Or could there be another shocking Election Night . Plus, heading for another covid surge. Were likely to grapple situation where everybody part of the nation will be lit up by infection. President trump claiming falsely that the pandemic is disappearing. You know what, without the vacci vaccine, were around the turn. And you got to get your governor to open up your state lock her up as cases spike from coast to coast. Utah is now facing its most dire episode yet in this pandemic. North carolinaens must be even more vigilant. This morning i will speak to governor whitmer, health and human secretary alex cesar and Michael Osterholm. Joining me for analysis, mark leeb wishes from new york no magazine, Donna Edwards, Ashley Parker, White House Reporter for the Washington Post and former republican governor of North Carolina, patrick mccrory. Welcome to sunday. Its meet the press. Announcer from nbc news in washington, the longestrunning show in television history, this is meet the press with chuck todd. Good sunday morning. As if we hadnt faced enough already in this year, 2020 is about to deal us two more challenges. First, in just over two weeks our deeply divided country is going to have an election that will reveal its character and direction over the next four years. And our new nbc news wall street journal poll by a 54 margin registered voters say theyre better off now than they were four years ago. Good news for President Trump, right . By cement a 58 38 margin voters say the country is worse off than it was four years ago. What do those seemingly contradictory results tell us . That this year it is not the economy, stupid, its the coronavirus. Which brings us to the second challenge, a frightening new surge of infections and covid19 deaths. In recent weeks weve experienced an increase in cases that looks very much like the beginning of a third peak, with friday hitting the biggest oneday total judge july 24th, when we were in the middle of peak 2. In washington state, case numbers increased by 25 or more. With the virus the greatest threat to the president s reelection, mr. Trump routinely insists were rounding the corner. The rounding the corner. Or we really going in circles . We win wisconsin, we win the whole ball game. Reporter President Trump campaigning in a handful of states he won four years ago. Were going to win the state of North Carolina. Were going to win the state of florida. I love georgia. Were going to win the state of michigan. Reporter trailing nationally by 11 points, the president is beginning to talk about losing. Can you imagine if i lose. My whole life, what am i going to do . Im going to say i lost to the worst candidate in the history of politics. Im not going to feel so good. Maybe ill have to leave the country, i dont know. Hes arguing his fund raising numbers, which fall fall short of bidens, are a choice. I can raise more money. Ive been the worlds greatest fundraiser. I just dont want to do it. Reporter and dwelling on a 26point deficit against women. I think suburban women like me. Frankly, i saved the your way of life, i saved the american dream. People say trump has a problem. Reporter mr. Trump is spending most of the time on the trail focused on his personal grievances. The media has become crazed and Big Tech Companies have become crazed. Its very unfair. So unfair. You should lock them up. Lock up the bidens, locke up hillary. Reporter republicans on capitol hill are beginning to distance themselves. The. I know were looking at the possibility of a republican bloodbath in the senate. Its going to be what the heck were any of us thinking that selling a tvobsessed narcissistic individual to the American People was a good idea . It is not a good idea. We all have a good chance of winning the white house. Reporter as coronavirus cases rise sharply around the cup country. We had many recordsketing days for hospitalizations, new cases and covid19 deaths. 2,532 new cases reported since yesterday, which is our highest oneday record. Utah is now facing its more dire episode yet. Reporter President Trump is denying the reality of the numbers. Rounding the turner. Turn the corner . My lord, its not disappearing. In fact, its on the rise again. Reporter and the president continues to make false claims about mask wearing. Zblim okay with masks. I tell people to wear masks. But just the other driveway they came out with a statement that 85 of the people who wear masks catch it. When the president doesnt wear a mask or makes fun of foiks like me when i was wearing a mask for a long time, then its people say well, it mustnt be that important. Reporter on that issue republicans are pushing back. I was the one who said we need to wear masks, practice essocial distancing. I always do pro most the cdc regulations. I let my guard down and it was wrong. It was just a big mistake. Yoining me now is the secretary of health an Human Services, alex azar. Secretaries aar, welcome back to meet the press. Let me start with something that i think is a bit confusing now to those of us in the professional press corps and many plenty of viewers at home, who is leading the Public Health strategy right now for the federal government as these cases go up . Is it you, is it the task force, is it scott atlas . Is it deborah birx . Is it dr. Fauci . Theres a lot of confusion about who is leading the Public Health policy discussions on the federal government level . Chuck, of course the president s leading the overall whole of government response and hes making all of us as Public Health leaders available to help educate the public. But what matters right now is the message were trying to get across, which is cases are increasing. You talked about that in your opening segment, cases are increasing. Were seeing this happen because were getting Colder Weather and were losing that National Social distancing that happens from being outdoors and people are getting tired. The American People have given so much, were seeing mitigation fatigue right now. I just hope that we have so much promise in the weeks and months ahead, next generation threat putices, safe and effective vaccines, please, my message to the American People, please, practice those three ws, wash your hands, watch your distance, wear your Face Coverings when you cant watch your distance, and really, chuck, tell your viewers to be mindful of indoor household gatherings. Just because youre related offer friends with someone doesnt mean you cant transmit or get transmitted to. Let me ask you about indoor gatherings, you were with the president in florida two days ago at a large indoor gathering in ft. Myers. Thats a state that no longer really has any restrictions. Every locality is basically on its own there. But, you know, i hear you the message you just sent, to be honest i was going to ask about this later in our interview, but you just sent this message, you were in that room. What message are we setting . What example are you setting as a top Public Health official participating in indoor events like that . Chuck, for that policy event, masks were distributed to all of the individuals attending and the chairs were set up in a socially distanced way. Of course, i wore Face Covering throughout. We encourage everybody to wear Face Covering and i wish everyone would wear Face Covering and maintain social distance. Our advice is the same no matter what the setting, wash your hands, watch your distance and wear your Face Coverings when you cant watch your distance. I guess what im trying to figure out are americans supposed to take your advice when the president doesnt take your advice . Hes been in the state of wisconsin. The state of wisconsin, you guys at the task force warned the state of wisconsin theyre in the red zone. Big events is a bad right right now. The president s campaign did what . Held a big event in the state in the red zone. Again, i go back to this, what example is being set by the federal government . Chuck, were seeing an increases in states whether red or blue or open or closed, we are seeing an explosion of cases in europe. Europe, the most lockedgown pasht of the western democracies and theyre seeing an explosion of cases, they got more cases per million than we have in the United States. Some countries on a population adjusted basis have two, three times what we have in the u. S. The ticket is in our own hands, chuck. Its what i talked about at the outset. Its about basic Public Health mitigation steps. We have it in our individual control. Its our ticket to be reconnected to education, to worship, to health care, and also to our public and civic life, chuck, wear a Face Covering when you cant be socially distant, chuck. Why has that message been so difficult for the president . I think its a difficult message for all western democracies. Were seeing that in europe. The American People have given so much. People of ukraine have given so much, chuck. Theyve been locked down, isolated and tired. But the point is, were so close. Hang in there with us. Were so close. Were weeks away from moan owe clonal antibodies for you for safe and effective vaccines. We need a bridge to that day. Please, give us a bit more time of your individual, responsible behavior of washing your hands, watch your distance, wear your Face Coverings when you cant watch your distance, chuck. Do you wish the president had your urgency . Your message is very compelling, it really is. I just dont see it by anybody above your pay grade. In ft. Mimers he said im glaz youre hearing them and engaging in your sifbl life and reconnected but if you feel vulnerable, please, stay hope, protect yourful is. First and foremost, protect yourself. That is my message to everybody is, first and foremost, protect yourself and protect those in your family. Let me ask you about dr. Scott atlas and the experts he brought in for you to meet with. The president is implying hes open to herd immunity. Is herd immunity now official Health Policy of the federal government . Is that what the task force is essentially pushing us towards, some form of herd immunity . Chuck, ill meet with individuals who are experts to learn, listen, hear perspectives. One important part thats what im focused on every day. I wake up every day with that as much mission and the core to that is get us safe therapeutics and safe vaccines in historic record time. Look, the pfizer ceo Just Announced by the end of november, he thinks they may be submitting an application for vaccine, ten months after this pandemic hit our shores. This is incredible, historic news, chuck, we ought to be celebrating and have a great sense of optimism for but also a recommitment. Bridge to that date. Bridge to that date. L l. Let me ask you a question about the vaccine and distribution plan. Have you briefed the biden team on this . No, i have not been asked to but i will follow whatever protocols there are for cooperation in terms of any efforts. No, that hasnt been asked for. What were working on is working with our state and local authorities on the vaccination plan. 63 of 64 states friday submitted their Vaccine Distribution plans and the other one just asked for a short exception. Thats all going extremely well and that cvs Walgreens Partnership will be critical to protecting the most vulnerable. Before i let you go, the president went to michigan, started talking about lock her up chants on the governor of michigan over her coronavirus restrictions. Let me ask you this, is it good to browbeat local officials in what theyre trying to go to contain the virus . Chuck, im not going to get into politics. What i will talk about red state, blue state, open state, closed state, open country, closed country, we see these cases spreading. Why . Because weve been in this for many months and people are tired. I talked about this back in february, march. As you get mitigation fatigue, people get tired. The steps to mitigate right now are simple, please, wash your hands, watch your distance, wear your Face Coverings when you cant watch your distance, stay out of settings. Please be mindful of indoor gatherings now as we get cold and keep our guard up. Happening in there with us. The days are numbered ahead. Mr. Secretary, if your message was coming out of the president s mouth, i think it would make a lot of Public Health officials a lot happier. Well chuck, the president s been saying wear masks since the april reopening guidelines. Im his secretary. I speak for him. Im telling you, thats the message, thats what im asking to you do on behalf of the president , do those things, to the American People. Secretary azar, i will leave it there. I appreciate you coming on and sharing the perspective of the administration. And joining me now is the democratic governor of michigan, its gretchen whitmer. Governor whitmer, welcome back to meet the press. I want to start with the state of the virus in your can stasta before we get to the Politics Around the virus. First, give me an update. Where is your state . I know youre part of this huge spike most of the country is in. You had some of your restrictions wiped away by the Supreme Court. I know some of them will get implicated but i know the r your power to eliminate this virus may be eliminated. What do you do . Thats right, chuck. We are seeing covid cases rise in michigan, what epidemiologists told us all along would happen as we got closer to the fall but im concerned, of course, because the Supreme Court decision in my state created a lot of confusion to undermine the work weve done here. We crushed our covid fight early on. Our economy rebounded. Were one of the top ten rebounding nations in the economy, however, its all at risk and this part of the decision out of the Supreme Court makes it more precarious already situation thats already very dangerous. What recourse do you have . I know that can you they didnt really cite any michigan law. They didnt cite any law on deciding why you suddenly didnt have this power, is this something that you want to send to the u. S. Supreme court, or are you just going to try to work around it using other legal channels . Well, im going to continue doing my job. So ive got other powers that we are using. We have epidemic powers that my director of the of the health and Human Services have. We still have a statewide mask mandate. We still have restrictions on gatherings. We still have the ability to create Workplace Safety for our workers. So there are a lot of things that were still 0 going to continue to do. Im not going to get distracted by a text from the white house or state Supreme Court that is undermining my work. Im going to keep Going Forward and keep doing everything i can to protect my people. How are you going to account for lockdown fatigue, mitigation fatigue . That is real. We know this is real. In your efforts this time to convince your constituents to abide by the rules . Last week the president talked about lockdowns. We have not had a stayathome order since late spring. But i know he never lets the facts get in the way of comments hes making. Every time were focused on the fact there are 220,000 americans who died for this virus is good for him. In that sense as he insights additional violence against people who are just trying to save one anothers lives, it does for him. Thats why i dont want to talk about him endangering Public Servants lives. I want to talk about what he hasnt done and thats his job. The trump virus response is the worst in the globe, mine in the world. Its the worst. 8 Million People have been have contracted covid19. 320,000 dead. Weve got people in food pantry lines who never would have imagined that they would be there. A and no light on the horizon because our numbers keep going up. This is a grave, serious moment for all of us. If youre tired of lockdowns or tired of Wearing Masks or you wish you were in church this morning or watching College Football or your person were inperson instruction, its time for change in this country, and thats why weve got to elect joe biden. I want to ask you get you to react to something here from the mayor of sioux fall, south dakota, republican. I spoke with him on friday. Im guessing youre going to empathize with what he has to say. The republican mayor of sioux falls. Take a listen. Trying to enforce any government restrictions now at this point in the game, even if i sfelt that wfelt that was the to do, its a nonstarter in the community. Its dix ffficult for us at the local level, difficult for us as county leaders, local mayors, to politicize how difficult it is, and its making it frustrating. Do you put this all on the press that basically he created this environment and it hamstrung everybody up and down the government infrastructure in this country . I do think the person with the biggest mega phone bears a lot of responsibility here. Its true. This is a Public Health crisis. It should not be part of the moment and yet hes made it that way to deflect from his administrations inability to get their arms around it. People are dyeing. People are out of work. People are looking for help just putting food on the table. And there is no relief in sight. Our numbers keep getting worse. And that is the sad, hard truth of this moment, chuck. We should have acted as though were in a war, but not a war with one another, a war with a virus and this virus doesnt care what side of the aisle you vote on. This virus is still a very real threat to all of us. If we could all muster the american spirit and put our masks on and take care of ourselves and one another, we will all be better off. How confident are you joe biden will carry michigan . I feel good about it but im not leaving anything to chance. Im working incredibly hard to make sure that he does win. Im working hard to make sure that we have the ability to elect our Supreme Court in michigan and so for welch and mccormick, who are on the battle, im working hard to elect emthis. This is a moment where we as americans have to elect leaders that are going to look out for our health, going to look out for our economy, get us back to work and make america a leader in the fight against covid, not a laggard. And, finally, last night at the top of our show we made reference, and you became a target of the president personally, a lock her up chant targeting you started and seemed to be almost encouraged at times by the president there. Youve already come under threat once. What does Something Like this do to you personally . Im just i know how youre acting professionally here. Im wondering how this impacts your family personally. Thats a lot to deal with. You know, its incredibly disturbing that the president of the United States ten days after a plot to kidnap, put me on trial and execute me, ten days after that was uncovered, the president is at it again and inspiring and incentivizing and inciting this kind of domestic terrorism. It is wrong. Its got to end. Its dangerous, not just for me and my family but for Public Servants everywhere who are doing their jobs and trying to protect their fellow americans. People of goodwill on both sides of the aisle need to step up and call this out and bring the heat down. This is the United States of america. We do not tolerate actions like he is giving comfort to and that is why we all have to be in this together. Governor gretchen whitmer, democrat from michigan, i appreciate you coming on and sharing your views. Obviously, we hope you and your family continue to stay safe. Thanks, chuck. Up next President Trump insists were rounding the corner on the coronavirus. You heard hhs secretary alex azar moments ago say were so close. Were going to get there. My name is henry. Working within amazon transportation services, i really saw the challenge of climate change. We want to be sustainable, but when you have a truck covering over 300 miles, or you have flights going hundreds of miles, its a bit more challenging. We are letting the data guide us to the best solution. Its inspiring to try to solve a problem that no one else has solved. Thats super exciting. fisherman vo ce how do i register to vote . Ential election. Its inspiring to try to solve a problem that hmm . Hmm . Hmm . woman on porch vo can we vote by mail here . grandma vo youll be safe, right . daughter vo yes four girls vo the polls voted grandma vo go out and vote its so important man at poll vo woo grandma vo its the most important thing you can do smooth driving pays off with allstate, the safer you drive the more you save you never been in better hands allstate click or call for a quote today do you support herd immunity as a strategy, essentially let people get sick . So the cure cannot be worse than the problem itself. We did the right thing. We were expected to lose 2,200,000 people and maybe more than that. Were at 210,000 people. Welcome back. As my colleague Savannah Guthrie pointed out in thursdays nbc news town hall, what President Trump said there was not true. The 2 million figure was if we did nothing, zilch, zip, which, of course, nobody was proposing at the time. What you did not hear in that answer was a refeudation of herd immunity, letting people get sick to build up resiliency among millions to protect the most vulnerable from the virus. It is a strategy being promoted by Coronavirus White House Task adviser scott atlas. You heard secretary azar say it was not official policy. Joining me, of course, Michael Osterholm the director for infective disease research. Director, youre here to be our reality check. Let me ask you, do you share the optimism secretary azar shared with us this morning . I dont, only in the sense were not really telling the complete story. We do have vaccines and therapeutics coming down the pike, but when you actually look at the time period for that. The next 6 to 12 weeks are going to be the darkest of the entire pandemic. Vaccineless not become available in any meaningful way until early to Third Quarter of next year and even then half the u. S. Population at this point is even skeptical of taking the vaccine. What we have right now is a major problem in messaging. People dont know what to believe. And thats one of our huge challenges Going Forward, weve got to get the message to the public that reflects the science and reflects reality. Do you have any idea whos running the public the federal government Public Health response at this point . Is it do you suspect that dr. Atlas is now the leading scientist in the president s ear and so, therefore, dictating policy like potentially herd immunity . You know, i dont nope if there is a lead. There are a lot of different voices. Its just part of the problem i just mentioned. We dont have a consolidated one voice. And this is not just about the science. Right now what were about to go into, chuck, when i was on this show last on september 13th, we had 33,000 cases reported that day. You may recall i warned that we were going to see a very dark fall. Friday we had 70,000 cases matching the largest number weve seen back during the really serious peak in july. That number was were going to blow right through that and between now and the holidays, were going to see numbers much, much larger than even the 67,000 to 75,000 cases. No one has a good story about what to do there. What i mean by a story, this is more than just science. This is bringing people together to understand why are we doing this . This is an fdr fireside chat approach and were just not doing that. Let me ask you this, if joe biden wins on november 3rd, whats the first thing you would like him to do . First of all, we have to cut through all of this partisan issue around the virus. Im not naive to think thats going to happen overnight. But we have to lay out what are we trying to do . What is our plan . Right now actually, believe it or not, we want to achieve herd immunity but we dont want to get through through disease. We want to get there through a vaccination program. If you already have half the population skeptical of a vaccine, and were going to try to get ourselves through this come spring and early summer, were already going to shoot ourselves in the foot. So we need somebody to start to articulate what is our longterm plan . How are we going to get there . Why are we asking people to sacrifice distancing . Why are we telling people if you really love your family, you wont go home for thanksgiving or christmas, and end up infecting mom or dad or grandpa or grandma. We dont have that storytelling going on. Thats as every bit as important as the science itself. You just referred to something that i was going to ask you more directly, is it pretty clear that nobody should travel for the holidays . And i know nobody were america. Its still free donell of movement but realistically, we ought to plan on not traveling . You know, this is our covid year. Lets accept it. Its not like last year and not hopefully going to be like next year. I have seen far too many situations where family gettogethers, even weddings, funerals, family reunions, birthday party, graduation parties have happened where someone brings the virus into the household unknowingly and then four weeks later, at least one or more of the family members are dead. You know, no one wants to be responsible for that. If you really love the people that you have in your immediate family, et cetera, think through this and actually do them the greatest gift of all, and that is distance yourself this year and dont expose them. Its not ideal, we know that, but were trying to get through to getting vaccines to then make it next year a much, much more likely situation where you can do that safely. On herd immunity, i dont know if you saw over late last week where there was a back and forth with another scientist who was trying to get to dr. Atlas, and apparently atlas is claiming theres a likelihood only as few as 25 of folks need the infection for herd immunity potentially to kick in. Is that even possible without a robust vaccine . You know, first of all, that 20 number is the most amazing combination of pixie dust and pseudoscience i have ever seen. Lets just move on. It is 50 to 70 minimum. Remember, when we talk about getting 50 to 70 protection, were talking you can get there with disease but if that happens, there will be a lot of deaths, a lot of serious illnesses or we can try to get there with vaccination. Postponing the numbers who get sick until we have the Vaccines Available 679 once you get to 50 to 70 , thats kind of like what you hear on the airplane and they announce were about to descend into laguardia. You still have 30 minutes of flight time. 50 to 70 slows down transmission, it doesnt stop it. This virus will keep looking for wood to burn for as long as it can and technically get over 100 over time. Our goal is to get many people protected with vaccine and we have to tell that story. We have to tell how were going to get there. We have to tell people why we can get there. Thats what we need to do right now and were not doing that. Well, dr. Michael osterholm, you are always very clear and straightforward with our viewers, which is why we find you to be as good of an expert we can find these days when the government refuses to provide scientists to these sunday shows. Anyway, michael, thank you. Thank you. Coming up joe bidens Campaign Manager says the race is closer than the polls suggest. People are waking up tog with whats possible with rybelsus®. You are my sunshine, my only sunshine. Rybelsus® works differently than any other diabetes pill to lower blood sugar in all 3 of these ways. Increases insulin. Decreases sugar. And slows food. The majority of people taking rybelsus® lowered their blood sugar and reached an a1c of less than 7. 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The panel is joining us, mark lebowitz, chief National Correspondent for the New York Times magazine, former democratic congresswoman Donna Edwards and former republican of North Carolina pat mcquarrie. I want to start with the reality, i will admit im still a little shaken by Michael Osterholms dark preview of the next 6 to 12 weeks, but some 27 million already voted in this election. By thursdays debate, it is possible a full third of the electorate will have already cast their ballots, which brings us to this, what can change the trajectory of this race when 50 Million People may have already voted by thursday . Well, one thing the Trump Campaign is counting on is on the whole more of those early voters are democrats. Thats something bill steppian admitted on a campaign call, look, democrats do have an advantage in sort of early voting but for the trump people, one thing theyre focused on is they believe their voters are are sorts of voters who will show up on election day at the polls. So for the Trump Campaign at least it means get out the vote efforts do matter. It means persuasion does still have and it means if the president can show even an iota of discipline, changing what he says rallies, perhaps tweeting less, doing what he did the final stretch of 2016 where he did recede a bit from public view and was fairly disciplined, and for the biden side youre seeing him put out memos and talking in Conference Calls as well saying do not let up. Do not take this for granted. National polls do not matter. The popular vote is an intriguing metric but what happens is the electoral college. This election can come down to 30,000 votes again in two or three key states. Mark leibovich, my partner in first grade mark murray emailed me yesterday and he said im having deja vu. Theres the president. Hes trying to get hacked emails covered, dubious russian connections, lock her up chants, but there is a difference. The president s grievances this time are his. Hes not channeling his voter grievances. Four years ago he would say long her up chants or talk about the border or trade, he might talk about other issues other than personal grievances and now theyre all personal. So i dont know if he pivots the way ashley says he could. The notion were still talking about a potential pivot two weeks before the election, this has been, what, four years now almost . I know. I dont think thats going to happen. Hes not pivoting. The strategy has shown at least in the numbers this is not working. I think what youre probably going to see over next couple weeks, yes, the debate, whether it will be divisive or not, i think its probably a bit of a long shot but the driving story over the next couple weeks, no matter what the covid numbers and also the fact that the president is going to be holding these rallies pretty much every night that are the only public gatherings of that size pretty much in the country going on every single day. Were going to watch Football Games today in which there will be empty stadiums all over the country and the only place there will be packed crowds will be these rallies. That will be reinforced every day and pivot isnt coming. I hate to break it to anyone hoping otherwise, but i think the same dynamic will prevail over the next couple weeks. We could have a little fun with the map and pat and sonydo i want you to help me out here. Bill step yen, the president s Campaign Manager, being privately pessimistic, does outline what he believes is the victory for donald trump. In Staff Meetings he says the easy part is winning iowa, georgia, ohio and mainstream congressional districts. Then they need the following scenarios to kick in. Scenario one would be winning arizona, North Carolina, pennsylvania. Scenario two would be winning arizona, North Carolina, michigan. Scenario three would be North Carolina, michigan, nevada. Pat, theres one state thats in all these of their scenarios and that is the state of North Carolina. Where is the president . How hard do you think this will be for the president to carry the state of North Carolina this time . I predict he will carry the state of North Carolina. It will be very, very close, but the dilemma he has is the democrats have so much money on the ground. Both in north and South Carolina. Let me put it this way, on my radio show, i have more democratic ads than republican ads. That means the democrats have a lot of money. But theres one word that the republicans are repeating over and over again and thats amy barrett. She the Supreme Court confirmation hearings we think have brought some momentum to the Trump Campaign and the democrats arent bringing her name up at all on the campaign trail. Donna edwards, theres one state that is not included in any of these scenarios, and it happens to be a state the president campaigned in yesterday, and that is wisconsin. Its interesting to see how pessimistic republicans are about wisconsin, at least the president s Campaign Manager. Are democrats that confident on wisconsin . Its not so much, chuck, as being confident as doing the work on the ground. When you look at the number of voters who have already voted early with wisconsinites becoming accustom to that, the number of firsttime voters showing up at the polls, i think thats been a good sign for democrats, and i was struck yesterday the president was campaigning in janesville, which is a solidly republican area. Used to be represented i think by paul ryan, and i just dont see that as getting in the new voters from madison and the milwaukee suburbs that the president is going to need to win a state like wisconsin. Pat mccrory go ahead. You heard on my show that democrats are doing an incredible, unique political strategy. Theyre trying to endorse the libertarian candidate to take away votes from republicans. So the democratic senator candidate in South Carolina is running ads basically promoting the libertarian candidate against Lindsey Graham. Very unique strategy. Well, when you have that much money, like Jaime Harrison has, you can. Ashley parker, im not going to play it again. We heard the ben sasse comments. Is ben sasse the Senate Republican canary in the coal mine in that he speaks for a lot more that dont speak . Yes and no. I mean, keep in mind hes speaking after he won his primary, after his victory seemed fairly given. So hes not a profile in courage. What he is is perhaps a glimpse of how if trump does lose, some members but not all members, would try to position a Republican Party in a posttrump era. But the thing you have to keep in mind is the president is an outgrowth of a populism that is still very real in the Republican Base and the idea even if he loses, he just disappears, he stops tweeting. He potentially stops holding rallies, thats not going to happen. He may have a grip on the party well after 2020 but you will see some more researchpublicans fee emboldened to state what they stated privately just about since the president took office. Of course, four years ago in this very month we had stories of Senate Republicans looking to put their distance between themselves and nominee donald trump. Who knows . Anyway, let me pause the conversation there. When we come back, joe bidens lead over trump looks a lot like Hillary Clinton did when i was in high school, this was the theater i came to quite often. The support weve had over the last few months has been amazing. Its not just a work environment. Everyone here is family. If you are ready to open your heart and your home, check us out. We thought for sure that we were done. And this town said not today. And other Money Managers dont understand why. Because our way works great for us but not for your clients. Thats why were a fiduciary, obligated to put clients first. So, what do you provide . Cookie cutter portfolios . Nope. We tailor portfolios to our clients needs. But you do sell investments that earn you high commissions, right . We dont have those. 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Tell your doctor about bleeding, new or unexpected shortness of breath, any planned surgery, and all medicines you take. I take nothing for granted. Because im a survivor. Ask your doctor if brilinta is right for you. If you cant afford your medication, astrazeneca may be able to help. Welcome back. Data download time. Nervous democrats, skeptical republicans worrying with two weeks left in this race. Remember where polls put Hillary Clinton. Remember, the National Polls are not always a sign in the electoral outcome. How safe is joe biden in the current doubledigit lead . At this point in october almost to the day Hillary Clinton was up ten points over thencandidate donald trump over registered voters in the wall street journal poll. In the latest out this week, biden is up 11. But joe biden is not Hillary Clinton and incumbent President Trump isnt outside every candidate donald trump. At one point in 2016 one in 65 voters said the country was headed in the wrong direction. Not great for a partys hope of staying in power. Today that number under a republican President Trump isnt great either, 62 . Another thing, voters like biden more than they liked clinton. In our positive negative feeling thermometer we use, she was 10 points underwater in midoctober 2016. In comparison, biden is in positive territory. Actually up a point. But perhaps most important are the types of voters clinton failed to win over who are currently polling more favorably for biden. At this point candidate trump was pulling ahead with independents and seniors and he led white voters by nine points. Now biden has widened margins with the first two camps and narrowed President Trumps hold on white voters to only four points. These gains are especially important to cycle white voters and older white voters could help bidens split states like wisconsin, michigan, pennsylvania and florida. The states that narrowly put President Trump over the top last cycle. So even if 2020 may look and feel a bit like 2016 with the surprise ending possible, these numbers suggest that there are substantial differences this year. Remember, President Trump and joe biden will face off in their second and final debate this thursday, moderated by our own kristen welker. Please join my colleagues and myself for full coverage beginning 8 30 eastern time. When we come back, even though it is not 2016 ready to shine from the inside out . Try natures bounty hair, skin and nails gummies. The number one brand to support beautiful hair, glowing skin, and healthy nails. And try advanced, now with two times more biotin. Say hello to a drugfree way to ease stress. Stress comfort, a gummie supplement with lemon balm plus saffron to naturally boost your mood. Stress comfort from natures bounty stress comfort people have been asking for online classes for the longest i thought,you know what . It was amazing. Business kept growing and growing and growing. Welcome back. The panel is back here. Mark leibovich, weve been talking about all of the ways that maybe this and is the like 2016, all of the ways it appears the president is behind but there is one counterfactual here that i think benefits the president and raises some questions about the biden strategy and that he is these Voter Registration numbers that weve seen come out of, in particular, pennsylvania, florida, North Carolina. Tom edsall wrote about this, one of the fates fewer won by fewer than poiv points in 2016, arizona, North Carolina and pennsylvania in recent months there are more republicans added to the rolls than democrats in reach of them except pennsylvania. If were missing new registrants, thats how those polls could suddenly tighten. Thats an important counterfactual and i think theres a misperception, new voters and people lined up, that just equates to democratic enthusiasm. As tom edsall pointed out, thats wrong. I think the counter counterfactual to that is when you look at the fact in 2016, there were Third Party Candidates on the ballot who were a lot stronger, gary johnson, jill stein. Theyre not on the ballot this time. So it could be well spread and not as decisive in wisconsin and North Carolina this time around. Donna edwards, when i hear from democratic strategists about what keeps them up at night it is this issue on a weak Voter Registration campaign in all of 2020, all understandable reasons with this pandemic, but this is if theres something that theyre going thats keeping them up at night, it is this. Yeah, i think thats true. I think its one of the reasons you see the Biden Campaign also focused on low propensity voters, a lot of voters who actually stayed home in 2016 and try to turn them out in 2020 as a way to balance this. I think its why you see the deployment both of Kamala Harris and joe biden in some of these areas to try to lift that up. Listen, if a third of the ballot votes had been cast by the time you get to election day, that means twothirds still have to be turned out and energized. I think thats why the Biden Campaign is very focused on saying, hey, its not over and just because we do early voting, doesnt mean we dont have to continue until the end. So thats what i see on the democratic side as a way to try to balance what has happened on the republican side in terms of registration. Pat mccrory, what is the president s message . Not what should it be in these closing two weeks, but i mean, here he spent the last two days, he spent part of his week attacking fellow republican senators. Obviously he didnt like what ben sasse said. He went after susan collins, not worth the work because hes upset shes not going to vote for judge barrett before election day. He called him senator little ben sasse. Perhaps the senators will find a new and better and more viable candidate. What the senate is focused on this week is probably not what you want to be focused on but is that the president s problem, we dont foe what his message really is . I think that is an issue. He has not controlled the message and part of that is because of the virus. But there have been september and october surprises also. You had the woodward book which comes out every election time. You had the Melania Trump tapes, which was incredible how someone tape recorded the first lady, and so hes been on his heels on this and many other issues. But now joe biden, whether you like it or not, is going to have to deal with a hunter biden october surprise between now and election day. And so i think Ashley Parker in addition to the virus. Ashley parker, the fact the Trump Campaign wants and hopes that this questionable hack and we dont know, theres a lot of questions surrounding this story, is this their last this is their last card theyre playing . This is all they got left . Yes, potentially, as you said its a rerun in many ways of 2016, gut the landscape is different. The hunter biden stuff, some of it is not verified. Some of it may seem unsavory for hunter. But it doesnt really attach to his father, and some of stuff that has come out in the hack actually makes joe biden seem like what voters already believe, a decent guy. In a text with his son hunter, who struggled with drug addiction, you have joe biden saying good morning, my beautiful son. That is not exactly opposition research, especially for americans who have their own family members struggling with addiction. Thats for sure. Very quickly, Donna Edwards, right at the end of the judge barrett hearings, Dianne Feinstein praised Lindsey Graham for how he ran the hearing, gave him a hug, and lets say that did not sit well with the base of the party, demand justice, a fairly new group on the left promoting judicial promoting sort of more campaigns than these judicial fights, its time for senator feinstein to step down from her leadership position. How bad is this for senator feinstein . Frankly, i dont know its bad for senator feinstein. I think it really democrats need to be focused on the problems with Amy Coney Barretts nomination, the timing, the fact where she is and cant even endorse the idea that contraceptives are within the right to privacy, and what she might do in terms of this election, i think thats a problem. And i think from the biden perspective, you know, really focusing on the destruction of the aca is the focal point. So biden cant get away from the economy to covid to how you recover. Im going to have to end the conversation there. Thank you all. But before we go, i want to note this years meet the press film festival, afi fest, is actually going on now through thursday. Seven programs this time around, air vulture, of course, even of the q a hosted by one of your its great to be back in nevada where there are thousands of loyal, hardworking american patriots early voting is underway so get out and vote folks, as my coh used to say in college, its gae time this is the most important election of our lifetimes. President trump hoping to turn nevada red this election, and joe biden pushing hard with an ad blitz as both candidates wrap up the campaigning with just 15 days to go. The feared fal