Ayman, conservative chaos. The Republican Party is in champions over the speakers race and rightwing media has only fanned the flames of dissent. Then, silence. Donald trump has been fined by a judge for violating the terms of his gag order. Jail time could be the next step. Plus, a veteran state Department Official just resigned over the Biden Administrations policy on the israelhamas war. He is going to join me live to explain his decision. I am ayman mohyeldin, lets get started. We begin this hour with several crucial updates on the israelhamas war. Israeli militaries aerial bombardment continues to pummel the gaza strip with more than 4000 People Killed since the war began. This according to palestinian authorities. The humanitarian crises is warming by the hour, with a small aid convoy of food, water, and medical supplies and during the strip just hours ago. Today marks two weeks since hamas militants attacked israel, killing 1400 people and taking 210 hostage. Since then, israel has been threatening a Ground Invasion. Today, its military announced plans to, quote expand operational activities. In the statement, the Israeli Military said its soldiers have been deployed, and are engaging in field exercises and are ready near the gaza strip at this very moment. The Biden Administration, for its part, has largely framed israels aggression on this as a right to defend itself. But outside the United States, some countries have taken a starkly different view. In spain, for example, the minister of social rights called on the Spanish Government to launch a petition for the International Criminal court to investigate Israels Benjamin Netanyahu for allegedly, quote, carrying out a planned genocide on the gaza strip. She went on to say the United States and the european unn are encouraging the state of israel and its policy of apartheid and occupation. In columbi president Gustavo Pedro has compared the conditions in the gaza strip to those of a concentration camp, and called israels continued bombardment of gaza equivalent to a genocide. Today, top officials from more than a dozen countries gathered in the egyptian capital of cairo to discuss how to deescalate the war as fears grow that the conflict could expand throughout the middle east. Here is King Abdullah of jordan. It is really leadership, must realize there is no military solution. To a security concerns. Thats it cannot continue to sideline the 5 million palestinians living under its occupation. The night of their legislative rights and the pages palestinian lives or no less valuable. That is really. In contrast, the United States this week vetoed in the United Nations resolution to condn all violence against civilians. In the war, and to urge humanitarian aid to palestinians in gaza, saying it was too early to craft an appropriate Security Council response to the crisis. The resolution was sponsored by brazil, and had wide support within the body. Despite the veto, after much wrangling over conditions under which relief could be delivered, a 20 truck convoy of lifesaving supplies sent by the United Nations entered the gaza strip today. But that aid was a fraction of what is actually needed. And it is unclear whether more aid will be allowed to pass through in the coming days. Joining us now is haliburton any, live for us in jerusalem. It is good to have you with us. Talk to us about the latest developments there. Obviously, all eyes are on what has happened inside gaza, and the impending Ground Invasion. But as any of the stuff that has taken place in the region today, this summit in cairo, some of the aid coming in, the release of these two american hostages last night, has that given any reason to see there might be a new dynamic unfolding here besides a Ground Invasion . Its interesting, because the hamas spokesperson, or the spokesperson for the house on brigades which is the military wing of hamas, has announced that hamas is ready to release to hostages, even naming. Them but claiming that on the israeli side, they are refusing to receive them. Hamas is saying they are ready to release them tomorrow, sunday. And the Prime Ministers Office in israel is denying that. As far as the aid, you know, you mentioned it with your guest in the previous hour. It is really a drop in the ocean. 20 trucks, of any given day, before this war, up to 400 trucks would go through. As you know, ayman, its not the rafah crossing. Its the kerem shalom crossing inside israel that is typically used for commercial transit. That ones shots. That is the crossing that has a lot of the monitoring, the checking technology, that you would need for large amounts of trucks to cross into gaza. That is not operational yesterdays shipment, there were only 44, 000 bottles of water. That is enough for 22 to 27, 000 people for 24 hours, and no shipments today. So, that really, from a humanitarian perspective, is not at all meeting the needs of the people in gaza. And whats interesting about that peace conference, which was called officially the cairo summit for peace, is that you have the arab countries, very strong speech by the king of jordan, King Abdullah, but the u. S. , for instance, only sent charge daffaires from cairo who didnt even address the conference. In the, and there was no joints communicate because the European Countries and diplomats would not sign a statement that did not explicitly condemn the attacks of hamas. There was some wording there that did not, was something the europeans diplomatic envoys or not willing to sign on to, so, it was, just an opportunity to voice some of these concerns from the arab nations, but it didnt really go farther than that, amen. Hala gorani live for us in tel aviv. Thank you as always. Joining me now is francesca, the United Nations special repertory on the human rights in the palestinian territory. Thank you so much for joining. Us its great to have you with us. You and i spoke that day after the hamas attack on israel, In The Beginning of this war. And it is not that often we hear from human rights experts. I just want to get your sense of what has transpired over the past two weeks, and now that we are two weeks from that say, how do you see the Human Rights Situation that has played out on both sides . The situation surely was, since we spoke, what is unfolding under our eyess humanitarian and political catastrophe. Of epic proportions. And it is humanitarian catastrophe, there are, already, 4300 victims, palestinians killed, and 1500 of these are children. 13, 000 injured. There is over 1 million, 1, 000, 400 displaced, half 1 million are sheltered in schools. There are no water. There are three meters of water a day, when the normal consumption should be 100. And there is no fuel. So, the hospitals, cannot function. There are kids, there are children, newborns, risking to die in hospitals. What is this . Is this really selfdefense . It is absolutely from the International Community is still to pacing whether a ceasefire should be declared or not. To that point, both sides have, both sides have committed war crimes in the eyes of the International Community. Both sides think the other side is committing war crimes that the gate what they are doing. And i think that is a very dangerous situation. But when you look at the International Community, as you, say has the International Rules based system failed at this moment . Personally, i think that the situation, and that nearby palestinian territory, was already evidence of the failure of the International Law based system before october 7th. Because it is the protracted and tolerated impunity of israels actions in the occupied palestinian territory, the colonization, the annexation plan, the blockade of gaza. We are already talking of war crimes. There is no excuse for whats hamas done. And i think i condemned those actions immediately, the first time you invited me here, said there are war crimes and there should be accounted for. But the self defense, under article 51 of the u. N. Charter that israel claims, is not whats happening, because you could see the Evacuation Order of 1. 1 million palestinians from north gaza, to move them south, well of the south has also been destroyed and continues to be bombed. The tightening of an unlawful blockade, which has meant no water, fuel, electricity, and food at such a time, and by the, way the 20 convoys bringing some needed supplies, this is not enough. Before the 7th of october, there were hundreds of convoys bringing in essential supplies. And it was not enough. So, what can we do with 20 . Especially there is no fuel allowed in. So, you can see that from the announcement, from the arguments of israeli leaders, there is an intent to not only eradicate tomas, from gaza, whatever that means, because its very opaque. There is also an intention to push up the palestinians from gaza. And that said, they can go to sinai, well corridors, humanitarian corridors, could be open to the west bank, which is part of the occupied palestinian territory, or to southern israel. And so why do you think they havent done that . The suggestion you say to open a humanitarian corridor to the west bank. Because this is not what emerges from the intention of the israeli political leadership. Their intention is to move the palestinians out of gaza. And but the intention, i also said look at the practice. They are in a fog of war, israel is already ethnically displaced hundreds of thousands of palestinians in 40 7 49, before the war with other countries in may 48, or 300, 000 palestinians had already been displaced, and 450, 000 until 1949. Then, in 1967, another 350, 000 palestinians were displaced, and this is the act of violence that has pushed mass displacement, but theres also the day, the silent knock on revocation of residency permits, and by the way, you know in gaza, sorry, in the west bank and east jerusalem, they are already over 17 palestinians who have been killed, and hurt. Theres communities who have been pushed out as of the 7th of october. So, away from Ethnic Cleansing is the reality of palestinians and. Or let me ask you, because a lot of people have made this point early on the air here in the u. S. , which is what is egypts role in this . A lot of people say, why isnt egypt opening its border . Why isnt egypt letting in more aid and letting the palestinians out . What is the legal obligation that egypt is under here from an International Law perspective . Look. Every state is obliged to ensure compliance with International Law. Particularly, i would, say the most radical issue is to relax the right of Self Determination of the Palestinian People. Egypt, as well as jordan and other countries in the region have absolved a lot of the forced displacement of the palestinians. They are wary that this might happen again. They know that is not the, opening humanitarian corridors. But also, i have been one to get. Expert calling for humanitarian corridors and a day after Human Rights Organizations from gaza telling me, to realize what you are doing . Because we risk to lose the last bits of palestine that remains to us. No matter how unlivable it is. So of course, egypt has responsibility, and in my view, had responsibility before the 7th of october, because it has imposed it has helped israel enforce the blockade. But now, the main responsibility is with israel, and of course, with the parts of the International Community who was sheltering israel from responsibilities. This is a time to act even handedly towards both the palestinians and israelis, and assuring all possible responsible for war crimes from hamas and because really side to justice. Francesca albanese, thank you so much. I really appreciate it. I know its been a very difficult couple of weeks. I really appreciate your time, thank you. After the break, we are going to switch gears and talk about politics here in the United States. How conservative media broke the gop, and has left us without a House Speaker for almost three weeks now. all toooo youuuuu sean i wish for the amazing new iphone 15 pro jason sean do you mean this one the one with titanium . Its so light. Dont touch it. Maybe stealing wishes from the birthday boy is not your best plan switch to verizon and get iphone 15 pro on them. sean what . jason yup, and on an Amazing Network sean and i dont have to ruin anymore Birthday Parties jason yeah, that ship has sailed. Lets go get you the iphone. Here we go, come on hon. vo get iphone15 pro, apple tv 4k and 6 months of apple one. All three on us. Only on verizon. Heres why you should switch from chrome to duckduckgo. Duckduckgo is a browser you download to your mobile and desktop devices. Unlike chrome, the Duckduckgo Browser has privacy builtin. It comes with a private alternative to google search, which doesnâ– t spy on your searches, and it blocks cookies and creepy ads. And theres no catch. Its free. We make money from ads, but they dont follow you around. All right, so it has been join the millions of people taking back their privacy by Downloading Duckduckgo On Mobile and desktop today. More than two weeks since the House Of Representatives losses speaker, and whether the ability to actually do any legislative business or work. With less than 30 days until the next Government Shutdown deadline, theres actually no sign that the Lower Chamber will get its act together and reopen anytime soon. On friday, in fact, House Republicans ditch their lead to speaker pick, congressman jim jordan, opening the field up once again as the country waits for the gop to get its act together. This entire ordeal has already exposed what Michelle Caudle calls the dark flaw at the heart of this congress. In a new piece for the new york times, she writes that right now, quote, the republican conference is failing as a democratic entity. As coddle points out, every healthy democracy needs to accept a basic will of the majority model. Where french factions of rights, but they dont actually get to run the show. Instead, the Republican Party has been shifting towards an anti majoritarian, four down the system ethos, where time after time, the preferences and wellbeing of the many are simply abandoned in favor of the desire of the extremist view. From the Freedom Congress to congressman max gatess group of rebels, two hardliners in the gop, they have, all at some, point taken the house and effectively, our country, as a result, hostage. They are destroying their own party in that process. As politicos Jonathan Martin puts it, there is no longer a cohesive Republican Party. There is a pretrump gop and a post trump gop, living together uneasily. They may be roommates, but they are certainly not married. Lets discuss this now, former democratic congresswoman Donna Edwards of maryland. She is now an msnbc political analyst, and columnist for the washington post. Also, with us, christina greer. Morning public colors here of the city culture new york. Ladies, its great to have both of you with us. Congresswoman, i will start with you. You know, the reaction you have to this world wind week on capitol hill. Youve got congressman jordan now out, several gop lawmakers throwing their hat into the ring, do you believe that, you know, this caucus could actually rally behind a single candidate or the ideological divide is just too stark to be overcome . Well, im not really sure they can. In, fact this is a reminder of the five families of the sopranos. The fact is that republicans have not been able to come together on a speaker. It is not really clear to me that any of the over the last couple of days. Results in a maturity decision by the Republican Party and options for them is to do what Hakeem Jeffries says the democratic leader, is to come together with democrats and republicans who are interested in governing in this really important, crucial time period for the United States and for the world. But i just dont see thats happening anytime soon. Christina, what do you make of that piece that i was talking about a moment ago, this new york times, from the new york times, and the belief that the republican conference is actually failing as a democratic entity, that it is just simply not functioning in the way that Healthy Party should be in a democracy . Ayman, it absolutely is not. If it was, we wouldve had a bigger several days or weeks ago. We wouldve had mccarthy not had mccarthy asked in the first place. Whats happened to so many of the republican members of congress, a, either or the limelight, the, they want to be antagonists, see, they just want to stick it to the dems for no reason. But the vast majority have zero vision for the American Public or moving america democracy forward. Thats on interest for them. So, when youre trying to coalesce around a leader, you have just loss of personal interests, i would implore all members of congress, but especially republicans, to refresh themselves and read federalist ten, because the framers warmed us about sort of the rise of infections, and we have seen this, you, know and we saw this in 2010 with the tea party. They were more interest they were not interested in truth, they were not interested in facts that were not interested in governance, and they definitely werent interested in Coalition Building. We know nothing has ever happened in this country to move us forward without substantive Coalition Building across the aisle. Hakeem jeffries has extended the olive branch demands time again. There is no question about whitewood it a few sensible republicans come over and vote for Hakeem Jeffries . Democrats clearly know how to coalesce and get legislation passed for the American People. Republicans clearly dont. We need to make sure the American People are well aware that republicans are the ones that are preventing them from moving forward in the democratic principles. Im so glad you brought up the point about the democrats and coalescing around Hakeem Jeffries, because ive got to ask you about this, congresswoman. You know, republicans have been trying to blame the democrats for this chaos. No ones buying, it but its typical republican behavior and you have the congress, congressman austin scott, who had the audacity, and now that hes running for, speaker said that we wouldnt be in the situation if the Democratic Caucus didnt vote with these eight House Republicans to oust kevin mccarthy. How do you think that line of attack will play with the American People . Is it going to resonate, or do you think the American People see what this is all about, that the republicans cannot get their act together . Well, im smiling and trying to keep from laughing. Because this is so typically republicans blame all the chaos and the morass on democrats instead of owning up to their own responsibility. Republicans are the ones who have the majority. Theyre the ones who took out their own speaker, and theyre the ones who actually have to restore some sanity to their own party. Is not the responsibility of democrats to rebuild the Republican Party. That is in the republican house. And frankly, i think the American Public is not going to buy any of it. We can see the chaos unfold, on full display. And i think the only thing for the American People is the worry, one, whats going to happen with a Government Shutdown looming, and still no speaker in place in order to do business, and to, what it is that the American Voters can do in the upcoming election to really get rid of this kinds of insanity and factionalism . But i dont see thats kind of leadership really coming out of the Republican Party, and i dont think thats a single American Voter is at all confused about who bears the responsibility for the chaos. I was going to say, i totally agree with you. I will probably go one step further. Its not the democrats can save the Republican Party, i dont think the republicans can safely Republican Party and rebuild it at this point. Donna, christina, please stick around. Im going to talk to you just after the break. We are going to discuss the Dueling Gag Orders on donald trump and how he is already been accused of violating them. Of violating them. Ready. Is your treatment leaving you with uncontrolled symptoms . Like the coveritups and brushitoffs . Enough with good enoughs. Dont stay hiding or hurting. 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Unlike chrome, the Duckduckgo Browser has privacy builtin. It comes with a private alternative to google search, which doesnâ– t spy on your searches, and it blocks cookies and creepy ads. And theres no catch. Its free. We make money from ads, but they dont follow you around. Despite being orange, donald join the millions of people taking back their privacy by Downloading Duckduckgo On Mobile and desktop today. Trump has failed to rein in his attacks on the Men And Women deciding his legal fate. This, week we saw the first glimpse of accountability. The judge presiding over Donald Trumps 250 Million DollarCivil Fraud Trial has find the ex president 5, 000 for violating the terms of a gag order imposed this month. Judge Arthur Engoron had even raised the possibility of putting the ex precedent in prison after trump failed to remove a Post Trashing the judges law clerk on social media. The Posting Question remained visible on Trumps Campaign website for two pull weeks before finally being taken down. And current warns, quote, Incendiary Untruths can have, cant and have led to serious physical harm. Before asking trumps lawyers to explain why trump should not be punished or even imprisoned. Trumps attorney apologized on his behalf, saying the violation was unintentional. Meanwhile, trump was subjected to another partial gag order this week in washington, d. C. With judge tanya chutkan, restricting him from making public statements attacking witnesses, specific prosecutors, and even court Staff Members involved in the federal election interference case. Chutkan struck down trumps First Amendment claims, saying his Free Speech Rights do not permit him to quote, launch a potential smear campaign. Joining us once again, jessica levinson, msnbc columnist in law school professor, and congresswoman Donna Edwards, and christina greer. Are still with me. Jessica, lets get your reaction. 5000 dollar fine, i would say a pretty startling statement by judge engoron. Absolutely. And what he said is if this happens again, whether or not it is inadvertent, there will be much more dire consequences. So, he is not taking the Nuclear Option off the table. The Nuclear Option, of, course is to be found in contempt of courts and actually be incarcerated. I dont think that is what will happen if there is a next time. I think there are steps along the way. I think first, there would be a much larger fine. Then a warning, and then maybe if there is a third time, were potentially talking about incarceration. But we have to judge us now. Once state court judge, and one federal judge, saying very seriously, that it does impact the trials, that it does impact the witnesses, and it does impact the court staff so much. They have to protect the administration of justice and do that by limiting the former president can say. Congresswoman, how about trumps attorney here, arguing via, you know, he violated this gag order unintentionally . Has he ever see trumps social media posts or has he ever even attended a rally speech . It doesnt seem convincing donald trump would do something unintentionally, then, leave it up on his social site for two weeks. Well, the judge wasnt buying it, either. Because it seems that donald trump doesnt do anything that is unintentional. He is very clear about his words. He follows his own social media, his media posts. He follows his own campaign, so, i think the judge was rightfully holding Donald Trumps responsibility for a campaign that bears his name, and the Campaign Website that bears his name. So, maybe this will make trump more careful in the future. I think it is doubtful. And i see those ever escalating fines and potential jail time in Donald Trumps future, because its hard to imagine he is going to stop what he has been engaged in, really, for the last seven years. Christina, trump was event, during the actual trial, was worn by judge engoron to keep it down after he grew animated while a witness was testifying against him in this Civil Fraud Trial. You know, what is your reaction to this petulant outburst from trump, even in a trial where i think the most average citizen would know to be respectful, be mindful of the process, not be donald trump . Right, but amen, he knows he is not the average citizen. He can hide behind the shield of being a former president. So, just as congresswoman said, i think he will actually keep pushing the envelope, because asked the judge, you, know levies more fines or threatens jail time, all that does is help donald trump raise more money with his sick fans who believes this is some large conspiracy from barack obama, hillary clinton, and joe biden to try to suppress his voice. So, if you are dealing with a man with no shame, no values, and no norms, he will continue to essentially overstepped the line, and he goes back to his supporters and he justifies his position. And they follow it. So, i think that the justices in these two court cases specifically, they know what theyre doing. But they are also up against someone that we have never seen this before. If we had 1 for every time we said unprecedented, in don sharper this person to go time. So, we are in uncharted waters, donald trump knows, that and anything he says or does, he can do. Right back to his supporters and let them know this is abuse by joe biden and the democrats. Speaking of that, Jessica Terms of what trump is doing and how the charges are reacting to, its kind of impressive. He keeps saying he is using his Free Speech Rights, when he attacked these people and they are trying to silence him. But frederik baron i argue chuck his partial gag order was crafted to withstand a First Amendment claim with her focus on trumps conduct that could be expected to increase the risk of violence to anyone in the trial process. Do you think that this raises the guardrails against a First Amendment appeal, if he decides to pursue it . Yes. This was a very careful and narrowly crafted gag order by judge chutkan. And lets be clear, she didnt give the prosecution all they asked for. In fact, she said lets look at just which types of statements would most affected the trial and the administration of justice. She mentioned the court staff. She mentioned the special prosecutor, and she mentioned likely potential witnesses. Everybody in thats buckets, we can all understand why you would not want them to fear for their lives, or fear for their safety when they have to go to work, do their jobs, be the courts clerk. Go to work and be a member of the department of justice, or potentially testify. With respect to the First Amendment, you have a very smart audience, and they want to remind everybody, the First Amendment is not absolute. I teach an entire semester on the First Amendment. It would be one day if it was absolute. There are limitations, and one of those limitations means that we can allow for criminal trials or civil trials to proceed without people being under the type of risk and threats and degradation that the foreigner president s words could potentially put them on there. That is exactly why we love having you on the show, because you always make us a little bit smarter with that. Jessica, i understand, i have to ask, though, trump no stranger to going after women, especially women of color. But despite the constant attacks, the death threats. Chuck cain has been receiving, shes actually shown no signs she has been intimidated by him. What is your take . How frustrated do you think trump is his Intimidation Efforts have failed against her, have failed against the new York Attorney general Letitia James, who has been very determined to push ahead in pursuit of justice. Right. I mean, we know donald trump has always had a particular disdain for African Americans, specifically women. And African American women, most specifically. I mean, attorney general Letitia James has been unmoved and unbothered by all of this. But you know, we have to recognize, though, that these words actually do mean something. We do have to look over our shoulders as women of color who speak out against the former president , because he has been so effective in inciting his base in the most vitriolic and violent ways. But you, know judge chutkan and Laetitia James have been steadfast in their belief thats what they are doing is for the greater good of american democracy. It is not partisan. It is not for some sort of personal vendetta or some personal advancement. This is something for donald trump has done these several crimes and he has to be brought to justice like every other american citizen. All right. Donna edwards, christina greer, jessica levinson, thank you so much to the three of you for joining us. We really appreciate it. After the break, and speaking with josh paul, a veteran state Department Official who just resigned over the Biden Administrations expanded provisions of lethal weapons to israel. Weapons to israel. Is busting laundrys biggest myth. That cold water cant clean. Cold water, on those stains . Cold water cant clean tough stains . Id say that myth is busted. Turn to col , with tide. Tourists tourists that turn into scientists. Tourists taking photos that are analyzed by ai. So researchers can help life underwater flourish. He hits his mark center stage and is crushed by a baby grand piano. Youre replacing me . Customize and save with liberty bibberty. He doesnt even have a mustache. Only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. After advil lets dive in but. What about your back . Its fineeeeeeee [splash] before advil Advil Dual Action fights pain two ways. Advil targets pain at the source, acetaminophen blocks pain signals. Advil dual action. We are witnessing a small but growing internal pushback against both the Biden Administration and congress for americas current Policy Stances and positions on israel. Late this week, more than 400 capitol hill staffers anonymously signed an open letter, calling for a ceasefire in gaza, saying, quote, we have appreciated seeing nearly every member of Congress Quick express quick and unequivocal solidarity with the israeli people, but we are profoundly disturbed that such shows of humanity have barely been extended to the Palestinian People. Now, the letter follows the resignation of a state Department Employee with more than a decade of experience overseeing u. S. Arms sales in the region. That official, josh ball, cited americas expanding provision of lethal weapons to israel. In its response to hamass attack for his decision to leave now. In a letter posted on linkedin, paul said, i believe to the courts of my soul that the response israel is taking, and with it, the american support, both for that response and for the status quo of the occupation, will only lead to more and deeper suffering for both the israeli and the Palestinian People. Josh paul towards me now. Josh, its great to have you with us. So, i just read a passage from your resignation letter. Lots of questions come to mind, but expand on why you decided to leave the administration this week in particular. Yeah, thank you very much for having me. So, the idea we should not provide weapons into a situation where there are likely to lead to massive civilian casualties should not be a controversial one. And in, fact has not been a controversial one for the Biden Administration. One of the very first things they did upon taking office, in fact, within about 20 minutes of being sworn in, on january 20th, 2021, was to direct the state to suspend two arms sales of precision guided missiles to saudi led coalition. Those sales remain suspended. And yet, in the context of israels war with hamas, what we have seen our already significant, massive civilian casualties. And yet, there is no pause whatsoever. The directive is to rush to israel whatever weapons it requires a requests. And in that context, it is really, the context of the war in gaza, what we see under the casualties that are happening, and the absence of any debate in washington, at least within the holes of the State Department, and in congress, the letters used to post red shows, that there is no room for this sort of typical discussion that were having for thinking about is this the right thing to be doing, and should we be providing weapons into a situation in which we know that civilian harm, significant civilian harm, will happen. And in the absence of that debate, i had to send out. To put a finer point on that, and use your words, a lack of debate about this decision. Some would say, why not stay in and fight inside the administration for a better policy than resigned that . Are you saying that there isnt a process inside the State Department for a robust debate as to whether this is good policy . Yes, thats right. I have taken part in my fair share, and there have been many, debates over the last ten years plus about the pros and cons of arms sales to countries with troublesome human rights records. And its actually being able to play a role in these debates and shipped the outcomes, and always, you, know not always being content with where they land. But knowing that best as i could and many others in the department could, that we could hand them over to congress, where there will also be debates, possibly hearings, possibly against the resolutions. But again, in the situation, there is no debate in that department. There is no Spacesuit Debate in congress. The only space for dub a, it seems, is in the public sphere, and that is why i bring this conversation, too. Since you are somebody who was on the inside, and its not something that most of us will ever get a chance to see, explain what do you explain that to that there is no debate around the secular issue when it comes to israel, within the State Department . You give examples of saudi arabia. Why is there not a robust debate about u. S. Foreign policy or u. S. Arms sale, specifically, to israel in a time before like this . So, this goes to something that i mentioned in my statement on linkedin, which speaks to the political convenience of the position the Biden Administration has taken. I think israel, for many reasons, some of them quite important, historically, its a third rail when it comes to criticism. It, would be a curricula to stand up on this particular issue, unlike arms sales to others with dubious human rights records. I think as well there is a concern, you know, that tendency to say who can stand up on behalf of israel, who can be the most forward leaning, and i think the Biden Administration is also not keen for that to play out within the democratic party. So, i think that is part of why there isnt this place to debate. It is highly political. What would you say is the way the administration should be going about this right now . What would you like to see the Biden Administration do differently if there were a robust debate inside the State Department announcement . A few things. That first is that there are actually frameworks in place, but they are not being used right now. That provide guidelines for how we should be having this debate for. Example, in february, the Biden Ministration announced a new convention arms transfer policy. That policy establishes, for the firsttime, something called the more likely than not standard. If it is more likely than not thats arms that are being provided or close to be provided are going to be used for human rights violations, that they will not be authorized. All im asking is for the Biden Administration to stick to its policies, let alone its own, you know, there are also laws that there are challenges in that sort of this as well. So, there are a number of laws and processes and policies that could be followed and could be discussed or debated. But are not being. This week, you probably also saw on thursday night, President Biden announcing a white house request for more funding for both ukraine and israel, to the tune of 105 billion dollars. What do you make of the administrations decision to lump these two requests together . Is that good, or is that dangerous for my Foreign Policy perspective . So honestly, i think its inevitable in the current climate. There is only going to be one trough at a supplemental, and you know, it makes sense for everything to be in that one shot, because if you start peace mailing it out, there is no way anything is going to get past. At the same time, i do have my concerns. First of all, i think that the situation in ukraine is vastly different to the situation in israel. In fact, the role i have played, sort of role, in providing those unitias to ukraine, its one of the proudest things ive done while working in the State Department. But i dont understand how we could be fighting against a brutal russian invasion on one hand, and supporting an occupation on the other. All, right just ball. Thank you so much for your time. I greatly appreciate it. I know its been a very busy week for you, but thanks for making time for us this evening. My pleasure. Thank you very much. Ahead, final thoughts on the word tonight from the former Saudi Arabian ambassador to the United States. 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Liberty mutual customized my Car Insurance and i saved hundreds. With the money i saved, i started a dog walking business. Oh. [dog barks] no its just a bunny only pay for what you need. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. Liberty. This week on saudi arabias Foreign Minister to the United States spoke before the Baker Institute for Public Policy think tank at rice university. While he is no longer in, government he is widely considered one of the regions most respected diplomats. And elder statesman who served as the head of the Saudi Intelligence Service for more than 20 years. He is known to still be pretty close to the royal, policymaking and he called out an issue he major news. And i want you to listen to his remarks, not as nearly because they have geopolitical importance, but in the fog of war, at this time of fraud emotion, of rage, of pain, it is worth reflecting on instances of sober, moral clarity. I categorically condemn hamas is targeting of civilian targets of any age or gender. And it is accused of. Such targeting belies hamas claim to an islamic identity. There is an islamic injunction, against the killing of innocent children, women, and others. He injunction is also against the desecration of i also condemn hamass gifting the higher moral ground to an Israeli Government that is universally shunned. Even by half of the israeli public as fascist, miscreant, and a warrant. I condemn hamas for giving this all four government be excused to ethnically cleanse gaza of its citizens, bombing them to oblivion. At a moment when israel is gearing up for what could be monthslong Ground Invasion of gaza, a campaign that will unsettle a massive population that is half comprised of children, just recounting some of the horrors the Palestinian People have endured such far. I condemn israels indiscriminate bombing of palestinian innocent civilians in gaza. And the attempt to forcibly drive them into i condemn them for incarcerating palestinian women, children, and men in Concentration Camps without recourse or due process. I condemn israels targeted killings and assassinations of palestinians. I condemn israel for funneling guttering money to hamas. The Terrorist Group as defined by israel. I condemn western politicians for shedding tears when israelis are killed by palestinians. Butturff used to even express sorrow when israelis killed palestinians. There are no heroes in this conflict, only victims. Standby. All right, tomorrow night, the prince will join me live to talk about the war in gaza. And thank you for making time for us, come back tomorrow night, nine eastern here right here on msnbc, former israelbased nbc correspondent Martin Fletcher joins us after he learned that two of his relatives were held hostage by hamas and were released. Until then, i am a man, have a good night. Have a good night. Have a good night. 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