Transcripts For LINKTV Democracy Now 20240622

Independent review. We will speak with dr. Stephen soldz, cofounder of the psychology,. And with dr. J, social psychologist who participated in the 2005 apa task force that condone psychologists involvement enhanced interrogations, later blew the whistle. Then to vienna, austria, where negotiators are close to reaching a Historic Deal between iran and six world powers that would limit tehrans nuclear ability for more than a decade in exchange for sanctions relief. The world should know the nation of iran is an artful nation that could solve the greatest issues and political history through logic and discussion and maintain the right of its people. Amy well get an update from flynt leverett, author of going to tehran why america must accept the Islamic Republic of iran. All that and more, coming up. Welcome to democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. Greece and its european creditors have reached a deal that will force greece to accept sweeping, germanbacked austerity measures in order to receive a third bailout and remain in the eurozone. Provided the Greek Parliament accepts the terms the deal paves , the way for a threeyear bailout worth up to 96 billion. After european leaders pressed greece to accept an austerity package seen as amounting to a surrender of fiscal sovereignty, the hashtag thisisacoup trended on social media. Talks continued overnight until greece agreed to immediately implement measures including pension reform and the privatization of its Energy Transmission network. The deal comes after the Greek Parliament voted saturday to accept austerity reforms proposed by Prime Minister alexis tsipras, just days after greek voters rejected similar terms in a historic referendum. Speaking earlier today, german chancellor Angela Merkel said she would recommend the German Parliament to back the bailout deal. I think we found ways what ive repeatedly said advantage clearly dominate disadvantages. The basic principles we follow to rescued the euro are there mainly on the one side solidarity among member countries and on the other side the responsibility of the country where changes need to take lace. Amy in yemen, saudiled airstrikes have continued , despite a u. N. True aimed at delivering muchneeded humanitarian aid. Clashes between Houthi Rebels and fighters loyal to ousted president Abdrabbu Mansour hadi killed at least 35 people on sunday, near the southern port city of aden. Meanwhile, a mass funeral was held saturday for 53 soldiers killed when saudiled airstrikes erroneously hit a military base filled with troops loyal to hadi fighting on the same side as the saudis. The United States backs the Saudi Bombing Campaign in yemen despite reports of widespread civilian casualties. A new independent review has revealed how members of the American Psychological association members, the Worlds Largest group of psychologists lied about their close collaboration with officials at the pentagon and cia to weaken the associations ethical guidelines and allow psychologists to participate in the governments interrogation programs after 9 11. The 542page report was commissioned by the Psychological Associations board of directors last year. It undermines the apas repeated denials that some of its 130,000 members were complicit in torture. Well have more on the report after headlines. Negotiations over Irans Nuclear program have entered their 17th and possibly final day in Vienna Austria as an interim agreement is set to expire tonight. Secretary of state john kerry told reporters he is confident a deal is within reach, but negotiators in vienna are still smoothing over key details including what limits to set on Irans Nuclear research, the pace of sanctions relief, and whether to lift a United Nations arms embargo on iran. Well have more on iran later in the broadcast. Iraqi forces have reportedly begun a longawaited campaign to oust the selfdescribed Islamic State from the Western Province of anbar. The announcement comes as iraq has received a first batch of longdelayed f16 fighter jets from the United States. Iraq had ordered 36 f16s. Four have arrived. In afghanistan, intelligence Officials Say a u. S. Drone strike killed a former taliban leader accused of being the leader of isil in afghanistan and pakistan. The Afghan Intelligence agency said he was killed along with 30 other people identified as insurgents. Meanwhile, a suicide car bomb killed at least 33 people in a military base formerly used by the u. S. One of mexicos most notorious drug lords has escaped from a maximumsecurity prison for the second time. Joaquin el chapo guzman, head of the sinaloa cartel, escaped through a rectangular opening in a shower area, into a milelong tunnel under the prison west of mexico city. Guzmans arrest 16 months ago was lauded as a signature achievement of president Enrique Pena Nieto, who has promised to crack down on drug traffickers. The United States had sought unsuccessfully to extradite guzman, in part over concerns he might escape again. He fled another mexican prison in a laundry cart in 2001. Mexican president Enrique Pena Nieto said he had ordered the attorney general to investigate whether prison officials were involved in his latest escape. We are aware of the very unfortunate incident that has angered and outraged mexican society. Im deeply shocked by what happened. The escape of one of mexico and the worlds most wanted. This is undoubtedly an affront to the mexican government, but im also confident mexican institutions particularly those charged with public security, rise to the challenge with the strength and determination to recapture this criminal. Amy the serbian Prime Minister was forced to flee a ceremony commemorating the 20th anniversary of the srebrenica massacre on saturday, after he was pelted with stones and plastic bottles. The bosnian presidency condemned saturdays attack on serbian Prime Minister aleksander vucic, saying he had attended the ceremony in a spirit of reconciliation. The event marked 20 years since the massacre of 8000 muslim men and boys by Bosnian Serbs led by general ratko mladic during the bosnian war. Its recognized as europes single worst atrocity since the end of world war ii. In the United States, the director of the office of Personnel Management has resigned following revelations hackers stole the personal information of more than 22 Million People from agency databases, far more than initially disclosed. The hacks, said to have originated in china, compromised Social Security numbers, health histories, and financial information. White House Press Secretary josh earnest announced Katherine Archuletas departure on friday. I can to you director archuleta did offer her resignation today. She did so of her own volition. She recognizes, as the white house does, the urgent challenges really facing the office of Personnel Management require a specialized set of skills and experiences. That is precisely why the president has accepted her resignation and assigned beth cobert on an acting basis. Amy Katherine Archuleta was the first latina to lead the office of Personnel Management. Here in new york, hundreds of people gathered at the east hampton home of Hedge Fund Billionaire daniel loeb, who was hosting a 5000aplate fundraiser for new york governor andrew cuomo. Outside loebs estate saturday evening, protesters chanted, cuomo, cuomo, you cant hide we can see your greedy side, and hey, governor 1 , who do you represent . The group hedgeclippers says loeb and fellow hedge funders are driving School Privatization and income inequality in new york, while fueling the financial crisis facing puerto rico. Dubbed americas greece, puerto rico has 73 billion in debt, up to half of which is held by hedge funds. In london, environmental activists chained themselves together on the runway at Heathrow Airport to protest plans to build a third runway. The protesters cut through a fence and locked down on the northern runway, prompting a number of flight cancellations. They are from a group called plane stupid, which seeks to highlight the role of the Airline Industry in climate change. Israel has released palestinian activist khader adnan following a deal which saw him end a 56day Hunger Strike last month. Adnan had been held for more than a year without charge under israels policy of administrative detention. He was one of a number of palestinians arrested after the kidnapping and murder of three israeli youths last year. It was the 10th time he has been detained without charge. Adnan spoke out following his release sunday. I see the happiness among palestinians flowing and the palestinian pain and hope for the freedom of all prisoners god willing. The occupation made a mistake and arresting the first time in the second time and all previous arrests. Today the occupation makes the mistake of releasing me because they think that will abort the palestinian happiness. This is a cowardly act of the occupation. It fears the palestinian happiness and love for the palestinian prisoners. Amy adnans release comes as the Israeli Human Rights Group btselem has released video which appears to show a highranking israeli soldier fatally shooting a palestinian teenager as he runs away. The Israeli Military has claimed Brigade Commander colonel israel shomer killed 17yearold mohammed alkusbah last week because his life was in danger and he had exhausted all other options. But footage of the incident appears to show the teenager throwing a rock at shomers vehicle, then running away before shomer stops the vehicle, get out of it, and charges at him. Palestinian authorities have said kusbah was shot in the back three times. In tuscaloosa, alabama, an africanamerican man has died after police say he collapsed after being peppersprayed. Police say they responded to a report 35yearold anthony ware was sitting on a porch with a gun. They say they chased ware into the woods, where they say he resisted arrest, and was peppersprayed and placed in handcuffs. He collapsed and was later pronounced dead. His death is under investigation. Wisconsin republican Governor Scott walker is due to announce his candidacy for president today. Walker is known for gutting collective bargaining rights for Public Sector workers in 2011. On sunday, he signed a state budget which slashes funding for the university of wisconsin, expands the Voucher Program for private schools, and eliminates the states living wage law. A key trial on Voting Rights opens today in North Carolina. After the Supreme Court gutted the Voting Rights act in 2013, North Carolina passed a series of restrictions, ending sameday registration and reducing early voting days. A federal judge will now consider whether those restrictions unconstitutionally discriminate against african americans. The naacp has voted to end its 15year boycott of South Carolina after the state removed the confederate battle flag from the capitol grounds. In a statement, the naacp said the flags removal does not end discrimination, but does symbolize an end to the reverence of and adherence to values that support raciallybased chattel slavery. The flags removal came just over three weeks after nine africanamerican churchgoers were massacred in charleston South Carolina by a white suspect who embraced the confederate flag. The fbi has admitted failures in the federal background check system allowed the charleston massacre suspect, dylann roof, to buy the gun used in the attack, when he should have been prevented from doing so. Fbi director james comey said roof attempted to buy the gun on april 11, triggering a background check by an fbi examiner. But the examiner was confused over which Police Department to contact and failed to obtain a Police Report which showed roof admitted to drug possession. A local prosecutor also failed to respond to the examiners request for information. Since federal law gives the fbi only three Business Days to provide evidence to block a purchase, roof was able to return to the shop and buy the gun when the waiting period expired. Gun control advocates have called for congress to approve funding to enter the records of prohibited people into the fbis database. Obama is set to become the first sitting president to visit a federal prison. On thursday, obama will tour the El Reno Correctional Institute a mediumsecurity prison in oklahoma. Obama is also expected to commute the sentences of dozens of nonviolent offenders this week and deliver a speech on the need for sentencing reform before the naacp on tuesday. And those are some of the headlines. This is democracy now democracynow. Org, the war and , peace report. Im amy goodman. We begin todays show with a story democracy now has followed closely for more than a decade. A new independent review has revealed extensive details on how members of the American Psychological association, the Worlds Largest group of psychologists, lied about their close collaboration with officials at the pentagon and cia to weaken the associations ethical guidelines and allow psychologists to participate in the governments interrogation programs after 9 11. The 542page report was commissioned by the Psychological Associations board of directors last year based on an independent review by a former assistant u. S. Attorney, David Hoffman. It undermines the apas repeated denials that some of its 130,000 members were complicit in torture. The reports findings were first revealed friday in the New York Times and conclude the associations principal motive in doing so was to align apa and curry favor with dod. That is the department of defense. Among the leading officials it implicates are the director of the apa Ethics Office, Stephen Behnke. After the apa received the hoffman report, behnke reportedly departed his position last wednesday. It is unclear whether he was fired or resigned. He has now hired former clinton fbi director Louis J Freeh to defend him. We invited a representative from the apa to join us, but they declined. Meanwhile, the guardian reports the new details could provide grounds to file ethics charges against members of the apa. Recommendations for reform are expected to be made ahead of the apas annual convention in toronto next month. For more we are joined by two guests. In boston, dr. Stephen soldz is a professor at the Boston Graduate School of psychoanalysis and cofounder of the coalition for an ethical psychology. Earlier this month, he was invited to address the apas board of directors with Steven Reisner on the organizations response to the anticipated hoffman report. Maria arrigo is a social psychologist and oral historian. Shes a member of the coalition for an ethical psychology. She purchased the patent in the 2005 apa task force that condones psychologists involvement in enhanced interrogations and later blew the whistle. She is since established the apa pens debate collection at university of colorado boulder archives. Welcome both of you back to democracy now lets begin with dr. Stephen soldz in boston. Can you explain the scope of the hoffman report and what he found . Well, as you know, amy, and those who have watched the show for years, since at least 2005, theres been a major debate in the association in the profession about the role of psychologists and National Security interrogations and torture. The association has denied it, as you said. So the report says that the association was wrong. The critics were right. So the Main Findings are that there was a years long conspiracy to collude between leadership of the association and representatives of the Bush Administration intelligence agency, the Defense Department, and cia. Second, there was a major duplicitous pr campaign to falsely present the apa as been concerned about human rights and detainee welfare when, as mr. Hoffman shows in the report their actions were not motivated i that at all. Thirdly, while claiming they would investigate all claims of abuse, in fact, they dismissed without any reasonable investigation claims of abuse that were filed with their Ethics Office. So those are the Main Findings. There are many more. The 500 page report has extensive detail on over 100 interviews. They had probably thousands of emails that documented this collusion in great detail. One of the things we find is, virtually, every word in apa policy was approved by Defense Department officials before it was submitted to the membership of the council of representatives. Mr. Hoffman calls it prevetted by the Defense Department to make sure it did not in any way constrain the Defense Department psychologists, the military psychologists, active at guantanamo and elsewhere while sounding like it was opposing torture. Amy explained to David Hoffman is and how this report came into being. David hoffman is an attorney at a law firm in chicago, an expert in corruption. Former federal prosecutor and former Inspector General of chicago. So last october, james rison of the New York Times published a book in one of the chapters reported on emails between the deceased cia contractor and apa officials, cia officials and white house and Defense Department officials that demonstrated collusion. Collusion between the groups. The apa initially dismissed risens claims, however, after a month they backtrack and said, well we know theyre not true between after show it, so we have hired this independent investigator to conduct a review of charges of collusion between us and the Bush Administration. So hoffman and his team of six have been active for the last seven months. I know i and my colleagues decided to help him. We had a number of telephone meetings and gave them all the documents we had and encouraged others to do so. We were hopeful he was the real deal and it turns out that he was. Amy i want to read from part of the press release issued by the apa in response to the report the organizations intent was not to enable abusive interrogation techniques or contribute to violations of human rights, but that may have been the result. The actions, policies and the lack of independence from government influence described in the hoffman report represented a failure to live up to our core values. We profoundly regret, and apologize for, the behavior and the consequences that ensued. Is that enough . No. There are two things wrong with the apas statement. The first sentence, while it is true as the report showed, it wasnt exactly about torture. The apa didnt care about what was happening to the detainees. What it was about was making the Defense Department happy so that they would help psychology as a profession. In that sense, yes. Mr. Hoffman also shows the strategic move to not to obtain any information about abuses occurring at guantanamo and the cia and elsewhere. In other words, they deliberately turned their heads the other way. So they cant claim it was completely inadvertent especially when there were thousands of people in the association and around the world telling them that this wasnt working. The other thing, which is elsewhere in there, they blame a small group. And while the small group is like 20 of the top leaders of the association who were directly involved in the collusion, including the ceo the deputy ceo, the credit president , the director of public affairs, as you said their Ethics Office, the former science directorate of a former practice directorate. The whole structure. The report also documents that the group engaged directly in the collusion, were carrying out apa policy to make the Defense Department to please the Defense Department. So the association cant claim it was just this group of rogue people. It was not. They were creative, lets put it this way, and how they carried out the apa policy. But it was clear. Top leaders in many of the things that were being done. We are still open to see. I think the association has made many positive steps, come far from where they were, but they still have far to go. Amy were going to go to break and come back to this discussion and be joined by one of the original whistleblowers in a 2005 task force of the American Psychological association what she exposed about this task force that weekend the recommended recommended weakening the guidelines for the apa in dealing with torture. We will be speaking with dr. Jean maria arrigo in addition to dr. Stephen soldz. Stay with us. [music break] amy in 2009, the musician wrote a song 109 with lyrics taken from the torture memos of the Bush Administration. This is democracy now democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. We are talking about this stunning expose, this report that was commissioned, and independent report by the mac and Psychological Association significant globally because it is the largest association of psychologists in the world with more than 130,000 members. Were joined by dr. Stephen soldz, coalition for an ethical psychology cofounder and dr. Jean maria arrigo, a social psychologist and oral historian. She was asked to participate in the apa task force that convened in 2005 that ended up condoning psychologists involvement in enhanced interrogation, which would become known as torture. Later she would blow the whistle. She established the apa pens debate collection at university of colorado boulder archives. She is joining us from irvine california. Start out by telling us what this pens task force was, dr. Jean maria arrigo. First, your response to this report. Do you feel you have been vindicated . Yes, that is not my principal concern. My concern is that there is significant reform in the apa. And so we can all be vindicated and happy with the report, but unless theres some progress from here, it is just a you know media event. Amy tell us about this report back in 2005, how you came to be a part of it and what actually took place. It was a president ial advisory committee, task force that was set up under president Ronald Reagan at that time. It was in response to we were told into the reports of psychologists, possibly being involved at all be great or wherever and there was a great clamor among the membership. So they were asking for the leadership to give some response to the so the task force was the response. I appreciate your saying that i was invited to participate. In fact, i was appointed to be duped, speaking frankly. So 10 of us met. One of them was Olivia Moorehead slaughter, the chair of the meeting, and i think it has been described before that six of the other nine were in the National Security sector. Some were military officers in uniform. That was significant to me because i didnt expect that officers in uniform would lie to us in that context. So we met for about three days and we produced this report at the end. There were a lot of platitudes in it, but the heart of it was as far as the operational aspect, was that operational psychologists, Behavior Team psychologists who were in the detainee centers, detention centers, the gist of the report or the heart of it was that psychologists had a legitimate reason to be there to keep interrogations safe, legal ethical, and effective. That was one part. The other part was the psychologists would it here to the definition of torture torture was outlawed, of course witted here to the u. S. Definition of torture instead of the International Definition of torture and the conventions against torture. Amy when you say you were appointed to be duped, what do you mean . What i meant, apparently as we see in the hoffman report, there were background checks on us. We were looked at. I was supposedly i thought i was brought in because of my great expertise, ok . And this fantasy was brought home to me by the ethics director Stephen Behnke. I was brought in, supposedly according to the hoffman report, as a latina for diversity. Unfortunate, latina here met someone with Sicilian Mafia background, instead of across the border. And the manipulation began very early on. For instance, i was seating was not at random or by choice, i was seated on one side by morgan banks, who was the head of the biscuit psychologist, and on the other side, the now president who was at that time the liaison from the apa board to the task force. And as i felt later, not at the time, and as was borne out in the hoffman report, behnke especially, was the person chosen to manipulate me, as well as banks was the person chosen to manipulate me, as well as Stephen Behnke. They would come up to me the hallway and say, we are so gratified your here with your other point of view will stop we really need to hear from you. Please, keep informing us. What were doing right here now is just the first stage in the ideas that you are bringing up will continue to the later more important stages. So another psychologist and i were strung along with this idea. Amy you, dr. Jean maria arrigo in this room, you attempted to take notes. You are known as being a prolific notetaker. What happened and how to the report get written that came out of this task force . Ok, first let me say in a task force, normally, everyone is taking notes and normally there is an agenda. In our task force, besides the 10 or so, eight or 10, never acknowledged observers at the end of our long table, none of the Task Force Members had any papers on the table and taking notes. And we were given no agenda will step in fact, the person who was the nominal chair did not actually run the meeting. That was another unacknowledged person. So the fact i was taking notes became very conspicuous in this stark situation. I have a notebook always. I am and oral historian. I take notes. Before i went into this meeting i had talked to brad bauer, who is the archivist at Hoover Institution archives where i have was archiving oral histories, Oral Development of intelligence professional. And he said, well, maybe this will be a significant event maybe not, but it is a good thing to just collect everything while you are there. You know, this would be good archival practice. So in fact, i did collect everything just as a matter of good form. I had no clue that there was anything suspicious going on in the beginning. It would be as if summoned he called the task force, were going to talk about School Bullying or something, so i had no clue that there was any sabotage a foot. But it is normal for me to take notes and to collect everything, so i happened to have all of those things. But i did not at all go at this suspiciously. Amy you told us on democracy now years ago, you talked about the unbalanced nature of this task force. He said six of the 10 members were highly placed in the department of defense as contractors and military officers, for example, one with the commander of all military psychologist, their positions on two key items of controversy in the pens report were predetermined by their dod employment despite the apparent ambivalence of some. These key items for the permissive definition of torture versus the strict definition and international law. And second, the interrogation settings versus nonparticipation. You talked about the conflict of interest between the people dissipating, the emperors are higher up participating, the observers harrop, the significance of this in shaping apa policy for the next 10 years . All of this i came by later right, at the time i wasnt somehow tipped off by having all the military people there. I am accustomed to working with the military and have a lot of respect for them. I was an annual participant in the joint Services Conference of professional ethics for long time. And i thought, well, at least we have people who know what is going on. And the years after the pens Task Force Meeting when a was invited to give talks places, i always invited an interrogator along to speak with me or some other intelligence person. I wasnt alarmed by their being there to begin with. I was just later shocked by their duplicity. Amy i want to go back to 2005. We have been covering this issue for a long time. To Stephen Behnke the director , of ethics at the American Psychological association, appeared on democracy now. I dont have firsthand knowledge of what went on at guantanamo. I know the apa very much once the facts and that when apa has the facts we will act on those facts. Amy that is Stephen Behnke. Apparently, he was either forced out or he resigned last week. The significance dr. Stephen soldz, of Stephen Behnkes rolled in all of this role in all of this . According to the report, he is described as the chief of staff of this collusion. He was the one who was all centered around him but i want to emphasize the entire world large portion of the upper leadership of the organization was involved. But he was the mastermind of it. So in that quote you have, we want the facts, well, mr. Hoffman and the report details that in fact they tried very hard to never be exposed to those facts, that they systematically ignore the facts when they were there, that on the task force, for example the note show Jean Maria Arrigo tried to get them to examine what psychologists are actually doing at guantanamo and he was slammed by thenpresident for us doing that. In fact, he said if that is what you want to do, you should have stayed home. So they were very careful to avoid learning those facts. As the facts became public, basically denied them and ignore them over and over again. But Stephen Behnke was a mastermind at wordsmithing so that as critics tried within the association to modify, to come out with antitorture resolutions, he systematically worked with dod officials to nuance the wording so it would actually not constraine the military psychologists one bit. So they would have these nicesounding antitorture things that actually did not mean a word. There were some of us at the time who were saying that. Of course, we were always described as those who will never be satisfied. The report shows those of us who would never be satisfied were right, that those nicesounding statements are just that nicesounding statements, but had no bite. Amy explain who just one mitchell was and what David Hoffman in this report again, this report is this right, commissioned by the mac and Psychological Association to look at it, and independent report that has just been released . The question is, will there be indictments . What will come out of this . And it is to their credit they they commissioned it. Mitchell and jensen are two psychologist who designed and implemented much of the cias enhanced interrogation program. They were retired military psychologist. One thing the report shows is in 2003, the top psychologist in the cias own office of medical services raised questions about what mitchell was doing as he was torturing people. So mitchell got a psychologist who was a cia contractor, we learn in the report, and he was also very connected to the apa to evaluate and write a memo saying enhanced interrogation program, the torture program, was in fact consistent with apa ethics. Mitchell is allowed to go on torturing people. So here we have apa ethics explicitly used to protect the torture. Apa had a number of contacts with mitchell and justin over the years that until this report, they did not does we try to call attention to them. They completely ignored it. The report also showed that ethics complaint was filed against James Mitchell in 2005. The Ethics Office look into membership directory you cant make this stuff up. They looked in the directory and saw the rich regions metals and they didnt nothing further and bailout mitchell to resign which are not supposed to build a do while youre underinvested under investigation. They would not even try to figure out which of the three was come even though they had extensive contacts with them. Theyre on the first name basis that he was jim mitchell to the staff. They said there were three gyms metals, we can tell who it is case closed. Amy back to Stephen Behnke who just left his week his position last week. The report says while working at the apa, head of the ethics division, the report says the pentagon gave him a secret contract to help train interrogators. Is that news to you, Stephen Soldz dr. Stephen soldz . We learned it a couple of months ago, psychologists and journalists wrote about it and we also heard about it from other sources. He was training the socalled biscuit psychologist, behavior science consultants, those who consult to interrogations at guantanamo, at the military facility that trains interrogators. This was evidently, napa contract. The money went to apa. So they were directly working the amount of money was not big. The big story here is not the financial corruption, but how close the ties were that he was actually working for them. Amy ultimately, dr. Stephen soldz what did the apa had to gain by doing this after you talk about turning a blind eye. And in the involvement of american psychologist in the torture Program Actually allow it to continue, gave it the legitimacy that the Bush Administration needed to continue this program with the American Medical Association the American Psychiatric association, both saying they would not participate. Definitely. In addition to mitchell and jessen doing the interrogations and designing it, another major role for Health Professionals, including psychologists, was in the torture memos. The basic argument is, if a Health Professional says it wont cause severe longlasting harm, the u. S. Definition, then even if it does cause severe longlasting harm, you cant be accused of torture because you were told by a Health Professional it wouldnt. So it is vital to have the psychologist present to say that it would not cause harm, to supposedly monitor. Safe, legal, ethical, and effective was the mantra commandos was safe, legal, and ethical meant. It meant, we will say it wont cause harm, but we will keep it legal and we will keep us safe for the torturers. Amy what was satisfy you, dr. Stephen soldz, for the americans Psychological Association . That is a long list, so i can go over all of it, but we need to see that they really understand the depth of what went wrong, to come to term with what was wrong in the association that this could go on for so many years, change the policy, and they have proposed doing that to ban psychologist participating in interrogation. There are possible loopholes that we have some concerns about that need to be worked out. The whole coulter of the apa deeds to change. It is a culture of getting along and doing whatever the leadership once and not raising questions. And that allowed this to go on for decades, that allowed even people in the top who were told over and over again something is not right here, they closed their eyes to it. And we cant have that happen again. Amy will there be firings . There better be. Stephen behnke was fired, but we gave them a list of eight people from the report that we believe the report documents were involved in need to be fired amy who are those . Among them are the ceo and deputy ceo, the chief of the Public Relations office. Amy who is that . Reaffirmed berman. You probably jealous her in the past. These people and the others were all shown to be deeply involved in the collusion. They were working with Stephen Behnke, informed of much of what he was doing, that helped him, helped select the members of the pens task force to vet them. That undermine the will of the membership systematically over and over again. They have to go. Do you think there should be indictments . There should be a legal investigation. Whether there were crimes, the statute of limitations, but if the conspiracy continues the last two years, then that would be overdone. Another thing that has to be theres a larger group of people and governance who are not paid staff, banned from future governance because it systematically manipulated participated in the manipulation. Amy dr. S, thank you for being here, professor at the Boston Graduate School of psychoanalysis and cofounder of the coalition for an ethical psychology. And thank you to dr. Jean maria arrigo is a social psychologist and oral historian. Shes a member of the coalition for an ethical psychology. She established the apa pens debate collection. She would later blow that was all. When we come back, we go to Vienna Austria on the Nuclear Negotiations with iran. Stay with us. [music break] amy this is democracy now , democracynow. Org, the war and peace report. Im amy goodman. We turn now to what could be the final step in a Historic Deal between iran and six world powers that would limit tehrans nuclear ability for more than a decade in exchange for sanctions relief. Negotiations over Irans Nuclear program entered their 17th and possibly last day in vienna today, as interim agreement is set to expire at 6 00 p. M. Et tonight. Secretary of state john kerry told reporters he is confident a deal is within reach, but negotiators in vienna are still smoothing over key details including what limits to set on Irans Nuclear research, the pace of sanctions relief, and whether to lift a United Nations arms embargo on iran. If a deal is brokered, congress will have 60 days to review it keeping u. S. Sanctions in place in the meantime. An extra 22 days are set aside for voting, a possible president ial veto, and then another vote to see if opponents can muster 67 senate votes to override the veto. Meanwhile, the iranian president is set to address iran on the nuclear deal in the next few hours. For more we go to Vienna Austria where were joined by flynt leverett, who is there following the talks. Author of, going to tehran why america must accept the Islamic Republic of iran and is a professor of International Affairs at penn state. Served for over a decade in the u. S. Government as a Senior Analyst at the cia, middle east specialist for the state department, and as senior director for middle east affairs at the National Security council. Flynt leverett, welcome to democracy now what is happening at this moment in vienna . I believe a final agreement is going to be reached here. What were watching is a very very slow and excruciatingly slow process. Negotiators have basically finished their work. Text has gone back to National Capitals for final review. Especially on the u. S. Side, the process of review within the Obama Administration is moving along very, very slowly. The white house has not come back with specific concerns, specific point that it once in a fact to negotiate renegotiate, but it seems like the Obama Administration is being very deliberate, to say the least, in reviewing the work that is done here. And that means, you know, if one of the parties is slow, it means it delays the time at which people can produce final text, text that can basically be released to the world when the parties are ready to announce. That is what were watching right now. But i still think were going to get to a final agreement very soon. Amy can you talk about the main issues that are in this agreement and those left to resolve. Yes. The main issues, which to the best of my understanding, have been resolved are the nature of the limit on its new care activities that iran will observe Nuclear Activities that iran will observe while an agreement is in place, the scope of sanctions release for iran, sentience lifting. It has been worked out. Over the last few days, the main issues that needed to be worked through concern precise terms on specific parts of a new United Nations Security Council that will lift that will nullify previous resolutions related to the Iran Nuclear Issue remove International Sanctions against iran authorized by the Security Council, including the arms embargo and formally launch implementation of this agreement. To the best of my understanding negotiators here have basically reached an understanding about the terms of the Security Council resolution, but as i said, it is being reviewed and National Capitals and that review process is going especially slowly in washington. Amy on sunday, israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu denounced the pending Iranian Nuclear deal being sought by international negotiators. This is what he said. Iran does not hide its intention to continue its murderous aggression, even those with which it is negotiating. Perhaps theres somebody among the powers who is willing to capitulate to the reality iran is stick trading which includes its repeated calls for the destruction of israel. We will not accept this. Amy flynt leverett, your response. Well, im selling a surprise that the Prime Minister would say that i am certainly not surprised that the primus to with say that. The traditional allies in the region, israel and saudi arabia, both have been working to undermine a deal, even if they are not able to stop a deal, and i dont think they will be theyre working very hard to put as much pressure as possible on the United States so that a Nuclear Agreement doesnt become a critical first step in a broader we alignment of u. S. Iranian relations. My own view, my wife and i both in government and in the years since we left government, have argued that the first fully for its own interest the United States desperately needs to come to terms with the Islamic Republic of iran that increasingly important power in the middle east. It needs to balance its traditional but increasingly dysfunctional relationship with strategically grounded engagement with iran. This nuclear deal could be a critical first step in that direction. It is one of the reasons i am here, to try to help make that argument but there are a lot of pressures on the Obama Administration and im not sure there is a real defense within the administration to use a Nuclear Agreement, which i said, we will get here with relatively short order. I dont think there is that kind of consensus in the administration to use a deal as a springboard for what i think is an imperative realignment of u. S. Relations with iran. The u. S. Needs to revamp its approach to the middle east. A critical step in that revamping will be realigning u. S. Relations with iran. Amy speaking on fox news sunday, Senate Majority leader Mitch Mcconnell suggested the Obama Administration will have a difficult time Convincing Congress to approve a deal with iran. We already know that it is going to leave iran as a threshold nuclear state. We know that. It appears as if the administrations approach to this was to reach whatever agreement the iranians are willing to enter into. So i think it is going to be a very hard sell if it is completed in congress. Amy the republican majority is expected to vote against the deal and to try to convince at least 12 democrats to join their ranks an attempt to defeat president ial veto. Flynt leverett, explain what has to happen in the United States for the u. S. To approve this. What is the voting that will take lace . Both houses of congress will have 60 days to review the agreement once it is finalized. I think it is quite possible, if not likely that a simple majority of members in each house will vote a socalled resolution of disapproval in regard to the agreement. At that point, president obama has said he would be to desk veto those resolutions of disapproval. At this point, the white house seems pretty confident that they have the votes, at least in the senate and perhaps in the house as well, to sustain president obamas veto. So they are confident if they can get to an agreement here in vienna, it will ultimately get through the congressional review process and go into effect. But obviously, during the next 60 days following the conclusion of an agreement, the israelis, the saudis, their friends and allies in the political system, others who dont want to see this agreement go forward, are going to be working very hard trying to turn Public Opinion against the deal and trying to build congressional support to maximize the vote against the deal. Public opinion polls, which show americans are open to supporting this deal, but one of the things i really worry about is that president obama himself has not really made the strategic case for why doing this deal and for why building a different kind of relationship with iran is so strongly in americas interest. He talks about this as a kind of narrow arms control agreement but iran is still this very bad actor, or he talks about it in terms of it being an opportunity for iran to rejoin the international community. This is not the way to sell this deal to americans. Americans understand that what the United States is doing in the middle east for the last decade and a half is actually been profoundly against american interests. It has also been very damaging to middle easterners. But it has been profoundly damaging to americas position in this critical part of the world and globally. President obama has a chance to begin to turn that around and put u. S. Policy toward the middle east on a more different and more productive trajectory, but he is going to have to make the strategic case. Amy flynt leverett, we have to leave it there. We will continue to follow this. A very special congratulations to our video producerhani masoood who is just had a baby with his wife. [captioning made possible by democracy now ]