Transcripts For MSNBCW All 20240704

It wasnt showing resourcefulness, and then using those skills once slavery ended. Tonight, new polling data demonstrating even Republican Voters are getting tired of the socalled war on wokeness. When all in starts right now. Good evening from washington, d. C. I am mehdi hasan in for chris hayes. How do you try a man like donald trump . A man who does not follow the rules. That is going to be the central question, as the ex president now faces nearly 80 criminal counts across three jurisdictions. Last week, in his arraignment here in washington, d. C. On federal charges, related to his effort to steal the 2020 election, donald trump agreed to follow the conditions of his release. You must not violate any law and cannot discuss the facts of the case with any witnesses. Trump also told the judge that he understands it is a crime to, quote, try to influence a juror or to threaten or attempt to bribe a witness, or any other person who may have information about the case, or to retaliate against anyone for providing information about the case to the prosecution, or to otherwise obstruct the administration of justice. The very next day, speaking at an event in alabama, trump attacked the prosecutor, Special Counsel jack smith. Despite the demented prosecution of our movement by a corrupt and highly partisan department of justice, and deranged jack smith, doesnt he look deranged . You see the picture with the purple robe, hes a deranged human being. We are getting stronger by the day. Somebody said, you should treat him nicer, maybe hell do better let me tell you, this guy is a lost soul. That guy, he wont get nicer. He is a deranged, sick person. Over the weekend, the ex president continued his attacks on line, calling mike pence, his former Vice President , and a key witness in the latest case against him, quote, delusional and not a very good person. And trump attacked the judge assigned to his case in d. C. , complaining in all caps, theres no way he could get a fair trial. The barrage continued today in a new court filing, just released this afternoon, responding to jack smiths request for a protective order, barring trump from revealing sensitive evidence. Lawyers for the ex president accused the government of trying to restrict his First Amendment rights. They went on to complain, quote, worse, it does so against its administrations primary political opponent during an election season in which the administration Prominent Party members and media allies have campaigned on the indictment and proliferated its false allegations. And trumps lawyers asked the judge to narrow that proposed protective order to shield only genuinely sensitive materials from public view. Jack smiths team just issued their reply, less than three hours later, and it is a fiery one. Theres a lot to dig into as we read over. And well have more on that momentarily. Now, we know that donald trump has a history of bullying people and intimidating witnesses. We saw this on full display and in his civil trial earlier this year, when the ex president was found liable for sexually abusing and defaming a woman named e. Jean carroll. Trump repeatedly attacked carroll, even after the verdict, calling her a liar, and a nut job. The judge in that case even warned the jurors to remain anonymous for their own safety. Quote, i would recommend to you, in fact, that you dont use your real names with each other. The few people who know who you are, the better. Now, that same process is going to play out several more times in the three criminal cases and civil cases against the ex president that are set to go on trial between now and next november. Every member of every jury in the in each of those six tries will be at risk, and will need to be protected. And then, maybe a seventh case coming out soon, coming out of georgia, where police increased security around the Fulton County courthouse today, bringing in barricades, and blocking traffic. District attorney fani willis is expected to bring charges they are this month, as a result of her investigation into the efforts to overturn the election in georgia. To be clear, this is not normal. Lets say barack obama were on trial, of course, we will see some security to protect him. But this security is not really full, the potential defendant donald trump, it is security against that threat posed by his frequent attacks on prosecutors, on judges, on witnesses. And it is security from the supporters he riled up with those attacks. Donald trump is doing this on purpose. He is flouting the rules, spouting wild accusations, and behaving in a way that would get any other defendant put in shackles and hold out of the courtroom. He is baiting the judge overseeing his election case. He would probably love nothing more than for her to sentence him to a few days in jail, so that he could claim to be a martyr who cant get a fair trial. So, lets not pretend this is not deliberate. He knows exactly what he is doing. And there is also, of course, a huge political issue at play here. How do you try a man like donald trump, who is the front runner for the republican president ial nomination . He is going to be crisscrossing the country as he campaigns and rallies and debates, all while having to turn up for Legal Proceedings in new york, in florida, in washington, d. C. , and likely in georgia, too. Some observers have started referring to it as the court run election. And there is no clear answer to how it will work practically, because it is a totally, totally unprecedented situation. As the Washington Post reports, some of Donald Trumps closest Campaign Advisors could be witnesses against him at trial. He very well may take to the debate stage alongside mike pence, his former vp, who he has attacked, who is running against him, and again, who may also testify against him at trial. And on so many levels, we have just never seen anything like this. If mitt romney or barack obama had been the subject of even one trial in the most benign civil case back in 2012, it would have rightly dominated and undermine their entire campaign. What do you do with a president ial candidate who would likely have six trials going on at once . Its bound to be chaos. And sadly, it may, politically, who work in his favor. As a trump ally recently told nbc news, quote, politically, its way better for trump to have three or four indictments instead of one. When it is one, all of the focus is on the details of that single case, when there are multiple but specific details get lost to the wider narrative, it makes it way easier to make the case thats at witch hunt, when its more than one case. So, flood the zone, rack up the charges, attack the prosecutors, the judges, the witnesses, and confuse the voters. That seems to be the trump 2024 strategy. Scott bolden is a former prosecutor in new york, now whitecollar criminal defense attorney. Shanlon wu its a former federal prosecutor who served as counsel attorney general. And Alencia Johnson is democratic strategist who served the Senior Adviser to president joe bidens 2020 campaign. They join me now. Thank you, scott, let me start with you three, indictments so far in three different jurisdictions. Trump attorney alina hub was asked about the logistics of that this morning. Heres what she said. The last question would be the order in which these cases are gonna come forward. As of today, what is the first one you are tackling . You are setting up separate teams for the prior three as opposed to the civil one. Lets just say the three, and then will there be a separate one for the fourth . Yes, obviously, there is interaction between the lawyers, to the extent that we can make sure that we are coordinated with maintaining court orders and privileges. But these are all different cases. They are different states. And you have lawyers that are licensed in those states, as you know, and you have expertise in these different types of cases. So we will have separate teams, and we do have a little bit of overlap in some of the criminal attorneys. But we have usually one person from that state. Scott, even the best lawyers in the world would struggle to work on all these cases at once. How is the clown cart team of Trump Lawyers doing . Well, i havent done this before. Let me say that the lawyers, his lawyers response was underwhelming. This is one team, one coordination. They need to be talking every day. You have several lawyers on these conference or zoom calls because the messaging has to be correct and consistent with one another, the Litigation Strategy has to be consistent versus inconsistent. And you are doing all of this under the Bright Lights of the media as well as politics. You are representing someone running for office. And so, local council, you have to have someone if its on top of the scheduling, on top of the arguments, and the briefing takes place whenever there is a court appearance, including down to logistics, and moving donald trump from one courtroom to the other. This is a lot of work. 40 million in legal fees so far, hes gonna double that or triple that, as we move closer. And all for what . Because he wants to be president , because he is leading in the polls, and because hes raising a lot of money. But running for president , and being under 75 to 80 Felony Counts that hes been indicted on, completely inconsistent and impossible to do. That if is going to come, its going to come to its head really sooner than later. We have this new ruling over in florida from trumps maralago judge, Aileen Cannon, asking about the, quote, legal propriety of using out of District Grand Jury and seeming to decide what trump codefendant walt nauta. Briefly unpack that for us. What does that mean for the Special Counsels Documents Case in florida . Yes, thats the first sign of real worry in this selection of cannon, for the jack smith team. Her raising that is trying to cast doubt on whether it was proper for doj to have used a washington, d. C. Grand jury, and then also a grand jury in florida, federal ones, both, to return the indictment. There is nothing wrong with that at all. Perhaps, its in her experience, perhaps its her bias, you know, trying to do something helpful for the trump team. But by raising that, it reminds me of the specter of going down the rabbit hole that she did with appointing the Special Master originally. And this could cause a lot of confusion, a lot of delays. So, hopefully, that gets turned around by the court of appeals. And, shan, weve got this Breaking News tonight where the doj have just filed a response within three hours to the trump submission, which was at the very last minute before the 5 00 deadline about this protective order to try and shut him up, to keep sensitive evidence sensitive. What do you make of this back and forth between trump and the special Counsel Legal teams and judge chutkan in d. C. . Well, mehdi, the back and forth that you mentioned, thats already around one victory to the trump team, because it causes further delay. As scott mentioned, thats what he wants to do. And remember, they havent even started discovering, because the protective order needs to be sorted out before they can start the discovery. Thats a big problem. Substantively, i think trump team hurts himself because they reveal a bit too much. They make a claim that the real point is we want to be able to publicly disclose materials, maybe the government has some that we could make them very argument about why it cant be disclosed. But the presumption should be, we disclose things. So, they are squarely making the point. And smith calls them on this that they want to try their case in the press. And his point is, nothing prevents me from doing that because i am running for president. And because i am running, i have to persuade people. That includes potential jurors. But smith calls him not exactly on that, citing a Supreme Court case in 1942 bridges, that says, trials are not the same as any election. Yes, they are definitely not. 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S bolden,wu alencia johnn, Thank Youll Eciate y all hank y coming up, he waspose to be thblicanartys next bigand now he i mps def side an talks about benefits of slaver in public. How did it all go wrong fo around desantis . But, first, who are the judges overseeing the two Special Counsel cases. Everything you need to kno about two of the most importan people in the country right now, next in almost all highprofile trials, a judge becomes a major player. That is already clearly the case in the two federal prosecutions against the ex president brought by Special Counsel jack smith. In both cases, the judges are fascinating and so different. In florida, in the classified Documents Case, donald trump appointee Aileen Cannon is overseeing the trial. In washington, d. C. In the january 6th case, the trial is being overseen by barack obama appointee, Tanya Chutkan. Judge cannon is an immigrant from columbia. Back in 2020, she was confirmed by a vote of 56 to 21. Judge chutkan is an immigrant from jamaica. She was confirmed by a senate vote of 95 to 0 in 2014. Judge cannon is 42 years old. Shes a conservative and a former member of the federalist society. Judge chutkan is 61 and has donated in the past two democratic campaigns. Cannon is a former federal prosecutor who has roughly three years of experience on the bench, and has tried just four trials to a jury verdict. Chutkan is a former public defendant who has nearly a decade of experience on the bench, and has tried roughly 45 cases to jury verdict. Judge chutkan has also prosecuted dozens of january 6th rioters, and shes been tough on sentencing. Whereas judge cannon, according to new reporting, she made a bunch of mistakes in a recent trial. Both previously ruled in cases involving the ex president. Judge Tanya Chutkan ruled against him in his attempt to shield white house records from the january 6th committee. She wrote that, quote, president s are not kings, and trump is not president. While judge Aileen Cannon repeatedly ruled in trumps favor last year, and a conservative 11th Circuit Court of appeals issued decisions overturning those rulings of hers. And they punished her for basically doing trumps bidding for him. And yet, here she is doing it again. In a new ruling this morning, judge cannon appears to be doing homework for donald trump s coconspirator, walt nauta. Cynthia alksne is a former federal prosecutor and she joins me now. Cynthia, thanks for coming on the show. Today, judge cannon issued a ruling questioning the Special Counsel news. Washington, d. C. Grand jury investigating the Documents Case. What do you make of her ruling . And could you explain what shes basically telling trumps Coconspirator Walt Nauta to do . Well, basically, what she is doing is kicking the can down the road. I mean, remember that jack smiths people had to push her to set a trial date. And now, she has to have an excuse on why that trial date has to be, because of the trump people want to have the case continued. And so, she has to have a bunch of excuses and Little Things that she can continue to push to kick that can down the road. In her ruling today, not only did she not set a hearing, she also said the parties briefings issued, that really arent even issues. But it will allow the process to get gummed up. It will take time to go through this briefing schedule, and then it will go back and forth, and then she can set a hearing. And all shes done is help out the trump people to postpone that case. But lets remember, the important thing is that the Election Interference Case goes to trial, and that is in front of a competent judge who is not playing games. So, if this one gets kicked down the road and opens up a space to the Election Interference Case, thats okay with me. Id rather be having the Election Interference Case being judged in d. C. Than in florida, i have to say. But judge cannon clearly doesnt care about her up lets talk about judge chutkan, Tanya Chutkan go on. I have to say, theres absolutely nothing wrong. She raised this one funny issue, which as if it was some terrible thing that there was grand jury proceedings going on in washington, d. C. And in florida. Theres absolutely nothing wrong with that. Thats normal in a case that began in washington, d. C. With the stealing of the documents, and then it moved to florida, where many of the witnesses are in d. C. Walt nauta is in d. C. All the time. He may very well have spoken to people. There may be other people involved. Taveras testified in d. C. He may have to clean up his testimony. So there are things that have to happen in the d. C. Grand jury. Theres absolutely nothing wrong with it. And all she is doing is wasting time, so that she can kick the can down the road. Meanwhile, donald trump is attacking a judge chutkan. In response to those attacks, you posted, cynthia, this weekend, quote, trump is either trying to promote the judge, so she acts, he can Complaint Victim and raise money. Or he is completely drenched because his misogynists self Cannot Function or being told what to do by women or even someone, a woman of color. I agree with that. If you are judge chutkan, how do you respond to those provocations . Can you put him in jail, a former president . I think its pretty tough. I think shes gonna have to give him a couple of shots, and shes gonna have to bring him to the courtroom and dress him down. But at some point, what he mostly wants, remember what trump wants the most, postpone the Election Interference Case in front of her. And in the flip side of that is most of her power is in the scheduling of that case. So, i would say what she needs to do, its gonna be difficult to put him in jail. Just imagine the circus that would be and how it would postpone the case, and go up on appeal, take forever. But what she can do is shorten the time period between now and when that case goes to trial so we can resolve these issues, and not get involved in his gamesmanship and play his game. Thats his game. The goal of this is to get the cases to trial. And in terms of his games, his team put in the protective order objection, just before the 5 00 deadline today. Jack smiths team responded within three hours. What do you make of that back and forth . And what does a judge do next . I dont think a judge needs to have a hearing. I mean, this is a pretty standard protective order. The local rules say you are not supposed to take Discovery Information and use it to try your case and public, and tank the jury pool, and make a circus of the case. I just think hes gonna show the order. I dont think shes gonna play trumps game of kick the can down the road. I think shes going to move things along quite quickly. She may bring him in for the trial, which he rightly deserves. But i think she will continue the case to move the case as quickly as possible. Lets hope so. Cynthia alksne, thank you so much for your analysis. Always appreciate it. Still to come he was supposed to be the alternative to trump. But so far, we have just seen a lot of this. Well, im here. I dont know the other one coming clear sethats ahead but blendjet■s back to school sale is in full swing blendjet gives you icecrushing, big Blender Power on the go so you can whip up a mouthwatering beverage wherever you are. Enjoy 15 plus blends before rapidly recharging via usbc. Cleanup is a breeze just blend water with a drop of soap. Stand out even when youre accidentally twinning with our kaleidoscope of colors. Don■t be tardy for this sale head to blendjet. Com and order yours now. For those of you who are soccer fans, it was a heartbreaking weekend, as the u. S. Womens soccer team was defeated at the world cup and australia. Twotime world cup champion Megan Rapinoe was one of three u. S. Players to miss their Penalty Kicks against sweden. It was her final world cup match, and with that, the u. S. Team, the reigning champions were eliminated. But what was frankly shocking was to see people who claim to be patriots and lovers of america, nationalists even, just openly trashing an American National team. Look at these reactions from the maga folks. Im glad they lost. What an embarrassment. Even outright rooting for the opposing foreign team, sweden. Because they say, this womans team, this american womans team is too woke, that megan takes a knee during the anthem. I mean, grow up, guys. Just stop being such snowflakes and learn to love your country and your fellow americans. Still, the most deranged response to this world cup defeat came from who else, donald j trump. The ex president who has been indicted three times and faces another possible indictment, took time in between court dates to attack the womans team, claiming many of our players were openly hostile to america, seemingly rapinoe, nice shot, megan, the usa is going to hell. This was part of a weekend of completely unhinged social media posts that included attacks on former speaker of the house nancy pelosi and her husband, who also apparently are going to hell. But lets be clear, this has nothing to do with wokeness or anything else like that. It has to do with his petty grievances and the fact that trump is a man who holds on to grudges, especially against women. He gives it away in singling out rapinoe. Back in 2019, when trump was in the white house and the womans team was making a run at the second consecutive world cup title, she was asked about a potential white house visit during an issue. Are you excited to go to the white house . We are going to the [bleep] white house no, im not going to the white house. Were not gonna be invited. Are you gonna be invited . I doubt it. Trump, who was president at the time, and presumably had more important things to do, shot back at her, writing, quote, megan should win first before she talks. Well, 11 days later, that is exactly what she and the women s team did, becoming a world cup champion, skipping the white house visit. Its not about wokeness, its about trumps thin skin, which is why he went after the u. S. Womens soccer team this weekend. He wrote that the loss is fully emblematic of what is happening to our once great nation under Crooked Joe Biden and woke equals failure. But that makes no sense because nine of the 23 players, basically 40 of the roster were on the world cup winning in 2019 squad. And five of those women were also in the 2015 team, including Megan Rapinoe. When i look at the ex president , and then i look at the u. S. Womens National Soccer team, i see two major differences. First, this womans team, won the world cup twice. Donald trump could not win the presidency twice. He barely won it once. And second, this team, particularly rapinoe, can handle loss with dignity and grace. They could accept and honor their defeat, something donald trump continues to remain incapable of doing. T for some adults. No other complete hiv pill uses fewer medicines to help keep you undetectable than dovato. Detect this most hiv pills contain 3 or 4 medicines. Dovato is as effective with just 2. If you have hepatitis b, dont stop dovato without talking to your doctor. Dont take dovato if youre allergic to its ingredients or taking dofetilide. This can cause serious or lifethreatening side effects. If you have a rash or allergic reaction symptoms, stop dovato and get medical help right away. Serious or lifethreatening lactic acid buildup and Liver Problems can occur. 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Order yours now from blendjet. Com before they sell out again yes or no, did donald trump lose the 2020 election . Whoever puts their hand on the bible on january 20th every four years is the winner. Okay, but respectfully, you did not clearly answer that question. And if you cant give a yes or no, whether or not trump lost, then how of course he lost. Trump lost the 2020 election . Of course. Joe biden is the president. Nearly three years after the 2020 election, ron desantis has finally admitted that donald trump lost. Shocker. Now that the florida governors own president ial campaign is floundering and he is trailing the indicted ex president by double digits in every poll, desantis is willing to state the obvious. But he says that, of course, joe biden is president , of course donald trump lost, as if thats what hes been saying all along, as if desantis has not spent the past two and a half years hedging and passive voicing his way of stating that exact fact, all while pushing big Conspiracy Theories about election fraud, and endorsing election denying candidates for office. In fact, when it comes to managing elections, in many ways, desantis is almost more dangerous than trump because while trump lies about the election in a crazy way, desantis actually took steps as floridas stunt governor to suppress legitimate voters under the guise of Fighting Imaginary voter fraud. Back in 2021, desantis signed a socalled Election Integrity bill which in reality was a Voter Suppression law, making it harder for people to vote by mail, and banning anyone except pollsters from distributing food or water to people waiting in line at the polls. Incidentally, nbc news does not have its own video of desantis signing that bill because he blocked the ceremony to all media except his buddies at fox, who were there live as part of an exclusive interview. And do not forget, his tough guy Press Conference where he posed with Law Enforcement to brag about arresting a bunch of mostly Black Floridians for alleged fraud. The state of florida has charged and is in the process of arresting 20 individuals across the state for voter fraud. [applause] they did not get their rights restored. And yet, they went ahead and voted anyway. That is against the law. And now, theyre gonna pay the price for it. We saw those arrests. The alleged perpetrators were confused. They had no idea what they have done wrong. And the police did not have any answers either. Not long after that, transparent pr stunt, many of those cases completely fell apart for a number of reasons. Following revelations that many of the folks desantis arrested under the guise of voting illegally had actually been told by his own State Government that they were here to vote. But if there was any small consolation here, it is that ron desantis will almost certainly not be able to impose his extreme farright agenda on america as a whole. If the polls are to be believed, because despite the governors braggadocious promise and his precampaign book which attempts to pitch his farright agenda in the Sunshine State as a blueprint for the rest of the country, it turns out most voters do not want to make america florida. Since desantis took office back in 2019, he has lurched florida to the farright, with a series of political stunts, yes, stunts, designed explicitly to appeal to republican president ial primary voters, likely aforementioned stunt with the fake fraud allegations, or the time he callously shipped a bunch of migrants to Marthas Vineyard under false pretenses, a scheme that may still result in legal consequences. But desantiss central governing ideology, such as it exists, has been his socalled war on woke. There is simply no conservative culture war that the governor will not take the bait on, from the ridiculous backlash to bud light, for sponsoring an instagram post, from a french enter influencer, to desantiss crusade against the 16 19 project, and teaching the truth to kids about institutionalized racism. And his costly and pointless fight with disney after it criticized his socalled dont say gay law which restricts discussions of lgbtq issues in florida classrooms. But here is the thing. Voters, theyre just not buying it. In a new article today, the New York Times analyzes recent polling data which says that even the Republican Base just does not care about the anti woke stuff. Quote, when presented with the choice between two hypothetical republican candidates, only 24 of national Republican Voters opted for a candidate who focuses on the Feeding Radical woke ideology in our schools, media, and culture over a candidate who prioritizes Law Enforcement, and border security. Among those 65 and older, often the most likely age bracket to vote, only 17 signed on to the anti woke crusade. Governor desantis has spent years picking these bs culture war fights, only to find that less than a quarter of the Republican Base cares about any of it. Even donald trump, who never let a culture war he would not fight, even he understands the Hyper Fixation On woke is a losing issue. The country has gone sick. Its gone sick. And i dont like the term woke, i hear woke, woke, woke, its a term that have people cant even defined, they dont know what it is. Desantis says he wants to make america florida, with all the Culture War Bigotry he has pushed there. And so far, america has responded, no, thanks. Well have much more on the florida governors failure to launch and his remarkably terrible political instincts, next. Governor desantis has spent years picking these bs culture war fights, only to find that less than a quarter of the Republican Base cares about any of it. Even donald trump, who never let a culture war he would not fight, even he understands the Hyper Fixation On woke is a losing issue. The country has gone sick. Its gone sick. And i dont like the term woke, i hear woke, woke, woke, its a term that have people cant even defined, they dont know what it is. Desantis says he wants to make america florida, with all the Culture War Bigotry he has pushed there. And so far, america has responded, no, thanks. Well have much more on the florida governors failure to launch and his remarkably terrible political instincts, next. Goli, taste your goals. Lets just talk about your take on these new standards and the one sentence that has received the most backlash. Ill just read it to you. In instruction, it includes how slaves developed skills, which in some instances, could be applied for their personal benefit. Lets just be clear, you believe this is an important topic that should be taught in schools . So that means they developed skills in spite of slavery not because of slavery. It was them showing resourcefulness and using those skills. Ron desantis now outside his anti woke bubble is still trying to find a Silver Lining in slavery. Honestly, we could spend the entire hour talking about desantiss truly awful and tone deaf political judgment. Joining me now to talk about rons ongoing implosion, david jolly, former republican congressman from florida, now no longer a republican. And anna eskamani, a democrat serving in the Florida House of representatives. David, desantis doubling down on his slavery it wasnt all bad argument. They got some skills. Who is he appealing to, aside from the White Nationalist segment of the gop base . Well, you nailed it. Thats who its appealing to. But it also demonstrates a character of ron desantis that voters get to make a moral judgment over someone who is looking for a Silver Lining in slavery. And i think its clear at this point, ron desantis is continuing his race for the white house, asking to represent a white america. That is what he did in florida when it comes to immigration and voting rights, he is saying i want to restore white americas place in society. And i am reminded of leicester maddox, the governor of georgia in the civil rights era, who rose to the governorship by opposing immigration at his very own restaurant. But he made the argument, mehdi, that it wasnt about racism, it was about property rights. And what we see in ron desantis, though certainly hes not that discriminatory, he is someone who is trying to use legal arguments every step of the way, nonsensical arguments, to deny equity, this war on woke, these antiwoke arguments are essentially his way of restoring this white america, and Stopping Equity in florida and across the nation. And when that reputation is stuck on you, its stuck. And i dont think you can get out from underneath it. No, it doesnt look like it. I dont see a route back throw for him anytime soon, unless Donald Trumps legal troubles overtake him. Anna, a quick question for you. You are an elected representative of georgia. But i have to ask the question. He is running on this idea that we should make america florida. And america doesnt seem to want to be florida. [laughter] well, mehdi, i am born and raised in florida as a daughter of immigrants. And i love going home. And under the leadership of governor ron desantis, america, you do not want to be like florida right now. Not only do we have a governor, as david already mentioned, that continues, continuously flames different culture battles, wants to divide us versus bring us together. But The Cost Of Living in our state is so extreme that we have some of the worst inflation compared to other states. Rent is out of control. Utility rates are going up, and insurance are increasing where folks are becoming homeless because they cant afford to cover the expenses of their apartment insurance. And of course, we are experiencing intense climate, thats going to create more extreme weather patterns. And we have a governor thats m. I. A. , no word to be seen. This is not a state that you want to replicate at this time, especially as we talk about the exodus of educators in our Public School system, and the lack of accountability. We have Government Agencies that are corrupt, that are falling apart, and it really is not a role model for the rest of the country. Anna, you mentioned the education system. Florida has approved videos from the farright rightwing think tank, not an actual university, to be used in schools. Have a watch of a clip from one of their videos with a cartoon christopher columbus, and see what he is defending. Have a listen. Youd rather line up things like eating people and human sacrifice, some of the native folks from where i just left do those things regularly. So, these people in your time think it was a peaceful paradise, you are misinformed or lying. Yeah, but what about slavery . You cant deny that. Deny . No. Slavery is as old as time. And its taking place in every corner of the world, even amongst people i just left. Being taken as a slave is better than being killed, no . Slavery is better than being killed. And everyone does slavery, say these videos that have been played to kids in florida. I wonder if desantis was against indoctrination in schools. That is as close to indoctrination as ive seen in a long time. Yes, wholeheartedly, mehdi. I mean, thats the irony, right . Theres so much protection coming from people like desantis, where they say they dont want indoctrination, yet here they are, pushing their own agenda on to our children. Its also important to stress that every culture or as a class war, because what ends up happening, as you wrote in the story of public education, propaganda in these systems, families with money will send their kids to private schools that are going to be teaching critical thought and real history, while Public School kids like me are going to be stuck being exposed to this bs, for a lack of a better term. And so, it really is not only just wrong, but its dangerous to the future of our workforce. Were not gonna be competitive Global Market if this is the garbage we are feeding our kids in schools. Well said. David, heres how ron desantis tried to justify not hitting donald trump harder on his indictments. Have a watch. If the election is the referendum on joe bidens policies and the failures that we have seen, and we are presenting a positive vision for the future, we will win the presidency, and we will have a chance to turn the country up. If, on the other hand, the election is not about january 20th, 2025, but january 6th, 2021, or what document was left by the toilet at maralago, if its a referendum on that, we are going to lose. So, david, ron says he wants to present a positive vision and message for the future. A couple of days ago, he said he wants to start his administration by slitting the throats of federal government employees, getting rid of them by slitting their throats, that was his words. It doesnt sound very positive to me. Yes, he is someone who really does anything out of conviction. He does it out of calculus. And what you are seeing, ron desantis is trying to calculate how to deem donald trump without actually dealing with the blow back from it. But that comment about slitting throats, i think, is a reflection, truly, of a bit of his political ethos if you will. He is a very dark figure, that paranoid figure, angry figure, who makes donald trump, the author of american carnage, actually look like sunshine and roses. Ron desantiss campaign is sinking fast. The reset is not working. The one thing he has to his advantage is time. But he has to turn into a republican leader, a traditional economic leader within the Republican Party to speak to that constituency. The problem is he cant. After the war on disney and after everything hes done, as anna said, to flood his economy, which is now teetering, ron desantis doesnt have another reset button to it. It might just be over before he gets started. Yes, it does look over right now. And i genuinely dont understand how hes gonna pull back from these double digit poll deficits, his refusal to attack donald trump, and his constant obsession with talking about the skills that slaves acquired all those years ago. David jolly and anna eskamani, thank you both for your analysis tonight. And god bless you over in florida, lovely Sunshine State. That is all in on this monday night. Chris hayes will be back tomorrow. You can watch the mehdi hasan show sundays, eight pm eastern right here on msnbc. It streams with me on thursdays, on peacock. But the Rachel Maddow show starts right now. Good evening, rachel. Good evening, mehdi. Thank you, my friend. Much appreciated. And thanks to you at home joining us tonight. Its good to have you with us. We are a big country, 330 million people. We are very diverse, very heterogeneous, in terms of everything, in terms of background agree, i think we can all together around the somewhat obvious idea if there is one Consumer Product America Erneed one thing were just missing as a country its probably a gun that is specifically designed for babies. A gun specifically designed to be wielded by babies, specifically an Assault Rifle style semiautomatic long gun made to look kind of like the civilian version of the military issue m4 rifle but sized down so, like, toddlers can use them. Not toy guns not like Super Soakers soak guns, not bb