Transcripts For MSNBCW Dateline 20240703

Call in a ditch in the middle the night. No big deal. But something about a story was off, somehow. My whole life is kind of gone to lately. It felt like theres something going on. It just didnt fit right. Hed have a better day had been normal. The strange encountered all but that is my win a few days later the deputy got a Surprise Call from the fbi. Asking about that traffic accident. The kansas 911 call had popped up during the search of cell phone records. And the fbi was trying to create a timeline for tim dean and a murder investigation. I thought, wow, okay, i dont know what i have to offer for this but heres everything ive got. To try to help. So now, deputy nikole at cline countys Sheriffs Department in kansas found himself called into a growing multi state multi agency investigation. They want to hear everything. He is asking me if i worked who was there, and where was he going. Without of State Investigators eager to hear more of the deputies cited to backtrack and try to figure out where dean had gone after the accident. The deputy visited the garage where the car had been taught. He, again, turn his body come on to report. Thanks for coming your day off. We appreciate it. The Garage Mechanics remember hoping a tote bag full of ammo. The bag, when i opened up, it was a magazine for the memo. And big magazine or little magazine . Big. Once i ar style like miniature rifle. Also into his car, was a long gun. That is when i saw the shotgun under the tote. I grabbed the shotgun and i saw a sports fest, i wouldnt say it was bulletproof but it was a sport shooting vest. With puches or something . I dont remember theres patches. But it is all black. And it was probably 58 pounds. It had some weight to it. Did you come in the shop . But yeah. You have it in the shop . Yes, we do. They had video of timothy dean showing up to pick up a tow. I could see the video you walked out with a concealable listed vest. And a 12 gauge shotgun. The grass grew wondered among themselves what the sky was doing with an arsenal in his car. Im glad you guys are following up on this. Because i even told him i had weird vibes about all of this. Where did tim dean go next. The deputy learned he had an uber and tracked on the driver at her office. She said before trump got into a car he warned her about the goods he was carrying. You know, he wont, he goes to shock. And as it is loaded . He said no, i said thats fine. Im not scared of guns. She dropped him off at a local hotel. Thats last you saw him . Tim dean had left the hotel and got out of town. But how . The deputy assume tim read to a new car after a wreck dispersed. And so he went over to the main Car Rental Company in town. Enterprise. You see what im talking about . Sure enough, the Rental Associate onto the said tim dean had been there. He was the walkin from texas who didnt have a credit card on him. He walked in and then i told them i can cut him because he just had cash on him. I was really upset about, that he just left. Left, but for where . Back into texas . Or somewhere else . There is about 48 hours before joshua number would be executed in new york. Back in the station, Deputy Nicolette thought back on that long chat he had with tim dean. And there, on that body cam video, was a back and forth that stopped him cold. So are you gonna go . Well i got a Family Friend those gonna see but. Or is that it . All the way up in new york. New york, the scene of the crime. Deputy nicolette relay the information to the fbi. When i said that he was going to new york. Everything changed, at that point. Tim deans cities come to new york. Hes armed with more than one handgun. Hes also got an ar15 with him. A shotgun. How does explain all thats the deputy on the side of the road . I guess its not uncommon for people to be in possession of weapons in kansas. But, it becomes instrumental when he admits that hes going to new york. As far as you know, tim dean did not have relatives in new york. But he did, they learned, have a fresh frontal picked up. And Law Enforcement would later have the make, model, cover, and License Plate of the vehicle passing Surveillance Cameras on its way to Upstate New York. Timothy dean was a Heat Seeking Missile on his way. Coming up. Weve always got that the sky has killed two people. Were not getting a chance on him. Inside the allout blowout to capture attendees. Weve got as in the house. We know we saw. Theyve got explosives in the door. The back. Out the back out, nobody is clear. Could they take him alive . When dateline continues. Diabetes can serve up a lot of questions, like, what is your glucose . And can you have more carbs . Before you decide. With the freestyle libre 2 system know your Glucose Level and where its headed. No fingersticks needed. Manage your diabetes with more confidence. And lower your a1c. The number one doctor prescribed cgm. Freestyle libre 2. Try it for free at freestylelibre. Us dupixent helps you du more with less asthma. And can help you breathe better in as little as two weeks. Dupixent is an addon treatment for specific types of moderatetosevere asthma thats not for sudden breathing problems. Dupixent can cause allergic reactions that can be severe. Get help right away if you have rash, chest pain, worsening shortness of breath, tingling or numbness in your limbs. Tell your doctor about new or worsening joint aches and pain, or a parasitic infection. Dont change or Stop Asthma Medicines, including steroids, without talking to your doctor. Ask your specialist about dupixent. Youre the one that i want your dog is the one you wanted. You want whats best for them. Ohh, ohh, ohh so ask your vet about new nexgard plus. Its oneanddone monthly protection from fleas and ticks, plus heartworm disease, roundworms, and hookworms. All in a delicious, beefflavored, soft chew. Use with caution in dogs with a history of seizures or neurologic disorders. From the maker of 1 vetrecommended heartgard plus. Nexgard plus the one you want for oneanddone protection. After advil. Feeling better . On top of the worlddddd before advil. Advil targets pain at the source of inflammation. When pain comes for you, come back fast with advil liquigels. bridget with Thyroid Eye Disease i hid from the camera. When pain comes for you, and i wanted to hide from the world. For years, i thought my t. E. D. Was beyond help. But then i asked my doctor about tepezza. vo tepezza is the only medicine that treats t. E. D. At the source not just the symptoms. In a Clinical Study more than 8 out of 10 patients taking tepezza had less eye bulging. Tepezza is an infusion and may cause infusion reactions. Tell your doctor right away if you experience high blood pressure, fast heartbeat, shortness of breath or muscle pain. Before treatment, tell your doctor if you have diabetes, ibd, or are pregnant, or planning to become pregnant. Tepezza may raise blood sugar and may worsen ibd. Tepezza may cause severe Hearing Problems which may be permanent. bridget now, im ready to be seen again. vo visit mytepezza. Com to find a ted Eye Specialist and to see bridgets before and after photos. Shingles. Some describe it as an intense Burning Sensation or an unbearable itch. This painful, blistering rash can disrupt your life for weeks. It could make your workday feel impossible. The virus that causes shingles is likely already inside of you. If youre 50 years or older, ask your doctor or pharmacist about shingles. The investigative cards theyre holding. No matter how badly they need to know. We were cooperating with the police trying to get as much information with the police as we could. Follow new stories as best as we could. Trying to piece things together. The police just kept saying be patient. As things come up, be patient. So i was patient. I dont want to interfere and to stop them from finding who killed my son. So the families didnt know about october 29th 2018. One week after the murders. Five detectives from new york were headed to the texas panhandle. They want to talk with tim dean, charlene says been. You take a road trip . Yes we do, never do it again. Thats 24 solid hours of driving. Theyd come up with a plan to bring him into custody. Texas decided that they had still had some charges for him on the complaint. This is really a holding action. The plan one ice while you can put the case. Or try to talk to him. Tim dean lived in a 50s One Story House on the edge of town. The cops had surveil the home and you he was there. They were treating him as the suspect in a double homicide, not a child abuse or. So they went and strong. After dark. Swat teams, uniforms, weapons drawn. I take down right out of seal team six. Texas investigator, tom flood, was there. How commit could be a knock, knock, knock, you know who we are. We have paper for you. Were gonna serve you. Sort of the case that this gets killed two people were not to take the chance of him shooting an officer. We know hes there they put explosives on the door they back out. Every square every situated, the bulk door. This Iphone Footage was taken by a neighbor across the street. As explosions blew out the front door. What a show. It is like a commando operation. Straight out of military. Eventually, does come out, they actually comes about right here in races his hand. And, if he had surrendered that made a poor decision to resist he was gonna go to a shot at that point. No. He wouldve been shot. With the suspect in custody. Dean, the onetime police chief, was transported to an Interrogation Room to be questioned by an fbi agent. But of course, the Reason Department had nothing to do with causing injury to a child. The charge on the arrest warrant. They want to talk to him about amber and josh. Had never met one person . Ive been there when you come to get the kids. Houses the meter. What is the line of the question . Hes very quite. He doesnt say a whole lot. They asked him by the soon to be exwife, charlene. The trouble he caused both for kids. I did try to lose in custody . Obviously not well. Like anybody else, yeah . I mean shes never not had the kids. Does she blame you . Probably. Of course one of the theories was that tim had killed him or josh to when his wife back. Do you think it get her kids help you get her back . I know theres no getting back. There hasnt been. I mean, in your mind, that a possibility. And youre the prostate and stuff . Its done. Its been done. Theres no getting her back. Ive accepted that. Thats why ive been in a state of mind. Is a true you hated josh . Never even met the man. Investigators told him they knew he traveled to New York State around the time of the murders. But, why did he drive all the way there . I was really medical see her uncle. Thats if i could talk to him and get him to talk some sense of her and maybe maybe get her to ride this thing out with me. Maybe tim did think he couldnt win her back. But, and he had, he admitted he never did see her uncle. Just drove, slip, and drink. For a while, the investigators played good cop with him. And seemed to speak to him with a sense of compassion. I mean, i got a life is hard. But my version of hard and original hard this different things. I cant say moleskins art. Goodness, i can sympathize with you. Tim told them, yes, he had hit a low point. And offered an explanation as to why he was driving so far from home. I left home detention of putting a bullet in my head. So that no one knows me will have to find me and work it. Okay. What changed . I turn my phone off, so nobody could call me for caused him to try to talk me out of it. Okay. The interrogators ever so gently turn the conversation back to the murders. What changed . What made change to what happened on that day . If you think youre gonna sit here and say that i did that, youre crazy. I think youre crazy if you dont, quite honestly. Them, its not a question if you did it as a question of why, and are you sorry . Do you think these five different detectives from new york drove down here for no reason . I dont know what they pfizer. I got no idea why the fbi is here. What happens when you drive. I didnt commit the perfect crime. Unless suicide is on the fbis radar. The interrogators werent buying it. And urged him to come clean. Youre not a monster, man. You have up. There is no doubt about it. But there can be a redemption in life. There couldnt really can. What youre showing me right now is that you are a real person. And, not only that. You are a good cop. At some times, right. We all screw up in life. There is a path to redemption, and Everything Else him. When that approach failed, investigators try to rattle him by talking about the victims. Are you sorry amber and josh got killed . Do you hear what im saying . I hear what youre saying. Are you sorry that they got killed . Im not saying you kill them. Are you sorry they got killed . Yes. Can you say their names . Charge an amber. Say, im josh allen where got killed. I said. It no you didnt. You said it imparts. You know because you cant. You realize youre talking about being in sodus and we know that. And youre saying that you didnt do, it but you know presumably that. I take my chances i guess. The investigators worked hard to break him. But they never did get a confession. Ive never been in the presence of a bigger coward. Fortunately, tim dean wasnt the only person they wanted to talk to. There was, can you believe it, another local cop on a list of persons of interest. Coming up you like police work . Yes maam. Two cops. But in the middle of a murder plot . They have a decision to make. Whether he wants to be a good witness, or he wants to be charged in conspiracy to commit two murders. Definitely dont want that. So he is way in the slime at this point . Yeah. He was hit with all the truth. Soon, he would have a killer secret to reveal. You overheard scene say what . When dateline continues there is a better way to manage diabetes. The dexcom g7 continuous Glucose Monitoring system eliminates painful finger sticks, helps lower a1c, and its covered by medicare. Before using the dexcom g7, i was really frustrated. All of that Finger Pricking and all that pain, my a1c was still stuck. Before dexcom g7, i couldnt enjoy a single meal. I was always trying to outguess my glucose, and it was awful. Before dexcom g7, my diabetes was out of control because i was tired, not having the energy to do the things that i wanted to do. female announcer dexcom g7 is a small, easytouse wearable that sends your Glucose Numbers to your phone or dexcom receiver without painful finger sticks. The arrow shows the direction your glucose is heading up, down, or steady and because dexcom g7 is the most accurate cgm, you can make better decisions about food, medication, and activity in the moment. It can even alert you before you go too low or when youre high. Oh, the fun is absolutely back. After dexcom g7, i can on the spot figure out what im gonna eat and how its going to affect my glucose when a friend calls and says, hey, lets go to breakfast, i can get excited again. earl after using the dexcom g7, my diabetes, it doesnt slow me down at all. I lead line dancing three times a week, i exercise, and im just living a great life now. Its so easy to use. It has given me confidence and control, everything i need is right there on my phone. earl the dexcom g7 is so small, so easy to use, and its very discreet. dr. Aaron king if you have diabetes, getting on dexcom is the single most important thing you can do. david within months, my a1c went down, thats 6. 9. donna at my last checkup, my a1c was 5. 9. female announcer dexcom is the number one recommended cgm brand and offers 24 7 tech support, so call now to get started. Youll talk to a real person. Dont wait, this one short call could change your life. bright music the power goes out and we still have wifi to do our homework. And thats a good thing . Great in my book who are you . No power . No problem. Introducing stormready wifi. Now you can stay reliably connected through Power Outages with unlimited cellular data and up to 4 hours of battery backup to keep you online. Only from xfinity. Home of the xfinity 10g network. Heres why you should switch from chrome to duckduckgo. Duckduckgo is a browser you download to your mobile and desktop devices. Unlike chrome, the Duckduckgo Browser has privacy builtin. It comes with a private alternative to google search, which doesn■t spy on your searches, and it blocks cookies and creepy ads. And theres no catch. Its free. We make money from ads, but they dont follow you around. Join the millions of people taking back their privacy by Downloading Duckduckgo On Mobile and desktop today. Tim dean stuck to his story. He had driven to new york with suicide in mind. Unless suicide is on the fbi s radar. His interrogators did not believe him for an instant. But they had another lead to pursue. Another cop, in fact. A man named ron. So brian how do you see his last name . Bowler. Bowler . Never heard it say it out loud. He is a police officer. Yes he is. He had served 11 years as a texas cop. He had worked for the Cactus Police department and saw most recently at sun ray after tim loved his job there. And he was a family man, a husband, a father, and a friend to tim dean. So how did officer braun come on to the police radar . Okay. Got your license and paperwork for this thing . Well, it goes back to that rental car that tim dean put in a ditch in kansas. It was browns name on the rentals papers, not tims. They steadily picked up on that right away. This is bowler brown. Hes a buddy of mine. Thats gonna cause you more problems than anything. I know. So he rented the car for you . Yeah. I was like at work. I wasnt going to make it in time. Im not looking forward to that phone call. Thatll bite him in the as pretty big. Exactly. When bronze interview ended those ten fallen back to his house while the authorities prepared an arrest warrant. He got home, we arrest him. Your career Law Enforcement, tom . Doesnt embarrass it ever talked about two guys were sworn officers here . It is embarrassing to think that they felt like they could do this and get away with it. It is a shame that i want to this point. They knew there was other options. But they want to take it the way that is going to get somebody killed. That is just not. They know that. That the majority of sunrays three men for, past and present, under arrest. But the investigation was far from over. Someone else they had id all along was still in the crosshairs. They were back to where they had started, with a certain embittered young woman from texas. Coming up. I call this mom. And shes like, charlene what is going on . Josh is dead. I hit the floor. Really . What the heck is going on. It still feels a horrible bad dream. Joshs ex, charlene. You need to look at charlene. I said, i pray it is not. What story would she tell . The driven thing to do with him shooting josh an amber . When dateline continues. Two cops could come to plot a murder. And this is the garage. This is where the meetings took place. At least one of those meetings, bronwood here it while he was on duty, while working. So there is martinez out front. Wow, so he is in uniform . I cant help but think, here we are 1500 miles away, a guy in Upstate New York who is a dead man walking. He has no idea what is going at down in this garage and panhandle of texas. He knew what it. What does he have going on . Other than the fact that he worked as a police officer, tim was his friend and was going to do whatever he needed to help him. Including a rental car so you can drive all the way across the country and kill . Exactly. When bronze interview ended, lieutenant followed him back to his house, while the authorities prepared an arrest warrant. We got, home we arrested him. You are in Law Enforcement, is it embarrassing we are talking about two guys who are sworn officers here . It is embarrassing to think that they felt like they could do this and get away with it. It is a shame that i want to this point. They knew there was other options. But they want to take it the way that is going to get somebody killed. That is just not. They know that. That the majority of sunrays three men for, past and present, under arrest. But the investigation was far from over. Someone else they had id all along was still in the crosshairs. They were back to where they had started, with a certain embittered young woman from texas. Coming up. I call this mom. And shes like, charlene what is going on . Josh is dead. I hit the floor. Really . What the heck is going on. It still feels a horrible bad dream. Joshs ex, charlene. You need to look at charlene. I said, i pray it is not. What story would she tell . The driven thing to do with him shooting josh an amber . When dateline continues. Rsv can severely affect the lungs and lower airways. But im protected with arexvy. Arexvy is a vaccine used to prevent lower Respiratory Disease from rsv in people 60 years and older. Rsv can be serious for those over 60, including those with asthma, diabetes, copd, and certain other conditions. But im protected. Arexvy is proven to be over 82 effective in preventing lower Respiratory Disease from rsv and over 94 effective in those with these health conditions. Arexvy does not protect everyone and is not for those with severe allergic reactions to its ingredients. Those with weakened Immune Systems may have a lower response to the vaccine. The most common side effects are injection site pain, fatigue, muscle pain, headache, and joint pain. I chose arexvy. Rsv . Make it arexvy. Blendjets halloween sale is back from the dead. Take advantage of spine chilling savings. Blendjet 2 gives you monstrous power for a delicious smoothie, shake, or frappe anytime, anywhere. Cleaning blendjet 2 is scary easy. Just blend water with a drop of soap. Recharge quickly with any usb port. Boogie on over to blendjet. Com and order yours today. Heres why you should switch from chrome to duckduckgo. Duckduckgo is a browser you download to your mobile and desktop devices. Unlike chrome, the Duckduckgo Browser has privacy builtin. It comes with a private alternative to google search, which doesn■t spy on your searches, and it blocks cookies and creepy ads. And theres no catch. Its free. We make money from ads, but they dont follow you around. And israels military says, join the millions of people taking back their privacy by Downloading Duckduckgo On Mobile and desktop today. Its plans to expand operations have been approved ahead of a looming Ground Incursion into gaza. And idf official called on residents of Northern Gaza to continue evacuating to the south. And, now back to dateline. What happened . Well, i try to turn around. That accident in kansas proved the undoing attendee in. Found with a car full of guns and ammo on his way to New York State. The very place where the murders word occur. Where is that at . That is way up in new york. But heres a question about the theory of the crime. Was tim a desperate, depressed man on the wish it to went back on his wife . Or, was his wife in on . It all along the detectives consider the possibility that they not only knew about the plan to murder charge, but maybe had talked him into doing it as play back for his blunder in losing the kids. So you owe me tim dean, you owe me a big one here. Yes. It was a theory that came to resonate for some of josh and embers loved ones. He had a couple of friends that they were like you need to look at charlie. Did you say oh no that cant be done . I did say. Oh no it couldnt be. I said oh no i pray its not. In fact, joshs Sister Nicole had given police an earful about charlene early on. Cops came into my house and told me what happened and ask me if my brother had enemies. And i said he does not have enemies but he does have charlene. Nicole right away says its her. Her and joshs best friend katie. They both said i dont think she should be her, i think it might have been her. And i said thats crazy. By the time of the funerals, even embers sister who had never met charlie thought that she might be involved. I saw her for the first time in my life at the funeral. And, i just got cold chills. And i remember speaking at the funeral, given my sisters eulogy. Seeking her out. And in the crowd. Just to make eye contact with her. When i was talking about how good my mother, her sister, was to children. And you had yes. Big and the badmouthing of josh depicting as a violent, that guy. There was a case against charlene and it was a big factor. In her early phone calls, she claimed she learned of joshs death on facebook. That she had seen a picture of the house and the street addressed with that in fact did not happen. The street was made public, but not the house or number. That was a liar because that was not photographed. She couldnt . She couldve seen it. So how did she know unless she was part of the plot . Eight days after the murders, detectives picked up charlene at her boyfriend, caseys house. We knocked on the door, and asked charlene to come with us. She didnt seem fazed by the whole thing. She didnt seem shocked. She didnt say i got a lawyer . Were done here . No. So she came down . She did. She lit willingly talk to us for quite awhile. Hello. Nice to meet you. Conversation was cordial as they walk through her back story. Charlene told them how surprised she had been when she found out that her ex boyfriend was dead. So i called his mom. And she says, charlene, yes whats going on . Josh is dead. I had the floor. Really. What the hell is going on . Yeah. It still feels like a horrible bad dream. Right. How could, who, why . Thats what i want to know. Could tim of been the shooter, they asked her . Did He Arbor Elwell against russia. He knew the stuff that josh had done to me. What do you mean . Josh used to be the hell out of me. Oh really . But. You know. Tim had never really spoke to bat about him. You know. It was more of if i could ever get into a fight with him i would fight him. Do you think that tim is capable of this . I cant see it. Unless it was on the job, protection. Right. I cant see him. He is not that type of person. Right. Charlene denied knowledge of tims murderous plans. But detectives had learned Something Else about her. And it went back to that rental car that he ended up crashing. Charlene had driven to pick it up at the start of the road trip. Did you take somebody to go around and get your vehicle . I took my friend to go get the vehicle. Who is that . Ron. I cant say easements name. Ron. Ron . Ron. She said she was simply doing a friend of favor. Never asked him who or what it was for. He did it think it was unusual . This guy didnt talk among the way . Getting a vehicle . What . Isnt that kind of unusual . I just keep peoples privacy. We talked with just about that. But there was so much more to the saga of the wrecked rental car. Remember how he had trouble renting a replacement because he only had cash . He was really upset about that many just left. Detectives now learned that it was charlene herself, who drove in at least 500 miles. Credit card in hand. To get tim dean back on the road. Did you help him . I drove up there. To come to the rental car. Did he tell you where he was going . What he was doing . Nope. I dont ask questions. I dont care. Honestly, i assumed it was for work. Okay. He works for fritolay now. So he travels all the damn time. The more she talked, the more radioactive she became as a suspect. I got around saturday night, i think. How long, how long is that . About five hours for me. Holy cow. Thats awful nice. He filled up my gas tank. Better as he wouldve. So i was like, last resort, i was like ask anybody else that you can because i dont feel like coming america after work. I dont feel like for you. I dont feel. What if i get stranded. But i kind of feel like, you know what you. No i understand. Karma, it comes around. But charlene didnt seem like somebody who would do a big favor for the man who had essentially ruined her life, by causing her custody of the kids. They cut to the chase. Did you have anything to do with him shooting josh and amber . No. Did you put him up to it . No. Im seeing a woman in her twenties, who is actually trying to convince a police officer. An experienced police officer. Much like a teenager word, that her story is real. And watching her interview. It does not believable. All right, i got a couple things, that are not driving that i want to talk to you about specifically. They were about to turn of the heat. Before i do that, were gonna read miranda rights. Coming up i had just lost my kids. I said, you know what, i cant deal with. Its i cant deal with a depression, and the sadness anymore. I need my kids. My kids in my life. And, he looked at me and he was like. What do we do . A desperate mom. How deep did this plot go . I didnt think it was going to happen. I blame myself for everything. When dateline continues have to put your mind to it and fight. Subject 2 it doesnt feel good because you cant play outside with other children. Subject 3 as a parent, it is your job to protect your family. But here is something that i cannot do. I cannot fix this. I dont know if my daughter is going to be able to walk. I dont know if shes going to make it till tomorrow. [music playing] interviewer you can join the battle to save lives by supporting st. Jude childrens research hospital. Families never receive a bill from st. Jude for treatment, travel, housing, or food so they can focus on helping their child live. Subject 4 childhood cancer, theres no escaping it. But st. Jude is doing the work, continually researching towards cures, giving more than just my child a chance at life. Interviewer please, call or go online right now and become a st. Jude partner in hope for only 19 a month. Subject 5 those donations really matter because were not going to give up. And when you see other people not giving up on your child, it makes all the difference in the world. Interviewer when you call or go online with your credit or debit card right now, well send you this st. Jude tshirt. You can wear to show your support to help st. Jude save the lives of these children. Subject 6 st. Jude is hope. Even today after losing a child, its still about the hope of tomorrow, because. Childhood cancer has to end. Interviewer please, call or go online right now. [music playing] youre the one that i want your dog is the one you wanted. You want whats best for them. Ohh, ohh, ohh so ask your vet about new nexgard plus. Its oneanddone monthly protection from fleas and ticks, plus heartworm disease, roundworms, and hookworms. All in a delicious, beefflavored, soft chew. Use with caution in dogs with a history of seizures or neurologic disorders. From the maker of 1 vetrecommended heartgard plus. Nexgard plus the one you want for oneanddone protection. Charlene had done her best to charlene had done her vetbest to bat it all away,us. Bat it all away. Those investigative details that seem to tie her to josh and embers murders. Where do after that . But the detectives grilled her deep into the night. It was 1 30 in the morning. I had about two hours asleep, in two days. And, all i could think about was getting home to my children. Did you ever get back to them . Now. That was it wasnt it . Yes. Never saw them again, because she arlene started to spell. Watch and listen now as she gives it up. The story that she told us is much the same as the story she would eventually tell the authorities. How she became a killer. I blame myself for everything. Charlene says it started after that august Court Hearing in New York State where she lost custody of her kids. She and tim brought a long drive back to texas when she came undone. I had just lost my kids, at least for the school year. And i said, you know what, i cant deal with this. I cant deal with a depression in the sadness anymore. I need my kids. My kids are my life. And, he looked at me and hes like, what we do . Charlene had the answer. I was like, hes gotta go. Hes gotta go. So you say to tim weve got to do something and what does he say back to you . Okay. Okay . I will kill him. Is that what you understood him to say . He said okay. Did you realize that you had crossed the line there . Not at the time, because it was just talk. This is the moment that you became the architect of a murder. Yeah. But at the time i didnt think it was going to happen. Maybe not right then and there. But after visiting her children in new york. Two months later. The wheels in her head were still turning. My son is falling his eyes out to me saying how he hated up here, he wants to come home with me, he wants me to steal him away and that hit me. It was, anyone who knows my son knows that he doesnt just fall his eyes out like that. Did this put you back in that place where you had that conversation back when . Yes. She says when she returned home to texas, as she told her husband him that it was showtime. Im telling him that, you know, now it needs to be done. And what needs to be done is josh needs to be killed . Yes. And tim is gonna be the agent of bringing that off . Yes. Hes gonna be the killer . Yes. That missiles often going at this point isnt it . Yes. Youve lit the fuse . Yes. So they planned it in that garage. Yes, charlene was there to. She, tim, and his friend ron were working out the logistics of the murder plot. Ron agreed to rent the car, tim would drive it to new york. What was his understanding of what was going on and what he, you are asking him to do . To go out to new york to handle business. So he says, im good for that . Yes. What is the understanding between you and tim about what is afoot at this point . I thought he was gonna draw up. Kill josh, and come back. Charlene, that makes you a murder. Do you realize that . You have commission this. The gun is in your hand, every bit as much as it is when you say go do this thing. Where in it together. Do you get that . Yes i do. So what are, your what are your words to tim when he heads out . That i love him. She still loved him, their broken marriage wasnt so broken, the divorce talk was just part of a plan to win the children back. And so her husband, former Chief Of Police of sun ray texas. Began the journey north. With his bag full of guns. Then came the hiccup that car accident in kansas. He called me had for him. Says, i wrecked the rental car. And what are you supposed to do . Get him a fresh set of wheels . I tried. You guys well know how Law Enforcement works. Yes. Youre on the record, this would be a great thing to called this off . Maybe assigned this wasnt meant to be . We try to go to new york, ended up in a ditch in kansas . But you go up there. What do you do . I picked him up from the motel and i drove him to an airport. So he could rent a vehicle. On the go. Part two. Plan is on. Did you give him encouragement . Not really encouragement. But i gave him the debit card, and, credit cards if he needs a. And,. Heres your new ride. Go to new york and kill the father of my children . Yes. Fresh eileen, there was no turning back. She drove back home to texas and waited. How do you find out . I got home from work on monday the 22nd of october. I saw the News Articles of shootings in sodas. So according to her own words, charlene talked her husband into murder. A skillful manipulation. Now she had been caught, which she tried to manipulate the system as well . Coming up. She is a master manipulator. That made me sick to my stomach. Taking us for a bunch of passes. Could charlene strike one more deal . You realize how much misery youve caused, charlie. To so many human beings . How many families are destroyed . Because you wanted to have what you wanted to have . Do you have any memories for that . Tons. I gotta say, it doesnt really show. I dont know how it was a look, but i dont think im seeing it. When dateline continues would make her skin so uncomfortable. Now im staying ahead of it. Dupixent helps heal your skin from within. So, they can have clearer skin and less itch. Serious allergic reactions can occur that can be severe. Tell your doctor about new or worsening eye problems such as eye pain or vision changes including blurred vision, joint aches and pain, or a parasitic infection. Dont change or Stop Asthma Medicines without talking to your doctor. Ask your doctor about dupixent. bridget with Thyroid Eye Disease i hid from the camera. Your doctor. And i wanted to hide from the world. For years, i thought my t. E. D. Was beyond help. But then i asked my doctor about tepezza. vo tepezza is the only medicine that treats t. E. D. At the source not just the symptoms. In a Clinical Study more than 8 out of 10 patients taking tepezza had less eye bulging. Tepezza is an infusion and may cause infusion reactions. Tell your doctor right away if you experience high blood pressure, fast heartbeat, shortness of breath or muscle pain. Before treatment, tell your doctor if you have diabetes, ibd, or are pregnant, or planning to become pregnant. Tepezza may raise blood sugar and may worsen ibd. Tepezza may cause severe Hearing Problems which may be permanent. bridget now, im ready to be seen again. vo visit mytepezza. Com to find a ted Eye Specialist and to see bridgets before and after photos. Heres why you should switch from chrome to duckduckgo. Duckduckgo is a browser you download to your mobile and desktop devices. Unlike chrome, the Duckduckgo Browser has privacy builtin. It comes with a private alternative to google search, which doesn■t spy on your searches, and it blocks cookies and creepy ads. And theres no catch. Its free. We make money from ads, but they dont follow you around. Join the millions of people taking back their privacy by Downloading Duckduckgo On Mobile and desktop today. On november 5th 2018, two on november 5, 2018, two weeks after josh and amber weeks after josh and amber or guntown in their driveway, charlene and her husband him or charged in their murders. Josh and ambers parents werent exactly surprised by the news, but that did not make it any easier to take. It made me sick to my stomach. She sat with us at the whole week, with a grieving family. Taking us for a bunch of going to josh and ambers vigil, going to their funeral services. Saying all the right things that people say in those situations . Right, and then to find out she was the one that participated in the killing. It made me sick. And its, like who could even do that . It is almost like compounding lee awful. Yes. She hugs, me should help me she is so sorry for everything. And knowing what you know now yes, i cant wash that off me. Not to mention, the show she put on at the vigil. She has now made it to where my kids grow up without and that is nothing a could should ever have to do. And she said, i hope theres justice. I hope justice to served. What do you think about that conduct . I think shes a narcissist. I think she made herself believe she had nothing to do with it, to have a straight face during the whole thing. She was part of us, and she was not. That is really monstrous behavior. There is the crime of itself of setting in motion, but then it is another thing of, coming right to these peoples homes and, say im so sorry for your loss and you are responsible for the loss. It is a horrible thing. How could you do that . It was hard. The families were also disgusted by tim, how could a police chief suddenly become a stone cold killer . They did not even know my son. And to come up here, Drive Thousands of miles, and shoot him . For what . Assistant District Attorney Christine Cohen says, not for what, but for whom. The described as a master manipulator, special manipulative skills. Absolutely. She always utilized men in her life. She utilized tim to kill josh. She was in two active relationships throughout the case. She was still writing letters to timothy dean, Professing He was the love of her life. But then also, casey miller visited her 60 times at the jail. Charlene and tim or potentially facing life in prison as their trials approached. The dea wondered if they were turn on one another at trial. Her statements to believe and upping admissible, at that point her attorney reaches out, and wants to talk about her coming to the table and cooperating. But could she be trusted . I did not think should be able to tell the truth. She is a master manipulator. So i came into that thinking it was not going to work out. She would do the one thing she has always done throughout the case, and that is protect herself and what is best for her. So the dea was skeptical as they cut charlene a deal, pleading guilty to manslaughter and exchange for telling the truth, and Nothing But The Truth to a jury. So she is a wildcard going into trial . Absolutely. At this point, i dont know if shes going to stick to the agreement and come through, and testify, and actually sit On A Stand In Public and admit to what she had done. Even without charlene the case against him dean or strong. His dna was found in that ski mask of the police a block from the murders. And the police did never shot down the gun, they think it came from where else . The department where tim used to work. What is believed as it was taken from the Police Department . When she took the stand, charlene did lay it all out for the jury. How she dispatched her husband on a mission to kill josh. And it played out more or less as she had hoped, except for one important detail. She says she never wanted amber to die. She was not supposed to be involved at all. It would have been okay if josh is dead . Because that was the plan . It was the plan, yes. Okay, no. It still was a shock that it actually happened. Yes it was planned to happen. It was planned by eu . Yes. You liked the squirrel . You thought she was a good Surrogate Mom for your kids . Yes. There she is with a gun right up against the back of her year, blow her brains out . Your guy, on your orders . No. Those were not my orders. She was never in the plans, ever. At trial, charlenes credibility was an easy target for tims defense attorney. She is a walking, talking, contradiction of herself. She took, i dont know if he is capable of telling the truth. With a tenth phone please stand . In the end, her story was too evil, too cold to dismiss. It took the jury just four hours to convict timothy dean of double murder. We the jury find the defendant guilty. We all knew what it was going to be, but still, we were so relieved to hear that first, you know, strong guilty verdict. Tim was sentenced to life in prison. Ron buller got for Second Degree conspiracy. And charlene is serving 28 years. When county District Attorney mike, in the final analysis, tim dean is the one who pulled the trigger. We felt the proper and resolution is the shoreline was appropriated under the circumstances. 28 years is plenty of time for charlene if she chooses to think about all of the carnage she unleashed. Do you realize how much misery have cost to some human beings in the course of this . Yes. How many families are destroyed . Because he wanted to have what you want to have . Do you have any remorse for that . Tons. I have to say, it doesnt really show. I dont know how remorse this impulse to, look but i dont think i see it. You seem to be okay with what has happened. On the, outside maybe. What happened to you . I made by choices. I regret them every single day. Near the end of our interview, charlene stepped away, and spoke to an attorney. I need a break. She returned to her chair, more emotional this time. What do you tell people who pretty quickly call you a monster . Just flat out evil . I am a human being. I make mistakes. This was ultimately the biggest mistake i have ever done. Im sorry more than i can express. Every day, it runs through me. And your predictive mid now, that will not get you as much as an extra baloney sandwich. I know what i did was wrong, and i know sorry is not good, enough and it will never be good enough. Both amber and joshs families are trying to put this all behind them now. If not for their own sake, for the children involved. They are the light of all of our lives. Joshs Sister Nicole gained custody of josh and charlenes two kids. They are your babies now . They are my babies. I dont know what i would do without them. And ambers parents made a home for that little boy who witnessed it all, the boy in the backseat. Josh junior. This little guy has been our god some, without, him i dont know how we would have made it through. Josh is literally the glue that holds this family together right now. How are you keeping mbs memory alive for josh junior . We have pictures all over the house. You know, every night before he goes to bed, every morning, we all say goodnight to him. Grandma and grandpa love him. Im andrea canning. And this is dateline. She said that she met him in a bar. She was smitten. She really went all out for him. She couldnt see the red flags. It was a heartbreaking case