in america to experience deadly mass shooting. today has been declared love lewiston day, as hundreds of mourners attended the first funerals honoring the 18 lives lost in the massacre. nine days ago. president biden met with fourth first responders on the president first lady also met privately with the families of the victims and those injured. joining us now is lewiston mayor, carl sheline. carol, i never know how these things work. i cover many of so many of the shootings, many in person, and then the president comes in this is a particularly good president when it comes to grieving with communities, but what does it do? what does it bring you some piece that the president was there when he says you're not alone? >> absolutely. as you know, ali, the president is no stranger to personalized and grief. for the president to come during this time, yet really let us know that the entire country is with us. it was grateful to have him visit with victims and their families and dark with words of support for our city. >> what does this mean for your city? one of the things i always find after these things is that it just changes who you are, it changes what your city is. people don't want that to happen, but it can't not happen after something like this. >> yeah, i mean, for sure there's going to be a long road of recovery and healing. like i said in my remarks, lewiston is full of grit. i disagree. things for sure will be different. we'll be grieving, we'll be mourning. but lewiston is a strong city. lewiston is a magnificent city. our collective strength is greater than any number of bullets. i know that we will be okay. >> let me ask you about changes. whenever we see these mass shootings, we imagine. i don't know, maybe we fantasize that america will change in that we will just come to our senses around gun violence. what's your sense of it? do you think about that? me >> occasionally, yes. the president alluded to it in his remarks. i support representative golden. take a closer look at the assault weapons ban. but right now i'm just wholly focused on getting our city through this tragedy and well on the path to recovering and healing. >> you mentioned representative golden, who has apologized for opposing the assault weapons ban. let's listen to that for a moment. >> to the people of lewiston, my constituents throughout the second district, to the families who lost loved ones, and to those who have been hired, i ask for forgiveness and support is a seek to put an end to these terrible shootings. >> you don't hear that much, mayor. you don't hear people sort of changing their position on these things. unfortunately these are kind of tragedies that caused people to. tell me a bit more about what you think about that. >> i think representative gordon's words speak for themselves. representative golden, he grew up in a town close by. he lives in the western. this is his hometown. he is my representative, and i am his mayor. i have a tremendous amount of respect for him, and people's positions can change overtime. i wholly support what he said, and yeah, looking forward to change. >> mayor, we are with you on this. i'm sorry for what you have had to go through, and i'm sorry for your whole town. my love to lewiston, and thank you for being with us tonight. >> i really appreciate that, ali. have a wonderful evening. >> lewiston mayor, carl ele. i'm honestly you attorney am tomorrow and sunday with my show velshi. i will be joined by former israeli prime minister naftali bennett. the 11th hour starts now. starts now

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