Transcripts For MSNBCW The 20240704

What it means for Donald Trumps former lawyer. Seemingly not moving the needle for 2024. How this will all play out on the Campaign Trail as The 11th Hour gets underway on this tuesday night good evening once again, i am stephanie ruhle. Former president Donald J Trump now has ten days to surrender to face allegations he and 18 other people were behind a Criminal Racketeering Enterprise to reverse the 2020 Election Results in the State Of Georgia. I am giving the defendants the opportunity to voluntarily surrender no later than noon on friday, the 25th day of august, 2023. Tonight, georgia officials said its expected that trump and his codefendants will be booked at the Fulton County jail. The 41 count indictment, unsealed late, late last night, describes a wide ranging plot that went beyond the infamous find me 11,000 votes phone call. According to da fani willis, it also included the appointment of fake electors, efforts to access voting machines, harassment of an election worker, and attempts to try to reverse the results in other battleground states. Tonight, a former Trump White House lawyer commented on the indictment. I think it was important to georgia and, certainly important to her, to have trump as a defendant. The court is against trump and the significant defendants is very, very strong case. Very, very strong case. Those are the words of trumps old lawyer. One of trumps codefendants has already taken steps to separate himself from the case. Former Trump White House Chief Of Staff mark meadows has filed to have the charges against him moved to Federal Court. Meanwhile, some legal experts think that the georgia case could take a long time, because a number of the defendants and the complex racketeering charges. Thats where donald trump himself, this, of course, is his fourth indictment since april. He is now facing a total of 91 felony charges. With that, lets get smarter, with the help of our Leadoff Panel tonight greg bluestein, who, i assure you, has been working overtime, a political reporter reporter for the atlanta journalconstitution, an msnbc legal contributor. Former missouri senator and msnbc political analyst claire mccaskill, and kristy greenberg, a former federal prosecutor and former sdny Criminal Division deputy chief. Claire, i turn to you first. You are also a former prosecutor. You know the law. Mark meadows is now saying he wants a federal trial, because he was acting as a white house official. This guy gave up a safe and a very influential seat in the house to briefly become Donald Trumps Chief Of Staff. And now he finds himself criminally indicted. What do you think of his entire situation . Well, its interesting. Because there was a lot of speculation that he was cooperating, that he had flipped. But clearly, him being unnamed indictment, it doesnt appear that thats the case, at least in georgia. Him asking for removal is not a surprise, stephanie. I think we see that motion from him, from trump, and also jeffrey clark. And they are using a law that allows someone who has a coverable claim they were acting in their official capacity as a federal officeholder, or as a federal employee. Now, is it going to make it complicated . Is it going to drag this thing out because we are going to have litigation over the removal . Yeah. Its going to do that. But at the end of the day, remember, even if he gets a federal removal, he is still going to be tried on georgia charges, with georgia prosecutors. The only difference is the jury pool will be slightly more favorable. It is still overwhelmingly a Biden Victory even in the Northern District of georgia. So, i dont think this is going to get him home free, even if he succeeds in this motion. And there is a lot of argument whether the motion even has merit. Its a coverable claim, probably. At least there is a stronger claim then what trump had in manhattan where he paid off Appoints Arbery for he even got elected president they said, no, you dont get the protection of going to Federal Court when you pay off a porn star before you are president. But, in this case, this is going to get litigated. Its going to take some time. Kristy, what do you think . Does he have any real shot of getting this thing moved to Federal Court . Or is this just a delay tactic . So, the way meadows attorney puts it in his papers well, the thing that these hes alleged to have done, like setting up a meeting, setting up a call, those are things that would be within his official duties as a Chief Of Staff. But you need to look a little bit further. What was the call he set up . Well, he set up the socalled perfect call with the georgia secretary of state. And what did meadows do in that call . Well, he was trying to get the secretary of states data, to basically try to shore up claims of election fraud. They were very clear parts of that call where meadows is trying to that has nothing to do with being a Chief Of Staff. That is him being Donald Trumps henchmen, and trying to get data that was protected by law that he was not entitled to. There was also another part of the indictment, where meadows is alleged to have participated in meeting with donald trump to request a memo from a john mcatee on how to disrupt and delay the certification of the vote on january six before congress. How in the world are they going to argue that that would have been within his official cheugys duties as a Chief Of Staff . So, it seems like a loser to me. But we will see what happens. The one thing i would note is that even if it does get removed Federal Court im not sure that he would necessarily fare much better there. Greg bluestein, we keep reading about georgia officials are now preparing for booking. Tell us what we know about that. Because we sort of prepared for it in florida, and in d. C. And trump got really special treatment. Yeah, we got word from Fulton County officials, just a few hours ago, that they expect all the bookings to be done at the Fulton County jail, which is a facility that most folks here in atlanta would never wish even on their worst enemies. It is plagued by problems. It is constantly overcrowded. It is facing civil rights complaints. Its now subject to a Justice Department civil rights investigation. And the county paid out a 4 Million Dollar settlement to a family of a 35yearold cheney who died last year in a Mental Health cell. So, the facility is plagued with all sorts of pressure that came, at least, from the Fulton County officials said, it is open 24 7, and they expect the defendants to surrender at any moment over the next week and a half. Kristy, as a former prosecutor, does it surprise you when we have seen donald trump show up in the last two, he is not showing up with his wife, or any Family Members . No allies by his side just his lawyers you know, its hard to say. I think most criminal defendants, when they are facing criminal charges, you do expect to see someone they are in their corner, particularly if they are needed to, perhaps, cosign a bond, or for bail purposes. Usually there is someone there to provide support. But maybe donald trump is making a political calculation that he doesnt want to give this make it seem more important than it is, and he can just write it off as, this is a witch hunt. And so thats why i dont want to make it seem like this is Something Worthy of me trotting out my family for this. But i would anticipate it being very different if there is a trial, particularly in georgia, where a trial would be televised. I think then, you probably would see many Family Members, if nothing else, to try to influence a jury. Claire, this one surprised me. Chris christie, who has been going after donald trump harder than almost anybody in the last few months, who clearly thinks trump has no business returning to the white house, is actually taking issue with the indictment, saying its unnecessary because jack smith basically has all this covered. What do you think about that . First of all, i had to laugh out loud. I spit coffee when i read what he said, because he said, well, clearly, fani willis is just exercising her ego. And im going lately, by the . Youve got one of the biggest egos that have has ever walk the halls of government. So, it is just ironic that Chris Christie is doing that. And i think Chris Christie is also and i will say this with some bias, as a State Prosecutor i think he has got federal bias. I think that once you have been in the federal system, no offense to my fellow panel member, but there is a little bit of a rub between State Prosecutors and federal prosecutors. With the State Prosecutors always assuming the federal prosecutors think they are better and smarter, and while the State Prosecutors think they do all the hard work. So, it might be a little biased towards the federal system here that Chris Christie is talking about. And ive got to jump in on your previous question. Im going to tell you the truth. I dont think this family wants to be anywhere near him right now, unless its don junior and his girlfriend and eric. I think the rest of them have said, i think junior Jared Kushner has got his money from the saudis, i think ivanka brand and i think melania has had her fill of it ever since ridiculous stuff he refused to do on the day that people were attacking Police Officers in our capitol. I love that claire is like, im going to need to weigh in on this one. Kristy, what is your view on how this case has laid out . Does it seem to strong . Or too broad . Because the clock is ticking. And this thing is expansive, to say the least. It is. But i think it reflects real thought and careful work over two and a half years have an investigation. Remember, doj didnt start investigating until april of 2022, 15 months after january 6th. Fani willis was rolling up her sleeves and getting to work immediately after the events of january 6th. So, she has had some time, where she has built a case, not just against donald trump, but against his allies. And i think it is really important, not just for the State Interests that i agree with claire, there are real State Interests at issue here. Those election workers, Georgia State officials, who have been subjected to treatment that they shouldnt have been under the charge of the indictment but more than that, it is about showing the enablers of Criminal Conduct that, if you are within Donald Trumps inner circle, if you are within his orbit, that does not make you immune from the consequences of the law. And i think its a really Important Message and, again, 98 pages of dense charges in very clear detail i think she seems to have her ducks in a row. And we will see what happens, literally. Because this will be televised. Greg, what can you tell us about the Lead Prosecutor and the judge here . Well, the Lead Prosecutor is nathan wade, who is a longtime friend of fani willis, and a veteran prosecutor. And fani willis might end up trying key parts of this case as well. The judge is relatively new. Its been just a few months since he was appointed by brian or governor brian kemp, a republican. To the post hes a former prosecutor. Hes a former Inspector General of the State Of Georgia as well, a longtime prosecutor background and not much is known, though, about how he can handle such a complex case. Frankly, not much is known about how any judge can handle hes got his work cut out for him. Of course, we expect donald trump to file the same motion motion that donald mark meadows did we could see a new judge depending on how that looks. Right now it is looking like this relatively new judge on the bench will be handling those complex cases that you have ever seen in the State Of Georgia. Claire, as long as we are talking about you spitting out your coffee, i want to share what had me choking on mine. We have spent the last year and a half listening to donald trump, his allies, and rightwing media attack smartmatic, dominion voting machines. Go after these Voting Machine Companies relentlessly to the point where they have got these multi soon to be potentially billion dollar settlements, potentially, pending. And now he have got charges that it was these guys, trump and his allies, potentially trying to access these very machines. What is your take on that . I think the idea that they would find an election official and a political operative in a county 200 miles away from atlanta to cooperate and give them access to machines that should never be accessed by anyone outside of those who legitimately are authorized to deal with them it just shows you how far they went. And this is where meadows is going to have trouble. Because that part of the conspiracy really shows that they would go to Great Lengths to try to make up stuff to backup their big lie. And thats why this whole narrative is important. It is going to i get a headache as a Prosecutor Thinking about one of my witness is being crossexamined 19 times in one courtroom, at one time. That will be something to watch. It will be a drama. And by the way, this is not only one of the biggest cases georgia has ever seen. This is one of the biggest cases the world has ever seen. So, this will be a trial that, i think, when it is televised, it will be some of the highest ratings that we have probably ever seen in this country. It will make the oj trial look like a mere footnote compared to the circus that will be surrounding this particular trial. And my heart goes out to all of the lawyers and all of the Court Officials who are going to try to keep order under the circumstances. It will be major, no doubt. Kristy, give us a reality check. Because fani willis may have her ducks in a row. But there are a whole lot of ducks here. Is there any chance even one of these for trials is resolved before November 2024 . And the fact that there are four separate cases does that make it even less likely that they get results before election day . I think it depends on what you mean by resolved. So, i dont think a case will be completely done, meaning that there is a sentencing, and the appeal has been exhausted. But in terms of whether we can see a trial before the 2024 election, i think the answer is absolutely yes. I would expect that the January 6th Trial that goes forward first will be jack smiths and not fani willis is. Why . Both clearly have a strong Public Interest in happening, because you are talking about a former president , and a current president ial candidate being charged with overturning the results of the election. Theres a strong Public Interest in having that happen before voters have to cast their vote. But fani willis has charged 19 people. That is going to take some time. Discovery will take time. Lots of motions from lots of different defendants i dont see that happening within six months, which is what he said last night during her press conference. Whereas jack smith has one defendant, and he does have a judge in d. C. Who has indicated a willingness to move things along. So, i do think that will be the first trial to go. They have asked the special the Special Counsel has asked for january 2024. That seems a little ambitious. I think you are probably looking more at march or april. But i do think it will be within the first half of 2024 that we will see the i think it will be the first one. 19 defendants with one clear winner. Lawyers. Can you imagine the legal bills that will be racked up over the next year . Massive. It will rival campaign fundraising. Greg bluestein, claire mccaskill, and kristy greenberg, thank you all for starting us off on a really important night. When we come back decades ago, Rudy Giuliani made his name in new york. He led the way using Racketeering Laws as a prosecutor. Now, he himself is facing his own rico charge in georgia. Neal katyal well break down exactly what he is up against, and what is next for fani willis. And later, republicans responding to the fourth indictment of trump conor lamb and Stuart Stevens are here on how trumps growing legal problems are set to collide with the 2024 race. The 11th hour is just getting underway on a tuesday night. Is it only tuesday . Yes, it is, america. Meet three students all learning to save and spend their money with chase. Freedom for kids. Hungry . Thank you, chef. Control for parents. Nice. One bank for both. Chase. Make more of whats yours. My husband and i have never been more active. Shingles doesnt care. I go to spin classes with my coworkers. Good for you, shingles doesnt care. Because no matter how healthy you feel, your risk of shingles sharply increases after age 50. But shingrix protects. 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Disrupt the itch and rash of eczema. Talk to your doctor about rinvoq. Learn how abbvie can help you save. Meet the team all using chase to keep up with their finances. Smart bankers. Convenient tools. Boom. One bank with the power of both. Chase. Make more of whats yours. I do think that the work in my office and other parts of the Justice Department has changed the definition of the problem of crime in america. We are going to have to attack it as a business, not just as individual crime. We will follow up with civil rico cases. Maybe at some point in the future in which we will really destroy the power of mafia. Hard to believe seeing those videos former new york city mayor Rudy Giuliani is one of the 19 people, including donald trump, indicted yesterday on racketeering charges. But nearly four decades ago, hooley Rudy Giuliani was u. S. Attorney for the Southern District of new york. And he used those very same rico principles to take down the leadership of the infamous five families of new yorks organized crime. Tonight, giuliani called the rico charge against him ridiculous. Back with me tonight is neal katyal, Department Of Justice veteran and former Acting Solicitor General during the obama administration. His podcast, courtside, has a brandnew episode out on this indictment. And you must listen to. It neal, we keep hearing about racketeering. Can you explain exactly what that means, and how it applies in georgia . Yeah. So, the racketeering comes from a 1980 georgia law and, indeed, a 1970 federal law. And the idea was to take the conspiracy doctrine, which is a flexible tool that prosecutors use, to go after bad guys, and apply it to criminal enterprises. And so, in order for it to apply, youve got to have committed two or more predicate that are criminal in nature. So, it cant just be a oneoff kind of thing. And in a way, stephanie, its just so sad to see how far Rudy Giuliani has fell. When i was in law school, of course, after 9 11, he was someone that we all looked up to. And to go from that to four seasons landscaping, what criminal indictment is just unfathomable. This guy has been suspended from the bar the dc barr has recommended his disbarment last month. It is an unimaginable fall. It is. Especially for new yorkers who, there was a period of time where that guy wanted to be president. Ten years ago people thought he could have had a bridge named after him in new york. And now look where he is. Lets talk about this case and some are predicting that trump is going to try to get this move to Federal Court. Meadows already wants to do that. Do you think that trump is going to be successful . And even if he is, it is still in georgia. We still have the same prosecutor. A president would not be able to pardon someone convicted here. Right. So, there is definitely i think trump is going to move this case to the Federal Court, if for no other reason than, in Federal Courts, televised trials have never happened. Youd have to go to the Chief Justice and get a special order from the judicial conference. Otherwise, i think that should be granted. But that stands in stark contrast to georgia, in which televised criminal trials are the norm. And this trial would be televised in georgia. And so trump, who is afraid, like sunlight, the way vampires are afraid of sunlight and garlic, is going to do Everything Possible to try and have this case in Federal Court. You are absolutely right. If it is moved to Federal Court, it doesnt mean that it federal prosecutors and the United States Justice Department who will run the prosecution. It doesnt mean that a future president could pardon. But it does change the rules like televised trials and the like. I think, stephanie, that these Removal Actions will fail. It is true that there is a law, pass after the civil war, that gives federal employees in certain circumstances the right to move a federal case to Federal Court. But it doesnt apply here. I think there are three reasons. One is you have to be performing a federal function. And donald trump, as president , or mark meadows, as his Chief Of Staff, are not performing a federal function. The president , in our constitution, has huge sweeping powers. But the one place our founder said the president had no role is with the electoral college. And for the best of reasons. Because, who is the person who has the most Self Interest in the electoral college, how it functions, how the votes are president counted . The president , the sitting president. So, our founders cut the president entirely out of the electoral college. And in order for this case to be moved for any of the defendants, they have to be performing the federal function. These folks just werent. The second thing is, theres no federal coverable offense, which is necessary. I dont think theres any Immunity Claim or anything like that that is going to cut the mustard. And lastly, in order to remove a case to Federal Court, you cant put too much of a burden on state court, state officials. Thats what the Supreme Court said 30 years ago. And obviously moving the trial to Federal Court would impose that burden. So, i dont think its going anywhere. Its a long answer. Sorry for all the details. But basically, bottom line, this move, i think, will fail. No, we want to detail. We need it, especially tonight. Fani willis wants this thing to go to trial within six months. What happens to Trumps Campaign if he gets convicted while he is actively running for president . Yeah, so, i think that there is a very strong case that, if he is convicted under the georgia charges, he cannot he isnt eligible to serve as president under the 14th amendment, section three, again, passed after the civil war, boring insurrectionists from running for office. A group of couple of conservative very prominent Law Professors rhoden article about this thats gotten a lot of attention. So, i think just as a legal matter, he will be ineligible if asked point. But secondly, you are asking about the consequences, that i know donald trump says, every time he is indicted, it helps him, and all this stuff helps him. If so, then i dont know what he is complaining about. Why is he saying that biden and the District Attorney in georgias acting politically, if trump says it helps him, then hes talking about both sides of his mouth but ultimately, i do think if he is convicted, and of course hes entitled to the presumption of innocence, although right now the indictments look damning against him if he is convicted, i think the American People will move their support away from him. This is a country that really believes in the legal process, even in hot button contested cases like the george floyd case in which i was a special prosecutor. People were at such loggerheads before the trial. But after the trial, when all the evidence was heard, and the jury verdicts came in, people respected it No Matter What their initial starting points. And i think a similar thing is possible here, particularly if all americans get to watch this trial on television, which is what the georgia rules require. We are so lucky to have you here. Neal, i have about 48 more questions. I do not have any more time. So, number one, will you please come back tomorrow night . I dont know about tomorrow, but i will come back, absolutely. Im always here for you. I want you to think about tomorrow. And, for our audience, you are in luck. You need to listen to that podcast, because, potentially, hes answering all 48 of my questions on it. You should definitely take a listen. Neal, good to see you. Thank you so much. When we come back twice impeached, indicted four times, and he is still the gop front runner. Why some of his 2024 rivals and other republicans still cant quit him, when The 11th Hour continues. Continues. With a big story to tell. I take oncedaily jardiance, at each days staaart. As time went on it was easy to seee. Im lowering my a1c. Jardiance works 24 7 in your body to flush out some sugar and for adults with Type 2 Diabetes and known Heart Disease, jardiance can lower the risk of cardiovascular death, too. 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Colorado congressman kim ba with more reserved in his criticism of the indictment that many of his, colleagues who took it to a whole other level. There is a two Tiered System of justice. It seems there is one for donald trump, and one for everyone else. Consistently we are seeing democrats weaponize the legal system against opponents. This is about revenge, not about justice. This is indictment, what, about 200 . Across states in the federal government to make sure anybody who criticizes them get indicted. From the Department Of Justice, all the way down to these state das actually conspiring to stop donald trump from winning the 2024 election. Christopher wray gets sent packing. You are going to see the doj cleared out. We are going to see a single standard of justice in this country again. Reminder Christopher Wray ran the fbi when trump was in office too. Back with me tonight, former democratic congressman conor lamb of pennsylvania, who is also a former federal prosecutor, and Stuart Stevens, veteran of the mitt romney and george w. Bush president ial campaigns. He is now with the lincoln project. Stuart, Georgia Governor Brian Kemp is now one of the few republicans telling the truth, that the 2020 election was not stolen. There may be a place for him at liz cheneys house for dinner, or on mitt romneys Christmas Card list. But is there a place for him in the party . He won handily his last election. Yeah, listen. I actually think that if brian kemp is sort of a model for how republicans could act here. The secretary of states in every state election officials. They are more republican secretary of states in 2020 than there were democrats. Not one of the said there was any problem with the elections in their states. So, this is just absurd. And calling it a revenge i dont understand this. Biden won. What sort of revenge would it be . And this is just a continuation of an attack on american institutions that the Republican Party started when they brought into trump in 2016. And the end result of this is they really want to push toward an authoritarian rule instead of democracy, because they see democracy now as a problem. Democracy is not selecting them. Therefore, democracy must therefore, we must go to a different system. Conor, all these republicans who keep saying, this is the weaponization of our government and the Department Of Justice, who are saying they should get decided that the ballot box it did get decided in the ballot box. Donald trumps conduct was decided at the ballot box in 2020 and the midterms. Why exactly the republicans want to do that again . Yeah, the problem with that, of course, hes he tried to destroy the ballot boxes or discard the results. And so, you cant really go with that argument here. Look, this is ultimately going to be decided by 12 average citizens in these four different places, who will be selected on the basis of how non political they are. So, republican politicians who are sort of just living in a 24hour social media daily news cycle are saying what they have to say right now to make their base happy. But when you get to see the real human beings who end up serving on these juries and deciding the cases, you are going to see the american Justice System at its finest, whatever the results are. And so i think democrats in particular dont need to be saying anything anymore. The indictments are filed. There is nothing more that you need to do. And every second you are talking about donald trump you are losing an opportunity to talk about what you yourself have delivered to your constituents. Then can you remind us, we are federal prosecutor hat on, who sits on a grand jury . Because its not a bunch of elected democrats. Right. No, the grand jury are average citizens who make a big commitment to come in over a very long period of time. Some of these people have been coming into the grand jury a few times, and probably for longer than a year, 18 months even. That is the grand jury. But what i was talking about more was, as these cases proceed, and you actually end up in a trial and one of these four places, those are average jurors who, they will spend for example, in pittsburgh, we just had a trial of the shooter at The Tree Of Life synagogue they spent weeks interviewing hundreds of people to be on that jury, just to find people who had not been exposed to the news so much that they were biased or had some other reason to be biased for or against that shooter. And so you can imagine in the trump case, you are going to end up with people who really dont have a bone to pick, politically, and probably havent paid a whole lot of attention to the news. Its going to be hard to say if any of them convict him that this was always the work of nefarious partisan democrats. Stuart, i got to thinking when i was watching that video real a moment ago, josh hawley, one of the lawmakers out there, calling this absurd. Is there a reason a lot of these lawmakers is the reason they are not walking away from trump because a lot of them are tangled up in all this . I am thinking back to josh hawley, given that fist bump, raising his hand on january 6th. You know, this is a conspiracy that involves all levels of the Republican Party. The white house. It involves senators, congressman, their staffs. It involved the attorney general association. It involved the rnc. It involved largest donors. This isnt a case like Watergate Of A Rogue president. This is a corruption that has gone completely at the core of the Republican Party. And that is ultimately why republicans are defending him. At a certain point, you could throw nixon under the bus and say, okay, this was a bad guy. We can make laws to change this. Lets go to jerry forward, our National Nightmare is over. If you are a republican, you really cant do that with the Republican Party. Because the Republican Party is itself here this is really a rico indictment against the party. And every senator and every congressman and every governor who is republican who acknowledge refused to acknowledge there was a free and Fair Election in america, and donald trump lost they really are unindicted coconspirators here. Conor lamb, donald trump always says all presses good press. And right now, he is getting all of the press. And joe biden isnt. He is out traveling the country talking bidenomics, and the good news, and that is not getting traction in the headlines. Is it getting traction with voters . I think it is. If you just kind of fast forward to where we are going to be in november of 2024, there is a very small number of people in a very small number of states who are going to decide this election. And pennsylvania, here where i am, is one of them. There is maybe 100,000 people who flipped their vote from trump in 16 to biden in 2020, and would consider going one of those two ways this time. I think it is perfectly fine that biden does not get as much press as trump. Because, to the people i am talking about, the type of press that trump is getting, is not good. And it just makes him look like a distraction, chaotic. And they turned against him already in 2022 even though he wasnt on the ballot. But they rejected people like Doug Mastriano all around the country, so that he wouldnt come back. And i think these people may not all of biden. But what they want to see hes a certain workman like attitude to his job, which means not just doing things that obviously see headlines, but doing things like you saw him do today, which we speak compassionately about victims of a natural disaster, and start to formulate a plan of how he is going to save those people and help that community. That is what he does best. And i think in 2020 you saw he did not need to dominate the new cycle every day for people to want to support him. Conor lamb, Stuart Stevens, thank you both for being here. I appreciate it. When we come back his story inspired the oscar winning film the blindside. It turns out that story is far from over. The shocking accusations against the tui family, and why this very wellknown Football Player wants to cut all legal ties, when The 11th Hour continues. Continues. Plan. But you know what is . Myplan from verizon. vo for a limited time get Nfl Sunday Ticket from youtubetv on us. A 449 value. 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Also available in sheets josh allen is this your plan to watch the game today . hero fan i have to watch my neighbors Nfl Sunday Ticket. Mr. Clean magic eraser makes cleaning easy. josh allen its not your best plan. But you know what is . Myplan from verizon. vo for a limited time get Nfl Sunday Ticket from youtubetv on us. A 449 value. Plus, get a free Samsung Galaxy z flip5. Only on verizon. The other story everybody is talking about tonight The Blind Side the shocking lawsuit against the Tuohy Family By Former nfl star michael oher. According to michael oher, he never saw any of the money his family made off his incredible life story. And legally, they might not be his family at all. Nbcs Kelly Hartang has the story. The 2009 film The Blind Side captured hearts on the big screen, telling The Story Of Future Nfl star Michael Oher S Adoption by a wealthy memphis family. But tonight, in a new lawsuit, oher claims it was all a lie. Tuohy the family exploited him for their own benefit, and now he wants to sever all legal ties. The adoptive parents of michael, but never legally adopted him, instead oher he says, the couple trip to him in 2004, less than three months after he turned 18, into signing a document that made sean and Leigh Anne Tuohy his legal conservatives conservators, giving but no its a lie oher says he discovered to his chagrin and embarrassment just six months ago. A conservatorship is very different from adoption. A conservatorship does not create a family relationship. It creates a legal responsibility. With that power, the petition alleges, the tuohys negotiated the movie deal for the The Blind Side in 2006. Oher claims the family made millions inroads in royalties, while oher says he received no payment whatsoever. Tonight, The Tuohy Family is speaking out, disputing those claims. And our next guest has been covering every angle of it, and i want to learn it. So, lets bring in espns senior, writer michael fletcher. Michael, i want to start by tell us more about what The Tuohy Family is saying. The tuohy family is saying that michael oher, a, knew that he wasnt adopted, and they use that term colloquially. But also The Tuohy Family says that michael oher is essentially trying to check them down, and hes threatened in the past to go public with this. Hes hired other lawyers to try to move this argument forward. And that he is really just trying to get money from them now. Thats their argument. Okay. But sean tuohy claimed the family did not make any money off the movement movie. But tuohy wrote a book. And in his book, he admits they did make money, and they split the profits five ways. So, which one is it . I know. He says that in the book, exactly. And even Going Forward now, they are saying actually was a residual deal, and we shared that residuals with michael oher. And previously they were saying there was no residuals. So, its hard to know exactly what is what with this. Their stories kind of moved. And Michael Ohers a story has remained the same. He is adamant that he got no money from the deal. The family says he refused to take money from the residual deal. I think to see this resolved in court. One of the things that michael oher asked for in his position was a full accounting of the money that was made by The Blind Side by The Tuohy Family. As we know, this movie was an absolute blockbuster. It grossed over 300 million at the box office. And according to the contract cited in Michael Ohers petition, the tuohys were entitle to two and a half percent of the profits of that movie, on top of a 225,000 dollar down payment. So, it will be interesting to see what this accounting shows us. Because, what you have to side saying, both cant be true. They are diametrically opposed. Yeah, that kind of math would mean 5 Million Bucks apiece. How exactly did oher find out about this in the first place . You know, this goes all the way back to when the movie was released. The movie was released in 2009, just as michael oher was beginning his nfl career. And he always had the sense that people were making money off of the movie and the family. And he would ask about to put always get deflected, according to his lawyer, never get a straight answer about this. But he kind of put it on the backburner because he is playing football and making plenty of money doing it. But after his career ended after the 2016 season, he started digging into it more, his lawyer says. He hired investigators to look into what went on. And he was able, eventually, to arrest free copies of this contract. And he also saw copies of a residual check that one of the Family Members got, according to his lawyer. And all of this kind of came to a head in february when one of his investigators dug out that conservatorship agreement, which told us michael oher that he was not adopted by The Tuohy Family, as they have represented to the public in so many ways and for so long. Entering into a conservatorship when he was over 18. There are a lot more questions, it sounds like the truth will come out eventually. Michael fletcher, a thank you so much for your great reporting. This is a crazy story. Yes, it is. When we come back, a pro surfer goes from writing waves to ride into the rescue. How he is helping Wildfire Victims in hawaii, when The 11th Hour continues. Shake some hands. Do not forget to laugh. [laughing] book a getawayfromwork trip. Use onekeycash. Order some sides. Do not disturb. Join one key to earn and use rewards across expedia, hotels. Com, and vrbo. Meet the team. Behind the team. The coach. The manager. And the snack dad. All using chase to keep up with their finances. 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In the hours after the nations deadliest fire ripped through the heart of, maui, residents from across the island were already finding ways to heal, neighbors helping neighbors maui superstar pro surfer kai lenny is known for shredding some of the worlds biggest waves. Kai lenny drops he is laying down his board for a megaphone. What is your mission right now . My mission right now is to serve the people however i can. With roads jammed, kai jumped on his to reach the people of lahaina, many from food, fuel, and precious medication. Kai telling us he was contacted help when still waiting on government aid. The frustration amongst all the locals is like, well, where is everybody . Something we heard from residents. If people cant get their insulin, they are going to die. For example, my dad. The government says it is doing all it can to care for remote area with limited resources. I think the real problem has been the communication. I just dont believe that our state officials, county, know what to do. There are certain things that need to happen immediately. And im proud of the for doing. That the Hawaiian Word Is [s peaking in a nonenglish language] it needs to pitch in with kindness, No Matter What. Steve patterson, nbc, news maui. To pitch in with kindness, No Matter What. That is a message and a mission we can all get behind. And on that very important note, i wish you all a very good and a very safe night. From all of our colleagues across the networks of nbc news, thanks for staying up late with me. We will see what the end of tomorrow. Thanks to you at home for joining us this hour. The article starts with this quote. The woman cannot believe it. She is in the same elevator with rudolph giuliani. Oh, this is a thrill