Democracy. And democracy must win. Robert next. Announcer this is Washington Week. Corporate funding is provided by when the world gets complicated, a lot goes through your mind. With fidelity wealth management, a dedicated advisor can tailor advice and recommendations to your life. Thats fidelity wealth management. Announcer additional funding is provided by the estate of arnold adams and koo and Patricia Yuen through the yuen foundation, committed to bridging cultural differences in our communities, the corporation for public broadcasting and by contributions to yourbs station from viewers like you. Thank you. Once again, from washington, moderator robert costa. Robert good evening. And welcome. Washington took a pause on friday to remember Justice Ruth Bader ginsburg a. Trailblazer and an advocate for womens rights who became a liberal icon. As chief Justice John Roberts said during a ceremony this week in courts great hall said it was quoted ruth wanted to be an opera virtuoso but became a rock star instead. And on friday she became e first woman and the first Jewish American to lie in state at the capitol. But that paue here in washington will be brief. On saturday, President Trump will announce his choice to fill the vacant seat on the court. According to the washington post, the New York Times and other news outlets tonight President Trump has settled on judge Amy Coney Barrett of indiana. Barrett is a favorite of conservatives and her nomination hearings next month would likely become a brutal litical battleground. Roiling the president ial campaign and all those debates over abortion rights and health care. Senate republicans are determined to move quickly and hold a final vote on the nomination before the election. What does this mean for the g. O. P. And for Vice President biden . And what about american democracy . With the senate and the court now front and center, weve gathered three of the best journalists on those beats. Carl hulse, chief washington correspondent for the New York Times and author of bias, inside washingtons war over the Supreme Court from scalias death toustice kavanaugh. Seung min kim, White House Reporter for the washington post. And Nina Totenberg, Legal Affairs correspondent for National Public radio. Nina, i would like to begin with you. Welcome back to Washington Week. A 63 conservative majority is now on the horizon for the nation, for the court. Whats the significance of that . Seung well, to begin with nina to begin with, this would be a collection if judge barrett is confirmed, of the most conservative judges to sit on the court probably back to the 1930s. And a 63 majority means that if any one of them flakes poff on a particular off on a particular issue, it doesnt matter. They still got five votes. So its a very i hesitate to say bulletproof, but a very safe majority for a particular ideological stripe of people. Robert seung min kim, youre on the byline of the washington most whats the rationale inside the white house for judge Coney Barrett . Seung well, shes clearly been the frontrunner ever since this vacancy, the seat became open last friday night with Justice Ginsburgs death. She had a series of interviews at the white house earlier this week. Those interviews according to your sources and mine went very well. Shwas very heavily lobbied for in the white house by key white house officials including a white house chief of staff mark meadows and counsel pat sibaloni and heavily promoted by Senate Republicans, Senate Majority leader Mitch Mcconnell who will be steering so much of this process on capitol hill, was confident with judge barrett. She is a known cmodity. Not only has she been confirmed, she had become kind of this rising rock star among conservatives because after her brutal confirmation fight for her current circuit cot seat, and a lot of Senate Republicans had been privately pushing judge barrett for some time. They have seen her as the perfect candidate for the Ruth Bader Ginsburg vacancy. Someone who really ds excite the their base, conservative voters. And they seem to think they know its going to be a bruising fight but this is on nominee that theyre happy t put it all on the line for. Robert carl, will leader mcconnell be able to get this done by election day . Carl yeah. Thats the big question surrounding all of this. The time line is pretty tight. And as weve seen in recent Supreme Court confirmations, things bubble up that could push it past the election. But right now, they think they can get it done. Its going to be very quick. Its going to feel very quick to people. But in some ways, b, to me, this is the culmination of whats been going on in washington for the last four years. The republicans in the senate led by leader mcconnell along with the Trump Administration have been reshaping the courts. This is the ultimate reshaping of the courts. This is the big prize. And i dont think that eyre going to let democrats stand in the way of getting that. Robert nina, carl just said that things could bubble up. Youve covered Supreme Court nomination fights for decades. We saw in the 1980s with judge bork, the process is can become quite acrimonious. Should we expect the unexpected here . Nina you should always expect the possibility of the unexpected. And there was a very interesting Statement Issued from the f. B. I. Director today saying that we should please remember that the terms of the investigation by the f. B. I. Are set by the white house. Now, to me e. The translation of that is dont blame us if something comes up we didnt find because the white house sets the terms for our investigation. So i would look probably to Interest Groups that oppose judge barrett who will be looking for some information that they dont know, reporters to be investigating her background. But shes a very beloved person in her hometown of where she lives in south bend, indiana, where she was a law professor for 15 years. And still teaches at notre dame. And shes beloved by a diversity of people for whom she is enormously generous. That does not address the question of course of her idea loling ideology which is more than conservative. It is right up there with the man she clerked for, justice antonin scalia, a ferocious opponent of abortion. And judge barrett of course has also weighed in on obamacare saying that shes been very critical of chief Justice Roberts opinion when he cast his fifth and deciding vote to uphold obamacare. And were going to have a wk after the election, were going to have arguments in the third challenge to obamacare. Robert following up on ninas point there, how are democrats on the Senate Jewish committee goin to handle this . Judiciary Committee Going to handle this . Will it be a broader argument against her on health care . What are you learning . Seung so there are a couple of decisions that democrats have to make when it comes to their strategy. First of all, is a lot of these procedural tactics, strategy decisions, do you meet with the nominee and do you go as far as boy boycotting the hearing . What do you do to delay it out . And thats a lot of inside baseball talk. But yes, democrats want to make this about the issues. Because you and i all know here that the courts have generally been an issue that has galvanized conservative voters. And now under the trump presidency, democrats and progressive groups have been trying to change that calculus and some polling that shows the courts may even be before even before Justice Ginsburgs death that the courts may that the courts are slowly turning into a more important issue for democratic voters which is a fascinating shift. But democrats also know that they have to tie this into issues that matter for their base. And we know tha Health Care Matters so much, it was a key part of their midterm victory in the 2018 midterm elections so theyre going to find out as nina said that this justice is going to hear, if she is confirmed, that shes going to be on the on the panel of nine that hears this critical case that will determine the future of the Affordable Care act. You saw a statement, a pretty strong statement from senator diane feinstein, the top democrat on the committee, saying this is the this is the vote that matters to the future of abortion. So thats what youre going to be hearing a lot from democrats in the coming days. You will hear a lot about process. You will hear as we have heard about the hypocrisy issue considering what republicans did to Merrick Garland in016. But the message is going to be health care, health care, health care, and the future of these critical rights that democrats warn are at stake. Robert carl, republicans now have a majority in the senate with 53 seats, democrats have 47. But come november, their power as seung was saying could be at risk and marketia mcsally of arizona and cory gardner in colorado with their races leaning toward the democrats and could be a tossup for david perdue of georgia, joanie ernst ofey, Susan Collins of maine and tom till of nyse b North Carolina and even Lindsey Graham and kelly loeffler. Those lean republicans. Th democrats are going to be health care, health care, health care, how does this affect the senate map . Carl i think were trying to game that out and so are the people who run these campaigns. Theres two schools of thought here. But that its probably not a great situation for cory gardner in colorado whos in big trouble in a state that doesnt like trump. Arizona may already be lost. Susan collins of course was at the center of the kavanaugh fight. Some people think, well, maybe this can help Susan Collins who is opposed to moving forward schmo separate herself from trumprom trump. But well have to see about that. People think it could help symptom lagging republicans, thom tillis in North Carolina, and ive heard republican strategists say to me, its basically going to be a tillisbarrett ticket down there. And in other states. So right now, though, i think that democrats are probably remaining in a pretty good position to take the majority. Its interesting, bob, theres two things that Mitch Mcconnell really likes. He likes being majority leader. And he likes putting conservative judges on the court. Are these things in conflict this time . I think were going to find out by the end of the confirmation and the election. Robert nina, thrs the battleground right now but the Court Broadly speaking is becoming a battleground in american life. We saw today hoe democrats are thinking abo proposing legislation to have 18year term limits on Supreme Court justices. When you look at the fight over Coney Barrett, when you look at the court as an instition, what are the challenges right w moving forward . Nina well, i think thats a story thats yet to be told. You know, six months ago, if you would have said that term limits, adding justices to the court, rotating justices on and off the court, that tha would be a live possibility. We would have all thought you we mad. And im not prepared to say that this is a sure bet. But if Coney Barrett is confirmed, and the court moves decidedly to the right, and for example, strikes down obamacare, strikes down other pieces of legislation, that might that might be enacted by a democratic congress, and signed by a democratic president , then youre in a whole different ball game and the possibility that the elections very close. And in a it ends up before the Supreme Court. And what if the Supreme Court votes again against the person who carried the popular vote . This is you know, a powder keg that were talking about. Robert when you saw our Cook Political Report and all the different races that are now pretty much up for grabs, when youre talking to democrats, who do they see as possible republicans they could peel off . Seung in terms of if youre talking about democrats who where democrats feel good about these races, they its like what carl said earlier. They think that this hurts people in, you know, in these purple blueleaning states such as colorado and maine. But you have seen this the Democratic Senate candidates who clearly do have the momentum right now even in these purple leaning red states, still being very careful around the issue. Because you know that this is an issue, the Supreme Courts are such a polarizing, toxic issue and really does make people put on their partisan jerseys and a lot of these Democratic Senate candidates do need crossover voters. In North Carolina, there does need to be that trump cunningham voter oryle cunningham the democrat there needs to appeal to that kind of voter as well. So some of the changethat are being proposed that nina discussed just a few minutes ago such a. F. C. Expanding the number of seats such as expanding the number of seats and while there arettes threats from some lawmakers and definitely from the base, it is far from assured that even if judge Coney Barrett is confirmed, tha these changes will be enacted in 2021 or even ever. Robert carl, can you follow up on that . I see you whispering to Senate Democrats i wont name in the hallways of the capitol. Is there an appetite next year if biden wins the white house to pack the court . Carl i think that theyre going to be under a lot of pressure from the left to do something. But bob, as you know the first step to that is all what do you do about the filibuster . That you would have to eliminate the filibuster in a narrowly divided senate to enact these kind of changes. And i think it starts with that. And you have to see where that progresses. You know, who who thought a few years ago all these senators who had said they would never do a Supreme Court nomination again, republican senators, in a president ial year, they flipped. You could have democrats right now who arent talking about this, who might say later on, well, circumstances have changed, and we need to do it. They are alarmed right now, though, about talking too much about this subject during the campaign. You know, they need moderate voters, republicans think this turns off moderate voters. Theyre really pushing democrats on that. I think that if the democrats win the senate and the white house next year, youd see a lot of activity but first around the filibuster and then see what happens from there. Robert were a long way away from next year. And i want to turn to something nina mentioned about a possible court fight, because the Supreme Court could be the pivotal institution in the wake of the election. And presidt trump continues to warn of widespread voter fraud even as the f. B. I. Director Christopher Wray shut down such a suggestion in testimony this week. And he said theres no evidence of that. White house chief of staff mark meadows then attacked wray on friday and told him to quote, drill down instead on the justice departments probe of discarded mailin ballots in pennsylvania. This standoff over the integrity election, its testing american democracy. And so is the president s comment this wk that, quote, were going to have to see what happens when he was asked if he will commit to a peaceful transfer of power. A day later, the g. O. P. Controlled senate affirmed its commitment to a peaceful transfer with no objections to the resolution offered by senator joe manchin, a moderate democrat, but republican responses to the president , they were mostly muted. There there will be a peaceful transition of power and anyone who has sworn an oath to our constitution including the president im confident is committed to the same principle. President trump there will be a smooth transition. And i believe President Trump will have a very good inaugural and mr. Reunite this nation. Robert nina, how serious is this moment for american democracy . Nina i think that is pret serious. If we ended up with a very close election, and a bush vs. Gore kind of situation with a court thats far more conservative than the bush vs. Gore court was, and i dont know what that means for Voting Rights, but in general, the republican nominees on the Supreme Court currely have not been particularly friendly to Voting Rights. Theyve turned aside virtually every challenge to Voting Rights infringement this year. And that includes chief Justice Roberts. So this is has potential to be really explosive. And as a citizen, one can only hope it doesnt come to that. Robert carl, there was a headline in the New York Times, your paper, on friday, quote, at pentagon, fears grow that trump will pull military into election unrest. When youre talking to republicans, how do they see this issue privately and perhaps publicly . Carl yeah, i think that that was an excellent story. Because the pentagon it shows you that they are worried about this. I think this has become just as nina said a very serious situation. I think people were taking it a little lighter. But the president has continued to insist on this. And i think democrats are alarmed andre making plans, Mitch Mcconnell, the republicans came out and said of course theres going to be a peaceful transition. And they passed that resoluti. But thats window dressing. Mitchcconnell may be a lot of things. Hes not a clairvoya. He cant sit there and say theres going to be a peaceful transition. I think this is going to get more worrisome as it proceeds. And i think it you know, its weve all been talking for months or even years now at this point, when would Senate Republicans really confront President Trump . I mean, that might be the moment where they have to do it. And we will see what happens. Robert carl, just to follow up, there was that moment famously in 1974 where senator goldwater goes to nixon and says its time to go. President trumps defeated. Do you see Senate Republicans playing a prominent role in trying to have a peaceful transfer of power or not . Carl i mean, we havent seen that from the republicans yet. That real showdown moment. I presume that the event of a clear outcome, that they would do that. But as you saw in their comments this week, both sides, well, Hillary Clinton said joe biden shouldnt concede. That was out of context. So they theyre not there yet. That is for sure. And weve got weve got a ways to go. Robert seung min, when youre reporting on the white house and talking to officials there inside and outside, do they see the president s comments as a president trying to protect his brand or do they see him as a president really ready to use the levers of power to stay in office . Seung well, they have had to explain away a lot of president s comments for weeks now. Talking about his repeated baseless claims about the safety of mail mailin balloting and another comment they had to kind of qualify. You saw Kayleigh Mcenany the day after the the White House Press secretary the day after the president s comments saying the president will support a free and fair election. But that is not what he had really said. You know, in his comments. And thats why youre seeing the concern and following up on what carl was saying earlier, it is not often that Mitch Mcconnell comments proactively on the president s comments or his tweets. He makes it clear to us that he does not make it a habit of do so. So the fact that he put out a statement, you know, as kind of soft as it may be, that there will be a peaceful transfer of power, an after election day shows you the level of alarm that republican oicials, Republican Leaders were seeing at this point. Robert nina, i mentioned 1974 in gold water and nimp to carl and nixon to carl. You began your career around reporting on the nixon white house. Any Lessons Learned from that period or when you covered bush vs. Gore in 2000 to help us understand what were going through here . Ni well, those were really different times. People were institutionalists. Senator gold water who was among the most conservative members of the senate today might be slightly to the left in the Republican Party in the senate. And there were lots of people who had served for a very long time in the senate and the house. And that is no longer true. There are some o bulls left but not many of them and the old bulls could be a block to abolishing the filibuster who could be a block to any sort of ideas about changing the Supreme Court. That is sort of but they are few and far between anymore. Robert and we also are looking ahead next week to the first president ial debate, moderated by Chris Wallace of fox news tuesday night in cleveland, ohio. Carl, what do democrats want to see from Vice President biden . Hes been prepping for days. Carl they want to see a competent debate. Ive had more and more democrats say to me in the past few days, boy, were really hoping for a good date. They see this as a critical moment. Biden is going to have to stand up to the president , call him out on some of these things in a forceful way to democrats there is a lot riding on this debate right now. Robert what about inside the white house, seung min . Seung well, they clearly see this as a critical moment as well. But you have seen for some time the president kind of lowering the expectations, not directly in reference to the debates, but just all the references that he and his team make to make toward the former Vice President s work ethic, his demeanor, the president s nicknames toward him, sleepy joe, so i think in that sense they m have unintentionally or not lowered expectations for the Vice President at this debate. So whether that was a smart strategy move or not, yet to be seen. But the president is clearly not someone who does debate prep in the traditional sense. So on the issues that we know are going to be discussed. So the pandemic, the Supreme Court, all these critical issues. Well see how trump kind of shows up. And it will be just a fascinating contrast to watch. Robert nina, in the final 30 seconds here, your friend justice ginsburg, what a week watching all of the remembrances of her, when you stand back and reflect, what comes to mind at this moment on friday night . Nina well, you know what really caught me unaware, i had not anticipated, i anticipated all the political firestorm. What i didnt anticipate that was that when she died on friday night, within an hour, there were hundreds of peesm who just went to the people who just went to the sprome court with candles and flowers and singing. Singing amazing grace. That i didnt expect. Robert well, nina, i expected it because we all saw her immense following across the country but i want to say thank you to all of you. We will talk more wh nina in our Washington Week extra. But really appreciate, carl hulse, seung min kim, and Nina Totenberg being here tonight for the broadcast. Really appreciate it. And well keep taking you as close to the news as we can. But for now, im robert costa. Good night from washington. Announcer Corporate Funding for Washington Week is provided by when the world gets complicated, a lot goes through your mind. With fidelity wealth management, a dedicated advisor can tailor advice and recommendses to your life. Recommendations to your life. Thats fidelity wealth management. Announcer additional funding is provided by the estate of arnold adams and koo and Patricia Yuen through the yuen foundation. Committed to bridging culture differences in our communities, the corporation for public broadcasting and by contributions to your pbs station from viewers like you. Thank you. Where am i now . Oh, god knows. In the middle of nowhere, i guess. [music playing] were at desert x. Desert x. Desert x. Ha ha ha [music playing] yeah, i heard a little bit about desert x from the locals