Transcripts For KGO The First Presidential Debate -- Your Voice Your Vote 2020 An ABC News... 20240712

Donald trump and joe biden will take the stage for 90 minutes. Six topics on the table. The big question, will the candidates do anything tonight to change the course of this race . President tru behind right now, has been for months. And our statistics guru nate silver at fivethirtyeight calculates that joe biden has a 78 chance of winning the white house. But there are three debates, five weeks to go and President Trump has a history of shaking things up. Our chief White House Correspondent jon karl is on the scene in cleveland. George, donald trump goes into this debate with his back against the wall. By every publicly available measure, he is losing this race. Trailing in the national polls. No consistent lead in any of the top dozen most competitive battleground states. He needs to change the dynamic of this race and tonight is the best chance for him to do it. Hes been here before, four years ago, his campaign was collapsing and he turned it around in part with a debate. And going relentlessly and ruthlessly on the attack. I expect that is what he will try to do tonight. Okay, jon karl. Mary bruce also in clevelanot o but hes had two Vice President ial debates during the general election season. George, this is his 27th debate for the white house. But joe biden has never faced an opponent before like donald trump. He says all he has to do to win here tonight is tell the truth. But it is not going to be that simple. Joe biden knows that donald trump is going to make this personal. He is going to go on the attack. Joe bidens goal and his challenge here tonight is to try to rise above that, to not get dragged into some brawl with the president. Biden will fight back if the president misconstrues his record, if he goes after his family, but dont expect joe biden to spend a lot of time factchecking the president. Instead, he wants to speak directly to the American People. He wants tonight to be about the issues. Hes going to hit the president on taxes, on his Business Record and especially in the midst of this pandemic, on health care, george. And we saw joe biden release his tax returns today, mary. He did, joe biden trying to get ahead, trying to draw a clear contrast. Trying to set the tone for the debate to come. He did release his tax returns today for last year, drawing a sharp contrast with the president and that blockbuster New York Times reporting. Joe biden, we now know last year, paid about 300,000 in federal income taxes. We still dont know what the president paid because he has not released his tax returns yet. It is clickly to be the first question, george. Chris wallace is on the stage right now, outlined six topics for the debate, starting from the trump and biden records, the economy, covid, Supreme Court, race and violence, election integrity. Lets go to Chris Wallace. Good evening from the Health Education campus of Case Western Reserve University and the Cleveland Clinic. Im Chris Wallace of fox news and i welcome you to the first of the 2020 president ial debates between president donald j. Trump and former Vice President joe biden. This debate is sponsored by the commission on president ial debates. The commission has designed the format, six roughly 15minute segments with twominute answers from each candidate to the first question, then open discussion for the rest of each segment. Both campaigns have agreed to these rules. For the record, i decided the topics and the questions in each topic. I can assure you, none of the questions has been shared with the commission or the two candidates. This debate is being conducted under health and safety protocols designed by the Cleveland Clinic, which is serving as the Health Security adviser to the commission for all four debates. As a precaution, both campaigns have agreed the candidates will not shake hands at the beginning of tonights debate. The audience here in the hall has promised to remain silent, no cheers, no boos or other interruptions so we, and more importantly you, can focus on what the candidates have to say. No noise except right now, as we welcome the republican nominee, President Trump and the democratic nominee, Vice President biden. How you doing, man . How are you . Gentlemen, a lot of people have been waiting for this night, so, lets get going. Our first subject is the Supreme Court. Ek succeed the late ruthinateda Bader Ginsburg on the court. You say the constitution is clear about your obligation and the senates to consider a nominee to the court. Vice President Biden, you say that this is an effort by the president and republicans to jam through an appointment in what you call an abuse of power. My first question, to both of you tonight, why are you right in the argument you make and your opponent wrong . And where do you think a Justice Barrett would take the court . President trump, in this first segment, you go first, two minutes. Thank you very much, chris. I will tell you very simply, we won the election. Elections have consequences. We have the senate. We have the white house and we have a phenomenal nominee, respected by all, top, top academic, good in every way. Good in every way. In fact, some of her biggest endorsers are very liberal people, from notre dame and other places, so, i think shes going to be fantastic. We have plenty of time. Even if we did it after the election itself. I have a lot of time after the election, as you know. So, i think that she will be outstanding, shes going to be as good as anybody that has served on that court, we really feel that. We have a professor at notre dame, highly respected by all, said shes the single greatest student hes ever had. Hes been a professor for a long time at a great school and we just we won the election and therefore, weave the right to choose her and very few people knowingly would say otherwise, and by the way, the democrats, they wouldnt even think about not doing it. If they had the only difference is, theyd try to do it faster. Theres no way they would give it up. They had Merrick Garland but the problem is, they didnt have the election, so, they were stopped. And probably that would happen in reverse also. Definitely would happen in reverse. So, we won the election and we have the right to do it, chris. President trump, thank you. Same question to you, Vice President biden, you have two minutes. Well, first of all, thank you for doing this and looking forward to this, mr. President. Thank you, joe. The American People have a right to have a say in who the Supreme Court nominee is. And that say occurs when they vote for a United States senator and when they vote for the president of the United States. Theyre not going to get that chance now because were in the middle of an election already. The election has already started. Tens of thousands of people have already voted. And so the the thiing that shou happen is, we should wait. We should wait and see what the outcome of this election is, because thats the only way the American People get to express their view, is by who they elect as president and who they elect as Vice President. Now, whats at stake here, the president s made it clear he wants to get rid of the aforable care act. Hes been running on that, he ran on that and he has been governing on that. Hes in the Supreme Court right now trying to get rid of the Affordable Care act, which will strip 20 Million People from having insurance, health insurance, now, if they if it goes into court. And the justice and i have nothing im not opposed to the justice, she seems like a very fine person, but shes written before she went on the bench, which is her right, that she thinks that the Affordable Care act is not constitutional. The other thing thats on the court, and if it is struck down, what happens . Womens rights are fundamentally changed. Once again, a woman could be pay more money because she has a preexisting condition of pregnancy. Theyre able to charge a woman more for the same exact procedure a man gets. And that ended when we, in fact, passed the Affordable Care act. And theres 100 Million People who have preexisting conditions. And theyll be taken away, as well. Those preexisting conditions, Insurance Companies are going to love this. And so, its just not appropriate to do this before this election. If he wins the election and the senate is democrat or republican, then he goes forward, if not, we should wait until february. There arent 100 Million People with preexisting conditions. The people already had their say. Okay, Justice Ginsburg said very powerfully, very strongly, at some point, ten years agoor so, said a president and the senate is elected for a period of time. But a president s elected for four years. Were not elected for three years. Im not elected for three years. So, we have the senate hes elected until the next election. During that period of time, we have im not elected for three years. The elections already sta started. The 100 Million People is totally wrong. The bigger problem that you have is that youre going to extinguish 180 Million People with their private health care thats simply not true. This is gentlemen, were now into open discussion. Yes, i agree, go ahead, Vice President. Number one, he knows what i proposed. What i proposed is that we expand obamacare and we increase it. We do not wipe any and one of the big debates we had with 23 of my colleagues trying to win the nomination that i won were saying that biden wanted to allow people to have private insurance still. They can. They do. They will under my proposal. Thats not what youve said and not what your party has said. Your party didnt say that. That is simply a lie. Your party wants to go socialist medicine. The party is me, i am the Democratic Party. I am the Democratic Party right now. The platform of the democratic not according to harris. The Democratic Party is what i approved of. What i approved of. Now heres the deal. The deal is that its going to wipe out preexisting conditions. By the way. 200,000 people that have died on his watch, how many of those that have survived, well, theres 7 Million People that contracted covid. What does it mean for them Going Forward if you strike down the Affordable Care act . Joe, youve had 308,000 military people die because you couldnt provide them Proper Health care in the military. So, dont tell me about this. Im happy to talk about this. If you were here, it would be 2 Million People because you were very late on the draw. Late on the draw. China was heavily infected. You didnt want me to ban gentlemen. Mr. President mr. President. Youre talking about 2 Million People. Youre not going to be able to shut him up. Were going to talk about covid in the next segment, but go ahead. Let me finish. The point is that, the president also is opposed to roe v. Wade. Thats on the ballot, as well, and in the court. So that is also at stake right now. And so, the election is all you dont know whats on the ballot. Why is it on the ballot . Why is it on the ballot . Its not on the ballot. Its on the ballot in the court. In the court. Theres nothing happening there. Donald, would you just be quiet for a minute. You dont know her view. Well, all right. Lets talk we got a lot to unpack here, gentlemen. We got a lot of time. On health care, then well come back to roe v. Wade. All right. Mr. President , the Supreme Court will hear a case a week after the election in which the trump administration, along with 18 state attorneys general are seeking to overturn thats right. Obamacare, to end obamacare. Because they want to give good health care. If i may ask my question, sir. Good health care. Over the last four years, you have promised to repeal and replace obamacare, but you have never in these four years come up with a plan, a comprehensive plan. Yes, i have. To replace obamacare. Of course i have. Well i got rid of the individual mandate. That is not a comprehensive plan. That is absolutely a big thing. That was the worst part i didnt ask, sir. Youre debating him, not me. Well, ill ask joe. The individual mandate was the most unpopular aspect of obamacare mr. President , im the moderator of this debate and i would like you to let me ask my question and then you can answer it. Go ahead. You, in the course of these four years have never come up with a comprehensive plan to replace obamacare and just this last thursday, you signed a largely symbolic executive order to protect people with preexisting conditions five days before this debate. So, my question, sir, is what is the Trump Health Care plan . All right, well, i guess im debating you, not him, but thats okay. Im not surprised. Let me just tell you something. Theres nothing similymbolic. Im cutting drug prices. Im going with favored nations. Drug prices will be coming down 80 , 09 . You could have done it in your 47year period in government, you didnt do it. Nobodys done it. What about preexisting conditions . He has not cut health care. It was destroying people, the cost, im getting it for so cheap, its like water, you want to know the truth. So cheap. Take a look at all the drugs that, what were doing. Prescription drug prices. Were going to allow our governors to go to other countries to buy drugs because they pay just a tiny fraction. This is open discussion. This is big stuff. Sir, youll be happy, im about to pick up one of your points to ask the Vice President , which is, he points out that you would like to add a public option to obamacare. Yes. And the argument that he makes, and other republicans make, is that that is going to end private insurance it is not. If i can your question. Not what your party says, by the way. It will end private insurance. Its only for those people who are so poor they qualify for medicaid. They can get that free in most states except governors who want to deny people who are poor medicaid. Anyone who qualifies for medicare excuse me, medicaid, would automatically be enrolled in the public option. The vast majority of the American People would still not be in that option. Number one. Joe, you agreed with Bernie Sanders on the manifesto and that gives you socialized medicine. Im not going to listen to him. The fact of the matter is, i beat Bernie Sanders. Not by much. I beat him a whole hell of a lot. Im here standing you pocahontas would have left two days earlier, you would have lost every primary on super tuesday. Im going to get very lucky tonight, as well, and tonight im going to with what . Heres the deal. The fact is that everything hes saying so far is simply a lie. Im not here to call out his lies. Everybody knows hes a liar. I just want to make sure i want to make sure graduated last in your class, not first if your class. Mr. President , can you let him finish, sir . He doesnt know how to do that. Youd be surprised. Youd be surprised. The wrong guy, the wrong night at the wrong time. Heres the deal. You agreed with Bernie Sanders. There is no manifesto, number one. Please let him speak you just lost the left. You agreed with Bernie Sanders on a plan folks, do you have any idea what this clown is doing . Do you have any idea. Mr. President. I tell you what. He is not for any help for people needing health care. Who is, bernie . Because he, in fact, has already cost 10 Million People their health care that they had from their employers because of his recession. Number one. Number two, there are 20 Million People Getting Health Care through obamacare now that he wants to take it away. He wont ever look you in the eye and say thats what he wants to do. Take it away. I want to give them Better Health care at a much better price. He doesnt know how to do that. I already fixed it. He has never offered a plan. He has never done a single thing. Gentlemen, you realize if you are both speaking at the same time let the president go ahead, sir. Obamacare is no good. We made it better and i had a choice to make very early on. We took away the individual mandate. We guaranteed preexisting conditions but took away the individual mandate. Not true. Listen, this is the way it is. And that destroyed shthey shouldnt call it obamacare. Do i let me people run it really well or badly . If i run it badly, they will probably blame him, but blame me, but i want to help people. I said, you have to run it so well. Thats what hes known for. They said, the problem is, no matter how well you run obamacare, its a disaster. Its too expensive. I got you. Premiums are too high. Thats what his people said. Chris, we want to get rid of it i have to give you roughly equal time. Please let the Vice President talk. Good. He has no plan for health care. Of course we do. Please. He sends out wishful thinking. He has executive orders that have no power. He hasnt lowered drug costs for anybody. Hes been promising a Health Care Plan since he got elected. He has none. Like almost Everything Else he talks about. He does not have a plan. He doesnt have a plan. And the fact is, this man doesnt know what hes talking about. I have one final question for you. Sure. Mr. Vice president , if Senate Republicans we were talking originally about the Supreme Court here. If Senate Republicans go ahead and confirm Justice Barrett, there has been talk about ending the filibuster or even packing the court, adding to the nine justices there. You call this a distraction by the president , but in fact, it wasnt brought up by the president , it was brought up by some of your democratic colleagues in the congress. So, my question to you is, you have refused in the past to talk about it, are you willing to tell the American People tonight whether or not you will support either ending the filibuster or packing the court . Whatever position i take on that, that will become the issue. The issue is the American People should speak. You should go out and vote. Youre voting now. Vote and let your senators know how strongly you feel. Vote now. Are you going to pack the court . Make sure you, in fact, let people know, your senators. Im not going to answer the question because the question is you would put in radical left. Should you shut up, man . Who is on your list, joe . This is this is so unpresident ial. Not going to give a list. Were going to move onto the second segment. That was really a productive segment, wasnt it . Keep yapping, man. The people understand, joe. They sure do. 47 years, ive done nothing. All right. The second subject is covid19, which is an awfully serious subject, so lets try to be serious about it. We have had more than 7 million cases of coronavirus in the United States and more than 200,000 people have died. Even after we produce a vaccine, experts say that it could be months or even years before we come back to anything approaching normal. My question for both of you is, based on what you have said and done so far and what you have said you would do, starting in 2021, why should the American People trust you more than your opponent to deal with this Public Health crisis Going Forward . In this case, the question goes to you first, sir, two minutes uninterrupted. Good luck. 200,000 dead. As you said, over 7 million infected in the United States. We, in fact, have 5 4 of the worlds population, 20 of the deaths. 40,000 people a day are contracting covid. In addition to that, about between 750 and 1,000 people a day are dying. When he was presented with that number, he said, it is what it is. It is what it is because you are who you are. Thats why it is. The president has no plan. He hasnt laid out anything. He knew all the way back in february how serious this crisis was. He knew it was a deadly disease. What did he do . Hes on tape as acknowledging he knew it. He said he didnt tell us or give people a warning of it because he didnt want to panic the American People. You dont panic. He panicked. In addition to that, what did he do . He went in and he we were insisting the people we had on the ground in china should be able to go to wuhan and determine for themselves how dangerous this was. He did not even ask xi to do that. He told us what a great job xi was doing. He said, we owe him a debt of gratitude for being so transparent with us. And what did he do then . He then did nothing he waited and waited and waited. He still doesnt have a plan. Wrong. Sir, its his two minutes. Its so wrong. I laid out in march what we should be doing. I laid out again in july what we should be doing. We should be providing all the protective gear possible. We should be providing the money the house has passed in order to be able to go out and get people the help they need to keep their businesses open, open schools, it costs a lot of money. You should get out of your bunker and get out of the sand trap and go in the oval office and bring together the democrats and republicans and fund what needs to be done now to save lives. So, if we would have listened to you. You have two minutes sir. If we would have listened to you, the country would have been left wide open, millions of people would have died, not 200,000, and one person is too much, its chinas fault, it should have never happened. They stopped it from going in, but it was chinas fault. And by the way, when you talk about numbers, you dont know how many people died in china. You dont know how many people died in russia. You dont know how many people died in india. They dont exactly give you a straight count. Just so you understand. But if you look at what weve done. I closed it and you said hes senn phobic, hes a racist. Unrelated to your covid. Its his two minutes. You didnt think we should close our country. You wouldnt have closed it for another two months. By my doing it early, dr. Fauci said President Trump saved thousands of lives. Many of your democrat governors said, President Trump did a phenomenal job. We worked with the governors go take a look. The governors said i did a phenomenal job. Most of them said that. In fact, people that would not be necessarily on my side said that. President trump did a phenomenal job. We did. We got the gowns, we got the masks, we made the ventilators. You wouldnt have made ventilators. And now were weeks away from a vaccine. Were doing they arapeutics are already. Fewer people are dying when they get sick. Weve done a great job. The only thing i havent done a good job, and thats because of the fake news. No matter what you say to them, they give you bad press on it. Its fake news. They give you good press, they give me bad press because thats the way it is, unfortunately. But i dont care. Ive gotten used to it. But joe, you could never have done the job that we did. You dont have it in your blood. You could have never done that job. I know how to do the job. I know how to get the job done. Well, you didnt do very well in swine flu. H1 h1n1. 14,000 people died, not 200,000. There was no economic recession. You made a point, let him answer it. We didnt shut down the economy. This is his economy that he shut down. The reason its shut down is because, look, you folks at home, how many of you got up this morning and had an empty chair at the Kitchen Table because someone died of covid . How many of you are in a situation where you lost your mom or dad and you couldnt even speak to them, had a nurse holding a phone up so you can in fact say goodbye. You would have lost far more people. Far more people. You would have been months late. And by the way, his own cdc director says we could lose another 200,000 people between now and the end of the year. And he held up, he said, if we just wear a mask, we can save half those numbers, just a mask. And by the way, in terms of the whole notion of a vaccine, were for a vaccine, but i dont trust him at all, nor do you, i know you dont. What we trust is the scientists. You dont trust johnson johnson, pfizer . Gentlemen, let me move on to questions about the future, because you both have touched on one of the two of the questions im going to ask. Focusing on the future first, President Trump, you have repeatedly either contradicted or been at odds with some of your governments own top scientists. The week before last, the head of the centers for disease control, dr. Redfield said it would be summer before the vaccine would become generally available to the public. You said that he was confused and mistaken. Those were your two words. Yeah. But dr. Slowey, the head of your operation warp speed has said exactly the same thing. Are they both wrong . Well, ive spoken to the companies and we can have it a lot sooner. People like this would rather make it political than save lives. It is a very political thing. Ive spoken to fiz pfizer, to af the people you have to speak to. We have great, moderna, johnson johnson, and others, they can go faster than that by a lot. Become very political, because the left or, i dont know so, you are suggesting that the head of your operation warp speed i disagree with both of them. And he didnt say that. He said it could be there, but it could also be much sooner. I had him in my office they talked about the summer, sir, before its generally available. Its a possibility that well have the answer before november 1st. It could also be im talking about when its generally available. Were going to deliver it it right away. We have the military set up. Logistically, theyre all set up. We have the military that delivers soldiers and they can do 200,000 a day. Theyre going to be delivering this is the same man that told you by easter this would be gone away. By the warm weather, it would be gone, mir laaculousmiraculous, miracle. Injects of bleach in your arm that was said sarcastically and you know it. Heres the deal. This man is talking about a vaccine. Every Serious Company is talking about maybe having a vaccine done by the end of the year. But the distribution of that vaccine will not occur until the beginning of middle of next year to get it out, if we get the vaccine. And pray god we will. Pray god we will. Mr. Vice president youll have the vaccine sooner than that. You say the public can trust the scientists, but they cant trust President Trump, in fact, you said that again tonight. Your running mate, senator harris goes further, saying the Public Health experts, quote, will be muzzled, will be suppresse suppressed. Given the fact that polls already show that people are concerned about the vaccine and are reluctant to take it, are you and your running mate, senator harris, contributing to that fear . No more than the question you just asked. You pointed it out. He puts pressure and disagrees with his own scientists. Youre saying senator harris is saying you cant trust the scientists. No, you can trust the scientists. She said the Public Health experts, quote, will be muzzled, will be suppressed. Well, thats what hes going to try to do. But theres millions of thousands of scientists out there like here at this great hospital that dont work for him. Their job doesnt depend on him. Thats not theyre the people and by the way i spoke to the scientists that are in charge. They will have the vaccine very soon. Let him finish. You believe for a moment what hes telling you, in light of all the lies hes told you about the whole issue relating to covid . He still hasnt even acknowledged that he knew this was happening, knew how dangerous it was going to be back in february and he didnt even tell you. Hes on record as saying it. He panicked or he just looked at the stock market. One of the two. Because guess what . A lot of people died. And a lot more are going to die unless he gets a lot smarter, a lot quicker. Mr. President . Did you use the word smart . So, you said you went to delaware state but you forgot the name of your college. You graduated either the lowest or almost the lowest in your class. Dont ever use the word smart with me. Dont ever use that word. Oh, give me a break. Because you know what . Theres nothing smart about you, joe. 47 years, youve done nothing. Lets have this debate. Let me tell you something, joe. If you would have had the charge of what i was put through, i had to close the greatest economy in the history of our country, and by the way, now its being built again. Were going to get to the economy in the next segment, sir. Its going up fast. Okay. When it comes to how the virus has been handled so far, the two of you have taken very different approaches and this is going to affect how the virus is handled Going Forward by whichever of you ends up becoming the next president. I want to quickly go through several of those. Reopenings. Vice President Biden, you have been much more reluctant than President Trump about reopening the economy and schools. Why, sir . Because he doesnt have a plan. If i were running it, i would know what the plan is. You have to provide the businesses the ability to have the money to be able to reopen with the ppe, as well as with the sanitation they need. Tell that to nancy pelosi. Will he just shush for a minute . Tell it to schumer, crying chuck. Nancy pelosi and schumer, they have a plan. They wont even meet with them. The republicans wont meet in the senate. And he sits on his golf course. I mean, literally think about it. You probably play more than i do, joe. What about this question of reopenings . Well, he wants to shut down this country. And i want to keep it open. And we he just admitted he shut it down. Joe, let me shut you down, just for one second. We want to he wants to shut down the country. We just went through it. We had to, because we didnt know anything about the disease. Now we found that elderly people with heart problems and diabetes and different problems are very, very vulnerable. We learned a lot. Young children arent. Even younger people arent. Weve learned a lot. But he wants to shut it down. More people will be hurt by continuing. If you look at pennsylvania, certain states that have been shut down, they have democrat governors all. One of the reasons theyre shut down is because they want to keep it shut down until after the election november 3rd. I want to move onto another subject. I have to respond to that. But those states gentlemen, i want to move onto another subject. Those states i have to respond to that. Mr. President , you have begun to increasingly question the effectiveness of masks as a disease preventer and, in fact, recently you have cited the issue of waiters touching their masks and touching plates. Are you questioning the efficacy of masks . I have a mask right here. Ill put a mask on when i think i need it. Tonight as an example, everybodys had a test and youve had social distancing and all of the things that you have to. Just like your rallies. When needed, i wear masks. I dont wear masks like him, every time hes got a mask. He could be speaking 200 feet away and he shows up with the biggest mask ive ever seen. Vice President Biden, go ahead, sir. Look, the way to open businesses is give them the ability to open. We provided im asking sir, about masks. Well, masks make a big difference. His own head of the cdc if we just wear a mask, everybody wore a mask and social distanced between now and january we could save up to 100,000 lives. It matters. And theyve also said the opposite. Theyve also said no serious person said the opposite. No serious person dr. Fauci said the opposite. He did not say the opposite. We have a minute left in this segment. He said masks are not good. He changed his mind. Im okay with masks. I want to ask you about one last subject because your different approaches have effected the way you have campaigned. President trump, you are holding large rallies with crowds packed together, thousands of people. Outside. Outside, yes, sir. Agreed. Vice President Biden, you are holding much smaller events with because nobody will show up. People with its true. Nobody shows up to his rallies. In any case, why you holding the big rallies, why you not . You go first, sir. Because people want to hear what i have to say. Are you not afraid about spreading the disease . I have 25,000, 35,000 people show up at airports. We use airports. Are you not worried about the disease issue, sir . Well, so far, we have had no problem whatsoever. Its outside, thats a big difference, according to the experts. We do them outside, we have tremendous crowds, as you see, i mean, every and literally on 24 hours notice. And joe does the circles and has three people some place. By the way, did you see one of the last big rallies he had and a reporter came up to him to ask him a question, he said, no, no, stand back, put on a mask, have you been tested . Im way far away from those other people. Thats what he said. Im going to be okay. Hes not worried about you. Hes not worried about the people out there breathing on people. Weve had no negative effect. And weve had 35,000, 40,000 people at these rallies. Just finish up. I want to move onto our next topic. Hes been totally irresponsible, the way in which he has handled the social distancing and people wearing masks, basically encouraging them not to. Hes a fool on this. If you could get the crowds, you would have done the same thing. But you cant. Nobody cares. Gentlemen, can we move onto the economy . Yes. The economy is, i think its fair to say, recovering faster than expected from the shutdo shutdown much faster. In the second quarter. The Unemployment Rate fell to 8. 4 last month. The Federal Reserve says the hit to growth, which is going to be there, is not going to be nearly as big as they had expected. President trump, you say we are in a vshaped recovery. Vice President Biden, you say its more of a kshape. What difference does that mean to the American People in terms of the economy . President trump, in this segment, you go first. So, we built the greatest economy in history. We closed it down because of the china plague, when the plague came in, we closed it down, which was very hard, psychologically, to do. He didnt think we should close it down and he was wrong. Again, 2 Million People would be dead now instead of, still, 204,000 people is too much, one person is too much. Should have never happened from china. But what happened is, we closed it down and now were reopening. And were doing record business. We had 10. 4 Million People in a fourmonth period that weve put back into the work force. Thats a record the likes of nobodys ever seen before. And he wants to close down the he will shut it down again. He will destroy this country. You know, a lot of people between drugs and alcohol and depression, when you start shutting it down, you take a look at whats happening at some of your democratrun states where they have these tough shutdowns and im telling you, its because they dont want to open it. One of them came out last week, you saw that, were going to open up on november 9th. Why november 9th . Because its after the election. They think theyre hurting us by keeping them closed. Theyre hurting people. People know what to do. They can social distance, they can wash the hands, they can wear a mask. They can do whatever they want. But they got to open these states up. When you look at north carolina, when you look and these governors are under siege. Pennsylvania, michigan and a couple of others, you got to open these states up. Its not fair. Youre talking about almost like being in prison. And you look at whats going on with divorce. Look at whats going on with alcoholism and drugs, its a very, very sad thing and hell close down the whole country. This guy will close down the whole country and destroy our country. Our country is coming back incredibly well. Setting records as it does. We dont need somebody to come in and say, lets shut it down. All right. Your two minutes sir. We have now moved to you. As i said, posing the question, the president says its a vshape recovery, you say its a kshaped recovery. Whats the difference . The difference is, millionaires and billionaires like him in the middle of the covid crisis have done very well. Billionaires have made another 300 billion because of his tax proposal and he only focused on the market. But you folks at home, you folks living in scranton and all the small towns and working class towns in america, how are you doing . This guy paid a total of 750 in taxes. Sir, its youve agreed to the two minutes, let me have it. Do i get my time back . The fact is, he has, in fact, worked on this in a way hes going to be the first president of the United States to leave office having fewer jobs in his administration than when he became president. Fewer jobs than when he became president. First one in american history. Secondly, the people who have lost their jobs are those people who have been on the front lines. Those people who have been saving our lives, those people who have been out there dying. People who have been putting themselves in the way to make sure that we could all try to make it. And the idea that he is insisting that we go forward and open when you have almost half the states in america with a significant increase in covid deaths and covid cases in the United States of america. And he wants to open it up more. Why does he want to open it up . Why doesnt he take care of the American People . You cant fix the economy until you fix the covid crisis. And he has no intention of doing anything about making it better for you all at home in terms of your health and your safety. Schools, why arent schools open . Because it costs a lot of money to open them safely. You know, they were going to give, his administration was going to give the teachers and School Students masks. Then they decided, no, couldnt do that because its not a national emergency. Not a national emergency. Theyve done nothing to help small businesses. Nothing. Theyre closing. 1 in 6 is now gone. He ought to get on the job and take care of the needs of the American People so we can open safely. All right. Your time is up, sir. Were going to get i have to respond to that. Well, you both had two minutes sir. Excuse me. He made a statement. So did you. People want their schools no, people want their schools open. They dont want to be shut down. They dont want their states shut down. I look at new york. Its so sad whats happening in new york. Its almost like a ghost town and im not sure it can ever recover what theyve done in new york. People want their places open. They want to get back to their lives. People want to be safe. Theyre careful, but they want okay. Brought back big ten football. It was me and im very happy to do it. And all right. The people of ohio are very proud of me and were going to get gentlemen, were going to get to your economic plans Going Forward in a moment, but first, mr. President , as you well know, theres a new report that in 2016, the year you were elected president and 2017, your first year as president that you paid 750 a year in federal income tax, each of those years. I know that you pay a lot of other taxes, but im asking you the specific question, is it true that you paid 750 in federal income taxes each of those two years . I paid millions of dollars in taxes. Millions of dollars of income tax and let me just tell you, there was a story in one of the papers show us your tax returns. I paid 38 million one year. I paid 27 million. Show us your tax returns. Youll see it as soon as its finished. Youll see it. You know, if you wanted to, go to the board of elections. Theres 118 page or so report that says everything i have, every bank i have, im totally underleveraged because the assets are extremely good and we have a very i built a great sir, im asking you a specific question i understand all that. Release your tax returns. Mr. President , im asking you a question. Will you tell us how much you paid in federal income taxes in 2016 and 2017 . Millions of dollars. You paid millions of dollars . So, not 750. Mallmillions of dollars. When . Chris, let me just tell you something. It was the tax laws i dont want to pay tax. Before i came here, i was a private developer. I was a private business people. Business people go through the laws and thats what it is. He passed a tax bill that gave us all these privileges for depreciation and for tax credits. We built a building, we get tax credits like the hotel on pennsylvania avenue, which, by the way, was given to me by the obama administration, if you can believe that. Now, the man got fired right after that happened, but Vice President biden, you want to respond . Yeah, i do want to respond. Look, the tax code that made him put him in a position that he pays less tax than a School Teacher, on the money a School Teacher makes is because of him he says hes smart because he can take advantage of the tax code and he does take advantage of the tax code. Thats why im going to eliminate the trump tax cuts, im going to eliminate those tax cuts and make sure that we invest in the people who, in fact, need the help. People out there need help. Why didnt you do it in the last 25 years . Because you werent president screwing things up. Youre the worst president americas ever had. Joe, let me just tell you, joe, ive done more in 47 months, ive done more than youve done in 47 years, joe. Weve done things that you never even thought of doing, including fixing the broken military that you gave me, including taking care of the vets. Mr. President , were talking about the economy. Id like to ask you about your plans Going Forward, because mr. Vice president , your economic plan, if you were to be elected president , focuses a lot on big government, big taxes, big spending. I want to focus first on the taxes. You propose more than 4 trillion over a decade in new taxes on individuals making more than 400,000 a year and on corporations. President trump says that that kind of an increase in t going to hurt the economy as it is just coming out of a recession. Well, just take a look at what the analysis done by wall street firms. Points out that my economic plan would create 7 million more jobs than his in four years, number one. And number two, it would create an additional 1 trillion in economic growth, because it would be about buying american. That we have to were going to make the federal government spends 600 billion a year on everything from ships to steel to buildings and the like and under my proposal, were going to make sure that every penny of that has to be made by a company in america. Im talking about taxes, not spending. Well, by the way, im going to eliminate significant number of the tax. Im going to make the Corporate Tax 28 , it shouldnt be 21 . You have 91 companies, fortune 500, who dont pay a single penny in tax why didnt you do it before when you within Vice President with obama . Because you, in fact, passed that. That was your tax proposal. I got it done. And our economy boomed like its never boomed before. Mr. President , let me pick up on that. You would continue your free market approach, lower taxes, more deregulation, correct . Not lower taxes to the American People. Excuse me. But you talk about the economy booming, it turns out that in obamas final three years as president , more jobs were created, a million and a half more jobs, than in the first three years of your presidency. They had the slowest recovery since 1929. It was the slowest recovery. Also, they took over something that was down here, all you had to do was turn on the lights and you pick up a lot. But they had the slowest economic recovery since 1929. Let me tell you about the stock market. When the stock market goes up, that means jobs. It also means 401 k s. If you got in, if you became president with your ideas, you want to terminate my taxes, ill tell you what. Youll lose half of the companies that have poured in here will leave and plenty half of the companies they will leave and you will have a depression the likes of which youve never seen. Look. Mr. Vice president. We inherited the worst recession short of a depression in american history. I was asked to bring it back. We were able to have an economic recovery that created the jobs youre talking about. We handed him a booming economy. He blew it. It wasnt booming. It wasnt booming. Me blhe blew it. Sir, is it fair to say he blew it when, in fact, it was record low unemployment before covid. Yeah, because what he did, even before covid, manufacturing went in the hole. Manufacturing went in the hole. Excuse me, chris, wait. Number two. Number three no, you were on number two. Chris, chris, they said this guy. They said it would take a miracle to bring back manufacturing. I brought back 700,000 jobs. They gave up on manufacturing. We did not. Standard fare. Im the guy that brought back the automobile industry. Let him. I was asked to bring back chrysler and general motors, right here in ohio and michigan. Theyre gone. He blew it. Ohio had the best year its ever had last year. Michigan had the best year theyve that is not true. Many Car Companies came in from germany, japan, went to michigan, went to ohio. Mr. Vth, goice president , go. You look at what hes done. Hes done very little. The trade deals are the same way. He talks about these graeat trae dials. Chinas made, perfected the art of the steal. We have a higher deficit with china now than we did before. We have the highest trade deficit with mexico. China it a yoate your lunch. No wonder. Your son goes in and takes out billions of dollars, takes out billions of dollars to manage, he makes millions of dollars and also simply not true. Why is it, just out of curiosity, the mayor of moscows wife gave your son 3. 5 million. That is not true. What did he do to deserve it . What did he do none of that is true. Let me answer it. None of that is true. Oh, really . Mr. President. Mr. President , please. Totally discredited. And by the way wait, he didnt get 3. 5 million . Mr. President. He didnt. Its an open discussion. Please. Its a fact. Well, you have raised an issue, let the Vice President answer. Its been totally discredited. Did burisma pay him my son did nothing wrong mr. President. Let him answer. He doesnt want to let me answer because he knows i have the truth. His position has been totally thoroughly discredited and you by the media. By the media, by our allies, by the world bank. By everyone. As a matter of fact mr. President. Please stop. People who testified under oath. Let me ask you this, joe. Im listening to you. Got 3. 5 million from moscow. He testified under oath in his administration said, i did my job and i did it very well. I did it honorably. I dont know who they are. Ill fire them. Two ahead, sir. Youve already fired most of them because they did a good job. Some people dont do a good job. With you wait a minute. You get the final word. Well, its hard to get in any word with this clown. This person. 3. 5 million, joe. Why did he deserve 3. 5 million from moscow . Heres the deal. We want to talk about families and ethics, i dont want to do that. I mean, his family, we could talk about all night. His family my family lost a fortune by coming down and helping us with government. Go ahead, sir. Mr. President. This is not about mr. President. Its not about my family, its about your family. The American People. It doesnt want to talk about what you need. You, the American People. Its about you. Thats what were talking about here. All right, thats the end of the segment. Were moving on. He didnt take it. Can i be honest, its a very important question. Try to be honest. It would be a good thing. The answer to the question is no. Sir. Sir. That is absolutely not true. Stop. You are going to have gentlemen. I hate to raise my voice. I said id be different than the two of you. Thats a good point. Heres the deal. We have six segments. We have ended that segment. Were going to go to the next segment. In that segment. You each are going to have two uninterrupted moments. In those two minutes, mr. President , you can say anything you want. Ive going to ask a question about race, but if you want to answer about something else, go ahead. But i think that the country would be better served if we allowed both people to speak with fewer interruptions. Im appealing to you, sir, to do that. And him, too. Well, frankly, youve been doing more interrupted. Thats all right, but he was plenty. Less than you. Less than you have. Please continue on. The issue of race. Vice President Biden, you say that President Trumps response to the violence in charlottesville three years ago when he talked about very fine people on both sides was what directly lead you to launch this run for president. Oh, yeah, sure. President trump, you have often said that you believe you have done more for black americans than any president with the possible exception of abraham lincoln. My question for the two of you is why should voters trust you rather than your opponent to deal with the race issues facing this country over the next four years . Vice President Biden, you go first. Its about equity and equality. Its about decency. Its about the constitution. And we have never walked away from trying to require equity for everyone, equality for the whole of america. But weve never accomplished it. But weve never walked away from it like he has done. It is true, the reason i got in the race, close your eyes, remember those people coming out of the fields carrying torches, their veins bulging, just spewing antisemitic bile and accompanied by the ku klux klan. A young woman got killed. The president said there were very fine people on both sides. No president s ever said anything like that. It is his two minutes, sir. Second point id make to you is that when floyd was killed, mr. Floyd was killed, there was a peaceful protest in front of the white house. What did he do . He came out of his bunker, had the military use tear gas on them so he would walk across to a church and hold up a bible. And then what happened after that . The bishop of that very church said that it was a disgrace. The general who was with him said he all he ever wants to do is divide people, not unite people at all. This is a president who has used everything as a dog whistle to try to generate racist hay thre hatred. You talk about helping africanamericans, 1 in 1,000 africanamericans has been killed because of the coronavirus. And if he doesnt do something quickly, by the end of the year, 1 in 500 will have been killed. One in 1 in 500 africanamericans. This man is the savior of africanamericans . This man cares at all . This mans done virtually nothing. Look, the fact is that you have to look at what he talks about. You have to look at what he did and what he did has been disastrous for the africanamerican community. President trump, you have two minutes. Why should Americans Trust you racism . He did a crime bill, 1994, where you call them super predators, africanamericans. Super predators. And theyve never forgotten it. Theyve never forgotten it. Its his two minutes. And they did that and they call you super predator and im letting people out of jail now that you have treated the africanamerican population, community, you have treated the black community about as bad as anybody in this country. You did the and thats why when you look at the polls, im doing better than any republican has done in a long time because they saw what you did. You called them super predators and youve called them wars than that. You look back at your testimony, youve called them a lot worse than that. As far as the church is concerned and the generals are concerned, we just got the support of 250 military leaders and generals, total support. Law enforcement, almost every Law Enforcement group in the United States. I have florida, i have texas, i have ohio, i have every excuse me, portland, the sheriff just came out today and he said, i support President Trump. I dont think you have any Law Enforcement. You cant even say the word Law Enforcement. If you say those words, youre going to lose all of your radical left supporters. And why arent you saying those words . Because, you know what, if they called us in portland, we would put out that fire in a half an hour, but they wont do it, because theyre run by radical left democrats. If you look at chicago, if you look at any place you want to look, seattle, they heard we were coming in the following day and they put up their hands and we got backseatle. Minneapolis, we got it back, joe, because we believe in law and order, but you dont. Is t the top ten cities and just about the top 40 cities are run by democrats, in many wcases, radical left and theyve got you wrapped around their finger, joe, to a point you dont want to say anything about law and order. And i tell you what, the people of this country want and the demand law and order. And you are afraid to even say it. All right. Im going to return to the question of race. Vice President Biden, after the grand jury in the Breonna Taylor case decided not to charge any of the police with homicide, you said it raises the question, quote, whether justice could be equally applied in america. Do you believe that there is a separate but unequal system of justice for blacks in this country . Yes, there is. Theres systemic injustice in this country. In education, in work and in Law Enforcement in the way which it is enforced. But look, the vast majority of Police Officers are good, decent, honorable men and women. They risk their lives every day to take care of us. But there are some bad apples. And when they occur, when they find them, they have to be sorted out. They have to be held accountable. They have to be held accountable. And what im going to do as president of the United States is call together an entire group of people at the white house, everything from the civil Rights Groups to the Police Officers to the Police Chiefs and were going to work this out. Were going to work this out. So we change the way in which we have more transparency when these things happen. These cops arent happy to see what happens to george floyd. These cops arent happy to see what happened to Breonna Taylor. Most dont like it. But we have to have a system where people are held accountable. And by the way, violence and response is never appropriate. Never appropriate. Peaceful protest is. Violence is never appropriate. What is peaceful protest . When they run through the middle of the town and burn down your stores and kill people all over the place . President trump that is not peaceful protest. But you say it is. I did not. President trump, i would like to continue with the issue of race. I promise were going to get to law and order in a moment. This month, your administration directed federal agencies to end Racial Sensitivity Training that addresses White Privilege or critical race theory. Why did you decide to do that, to end Racial Sensitivity Training and do you believe that there is systemic racism in this country, sir . I ended it because its racist. I ended it because a lot of people were complaining that they were asked to do things that were absolutely insane. That it was a radical revolution that was taking place in our military, in our schools, all over the place and you know it and so does everybody else. What is radical about Racial Sensitivity Training . If you were a certain person, you had no status in life, it was sort of a reversal. And if you look at the people, we were paying people hundreds of thousands of dollars to teach very bad ideas and frankly, very sick ideas. And really, they were teaching people to hate our country. And im not going to do that. Im not going to allow that to happen. We have to go back to the core values of that our country is a horrible place, its a racist place and they were teaching people to hate our country. And im not going to allow that to happen. Vice President Biden . Nobodys doing that. Hes just hes the racist. Heres the deal. I know a lot more about this let me finish. The fact is that there is racial insensitivity. People have to be made aware of what other people feel like. What insults them. What is demeaning to them. Its important to important. They dont want to many people dont want to hurt other pefegs it makes a guy dwan tick difference in the way a child is able to grow up and have a sense of selfesteem. Its a little bit like how this guy and his friends look down on so many people. They look down their nose on people like Irish Catholics like me that grow up in scranton, they look down on people that dont have money. They look down on people who dont are of a different faith. They look down on people who are a different color. In fact, were all americans. The only way were going to bring this country together is bring everybody together. Theres nothing we cannot do if we do it together. We can take this on and we can defeat racism in this President Trump, sir . During the obama biden administration, there was tremendous division. There was hatred. You look at ferguson, you look at you go to many places. Look at oakland, look what happened in oakland, in baltimore. Look what happened frankly, it was more violent than what im seeing now. Oh, my lord. This is ridiculous. Absolutely ridiculouridiculous. The democrats dont want to talk, like you, about are you in favor of law and order. You asked a question, let him finish. Let him answer. Law and order with justice where people get treated fairly. And the farther ct of the matte violence crime went down 15 . Its up on our watch. Mr. President mr. President. Every record in the book. Mr. President , were now going to talk about law and order. Democratic run cities thats my question. There has been a dramatic increase in homicides in america this summer, particularly and you often blame that on democratic mayors and dumbic governors, but in fact, there have been equivalent spikes in republicanled cities like tulsa and ft. Worth. So, the question is, is this really a party issue . I think its a party issue. You can bring in a couple of examples, but if you look at chicago, whats going on in chicago, where 53 people before shot and eight died. Shot. If you look at new york, where its going up like nobodys ever seen anything, the numbers are going up 100, 150, 200 republican cities. He doesnt want to say law and order because he cant, because hell lose his radical left supporters. If he ever got to run this country and they ran it the way he would want to run it, we would have our suburbs would be gone our suburbs would be gone and you would see problems he wouldnt know a suburb unless he took a wrong turn. Wait a minute. I was raised in the suburbs. This is not 1950. All these dog whistles on racism dont work anybody. Suburbs are by and large integrated. People driving their kids to soccer practice, black and white and hispanic in the same car as there have been any time in the past what real past. What really is a threat to the suburbs and his safety, his failure to deal with covid. His failure to deal with the environment. Theyre being blooded, theyre being burned out because his refusal to do anything. Thats why the suburbs are in trouble. I want to talk about this issue of law and order, though, and in the joint recommendation that came from the biden Bernie Sanders task force, you talked about, quote, reimagining policing. First of all, what is reimagining policing mean and do you support it means. If i might finish the question. Do you support the black lives matter call for Community Control of policing . Look. What i support is the police having the opportunity to deal with the problems they face. And im totally opposed to defunding the Police Officers. As a matter of fact, local police. The only one defunding in his budget calls for a 400 million cut in local Law Enforcement assistance. They need more assistance. They need, when they show up for a 911 call to have a psychologist to keep them from vio u force and pedo. Weavo havemuni re, er officers get to know the people in the communities. Thats when crime went down. It didnt go up, it went down. And so, we have to be thats not what theyre talking about. Hes talking about defunding the police. Thats not true. He has no Law Enforcement support. Thats not true. Almost nothing. Who do you have . Name one group that supports you. Name one group that came out and supported you. Go ahead. Thank you, we have time. We dont have time to do anything folks name one Law Enforcement group that came out gentlemen, im going to take back the moderators role and i want to get to another subject, which is the issue of protests. In many cities, they have turned violent. In portland, oregon, especially, we had more than 100 Straight Days of protests, which i think you would agree, you talk about peaceful protest, many of those turned into riots. Mr. Vice president , you say that people who commit crimes should be held accountable. The question i have, though, is, as the democratic nominee and earlier tonight, you said that you are the dommic pa idemocrat right now, have you ever called the democratic mayor of portland or the democratic governor of oregon and said, hey, you got to stop this, bring in the National Guard, do whatever it takes, but stop the days and months of violence in portland . I dont hold Public Office now. I am a former Vice President. Ive made it clear, ive made it clear in my public statements that the violence should be prosecuted. It should be prosecuted. Anyone who xhiflts scommits you never called for the leaders in portland and in oregon to bring in the National Guard and knock off 100 days of riots. They can, in fact, take care of it, if he would just stay out of the way. Oh, really . Oh really . I sent in sir, i asked him a question. Kill the young man in the middle of the street, they shot him. President trump President Trump they sent in the u. S. Marshals they took care of business. By the way, you know, his own former spokesperson said, you know, riots and chaos and violence help his cause. Thats what this is all about. I dont know who said that. I do. Who. I think kellyanne conway. I dont think she said that. All right, heres the point. The point is that he wants to rile everything up. He doesnt want to calm things down. Instead of talking to people, lets get everybody together, figure out how to deal with this, he just pours gasoline on the fire. Constantly. Every single solitary time. And to end this, button up this segment, im going to give you a minute to answer, sir. You have criticized i have to answer his statement. You have repeatedly wait one second. No, youve been talking back and forth. Im asking you i would love to end it. If you want to switch seats, we can do that we send in the National Guard, it would be over. Okay. But they dont want to accept the National Guard. You have repeatedly criticized the Vice President cit antifa and other left wing extremist groups but are you willing tonight to condemn White Supremacists and militia groups and to say that they need to stand down and not add to the violence at a number of these cities as we saw in kenosha and as weve seen in portland. Are you prepared do it. Go ahead, sir. I would say almost everything i see is from the left wing. Not from the right wing. So what are you saying . Im willing to do anything i want to see peace. Then do it, sir. Say it, do it, say it. Do you want to call him what do you want to call them. White supremacists. The proud boys. Proud boys, stand back and stand by, but ill tell you what, ill tell you what, out anta and theo do sng his fbiheight wing left go ahead, sir. Ante that is an idea, not an organization. Not thats what his fbi his fbi director said. Gentlemen no, were done, sir. Were moving onto the next thante that is not an idea. Its bad. Everybody who tells you the truth has a bad idea. You have no idea. Antifa is a dangerous, radical group. Gentlemen, were moving onto the trump and biden repocords. Im going to ask a question. When the president seeks a second term, it is generally a referendum on his record. But Vice President biden, you like to quote one of your dads sayings, which is, dont compare me to the almighty, compare me to the alternative. And in this case, sir, you are the alternative. Looking at both of your records, im going to ask each of you, why should voters elect you president over your opponent . President trump, you go first. Two minutes. Because there has never been an administration or president who has done more than ive done in a period of 3 1 2 years. And thats despite the impeachment hoax and you saw what happened today with Hillary Clinton where it was a whole big con job. But despite going through all of these things, where i had to fight both flanks and behind me and above, there have never been an administration thats done what ive done. The greatest, before covid came in, the greatest economy in history. Lowest unemployment numbers. Everything was good. Everything was going and by the way, there was unity going to happen. People were calling me for the first time in years, they were calling and they were saying, its time, maybe, and then what happened . We got hit, but now were building it back up again. Rebuilding of the military, including space force and all of the other things. A fixing of the v. A. , which was a mess under him. 308,000 people died because they didnt have Proper Health care. And we now have a 91 Approval Rating at the v. A. We take care of our vets. We rebuilt our military. The job weve done, and some people say maybe the most important, by the end of the first term, ill have approximately 300 federal judges and court of appeals judges. 300. And hopefully three great Supreme Court judges, justices. That is a record the likes of which very few people and you know one of the reasons ill have so many judges . Because president obama and him left me 128 judges to fill. When you leave office, you dont leave any judges, thats like, you just dont do that. They left 128 openings and if i were a member of his party, because they have a little different philosophy, id say, if you left us 128 openings, you cant be a good president , you cant be a good Vice President. But i want to thank you, because it gives us almost it will probably be above that number, by the end of this term, 300 judges, its a record. Looking at both of your records, why should voters elect you president as opposed to President Trump . You have two minutes uninterrupted. Under this president , weve been weaker, sicker, poorer, more divided and more violent. When i was Vice President , we inherited a recession, i was asked to fix it, i did. We left him a booming economy and he caused a recession. With regard to being weaker, the fact is that ive gone headtohead with putin and made it clear were not going to take any of his stuff. He still refuses to say anything to putin about the bounty on the heads of american soldiers. Your son no, no. Mr. President by the way, my son mr. President , your campaign agreed to both sides would get twominute answers uninterrupted. Your side agreed to it. Why dont you observe what your campaign agreed to as a ground rule, okay, sir . He never keeps his word. Im not that wasnt a rhetorical question. Can you add back 30 seconds . Yes. So, thirdly, were poorer. The billionaires have gotten much more wealthy, by a tune of over 300 to 400 blion more just since covid. You at home, you got less. Youre in more trouble than you were before. In terms of being more violent, when we were in office, there were 15 less violence in america than there is today. Hes president of the United States. Its on his watch. And with regard to more divided, the nation cant stay divided. We cant be this way. And speaking of my son, the way you talk about the military, the way you talk about them being losers and being suckers, my son was in iraq, he spent a year there, he got the bronze star, he got the con pitch was service medal, he was not a loser. He was a patriot and the people left behind there were heroes. Really . Are you talking about hunter . Im talking about my son beau biden. I dont know beau. Hunter got thrown out of the military. Thats not true. He wasnt dishonorably discharged. He didnt have a job until you became Vice President. None of that is true. He made a fortune in ukraine, in china, in moscow. That is simply not true. My son he didnt have a job. My son, like a lot of people, like a lot of people we know at home, had a drug problem, hes overtaken it. Hes fixed it. Hes worked on it. And im proud of him. Im proud of my son. He wasnt given tens of millions of dollars. That is totally weve been through this. I think the American People would rather hear about more substantial so do i. Well, as the moderator, sir, im going to make a judgment call. But when somebody gets 3. 5 million from the mayor of moscow. That is not gentlemen that report is totally discredited. Mitt romney on that Committee Said it wasnt worth taxpayers money. It was written for political reasons. I would like to talk about Climate Change. So would i. Okay. The forest fires in the west are raging now. They have burned millions of acres. They have displaced hundreds of thousands of people. When state officials there blamed the fires on Climate Change, mr. President , you said, i dont think the science knows. Over your four years, you have pulled the u. S. Out of the paris climate accord. You have rolled back a number of obama environmental records. What do you believe about the science of Climate Change and what will you do in the next four years to confront it . I want Crystal Clean water and air, i want beautiful, clean air. We have now the lowest carbon if you look at our numbers right now, we are doing phenomenally. But i havent destroyed our businesses. Our businesses arent put out of commission. If you look at the paris accord, it was a disaster from our standpoint. And people are actually very happy about whats going on. Because our businesses are doing well. As far as the fires are concerned, you need forest management, in addition to Everything Else. The forest floors are loaded up with trees, dead trees that are years old and theyre like tinder and leaves and Everything Else. You drop a cigarette in there, the whole forest burns down. Youve got to have forest management. What do you believe about the science of Climate Change, sir . I believe that we have to do everything we can to have immaculate air, water, and do whatever else we can thats good. You know, were planting a billion trees. And its very exciting. You believe that human pollution, gas, Greenhouse Gas emissions contributes to the Global Warming of this planet . I think to an extent, yes. I think to an extent, yes. But i also think we have to do better management of our forests. Every year i get the call, californias burning. Californias burning. If that was cleaned if you had forest management, good forest management, you wouldnt be getting those calls. You know, in europe, they live, they have forest cities, theyre called forest cities. They maintain their forests. They manage their forests. I was with the head of a major country, its a forest city. He said, sir, we have trees that are far more, they ignite much easier than california, there shouldnt be that problem. I spoke with the governor about it. Im getting along very well with the governor. I said, at some point, you cant every year have hundreds of thousands of acres of land just burn to the ground. Thats burning down because of a lack of management. Sir, if you believe in the science of Climate Change, why have you rolled back the obama Clean Power Plan which limited Carbon Emissions in power plants, why have you relaxed because it was driving Energy Prices through the sky. Why have you relaxed fuel economy standards that are going to create more pollution from cars and trucks . Well, not really, because whats happening is, the car is much less expense i, a much safer car and youre talking about a tiny difference. And what would happen, because of the cost of the car, you would have at least double and triple the number of cars per chased. We have the old slugs out there that are 10, 12 years old. If you did that, the car would be safer, it would be much cheaper by 3,500. In california, they have ignored your rollback. People would be able to afford a car. So, and by the way, were going to see how that turns out, but a lot of people agree with me. Many people. The car has gotten so expensive because they have computers all over the place for an extra little bit of gasoline. And thats not and im okay with electric cars, too. I have given big incentives for electric cars, but what they have done in california is just crazy. Vice President Biden, id like you to respond to the president s Climate Change record, but i want to ask you about a concern, you proposed 2 trillion in green jobs, you talk about new limits, not abolishing, but new limits on fracking, ending the use of fossil fuels by 2035 and zero net emission of Greenhouse Gases by 2050. The president says a lot of these things would tank the economy and cost millions of jobs. Hes absolutely wrong, number one. Number two, if, in fact, during our administration, the recovery act, i was able to bring down the cost of Renewable Energy to cheaper than or as cheap as coal and gas and oil. Nobodys going to build another coalfired plant in america. No ones going to build another oilfired plant in america. Theyre going to move to Renewable Energy, number one. Number two, were going to make sure that were able to take the federal fleet and turn it into a fleet thats run on their electric vehicles, making sure we can do that, were going to put 500,000 charging stations on all of the highways that were going to be building in the future. Were going to build an economy that, in fact, is going to provide for the ability of us to take 4 million buildings and make sure that they, in fact, are weatherized in a way that, in fact, will emit significantly less gas and oil because the heat will not be going out. There are so many things that we can do now to create thousands and thousands of jobs. We can get to net zero in terms of Energy Production by 2035. Not only not costing people jobs, creating jobs. Creating millions of good paying jobs. Not 15 bucks an hour, but prevailing wage. By having a new infrastructure that, in fact, is green. And the first thing i will do, i will rejoin the paris accord. I will join the paris accord because with us out of it, look whats happening. Its all falling apart. And talk about someone who has no relationship with foreign policy, brazil, the rain forest in brazil are being ripped down. More carbon is absorbed in that rain forest than every bit of carbon thats emitted in the United States. Instead of doing something about that, i would be gathering up and making sure we had the countries of the world coming up with 20 billion to say, heres 20 billion, stop stop tearing down the forest. And if you dont, then youre going to have significant economic consequences. What about the argument that President Trump basically says that you have to balance environmental interests and economic interests and hes drawn his line. Well, he hasnt drawn a line. He stick, for example, makes sure, he wants to make sure that methanes not a problem. You can emit more me than without it being a problem. Methane. This is a guy that says you dont have to have mileage standards for automobiles that exist now. This is a guy not true. Not true. Its all true. And hes talking about the Green New Deal and its not 2 billion or 20 billion, its 100 trillion. Im talking about the biden plan. And rebuild the building. It is the dumb eest twocar systems are out, where they want to take out the cows, too, you know, thats not true, either. Not true. This is a this is a 100 trillion thats more money than our country could make in 100 years. That is simply not the case. Let me, because i actually wait a minute, sir, i actually have studied your plan and it includes upgrading 4 million buildings, weatherizing 2 million homes over four years, building 1. 5 Million Energy efficient homes. So, the question becomes, the president is saying, i think some people who support the president would say, that sounds like its going to cost a lot of money and hurt the economy. Its going to create thousands of jobs. Not let he finish. He doesnt know how to do that. The fact is, its going to create millions of good paying jobs. And these tax incentives for people to weatherize, which he wants to get rid of. Its going to make the economy much safer. Look how much were paying now to deal with the hurricanes, to deal with, by the way, he has an answer for hurricanes, maybe you should drop a Nuclear Weapon on them. I never said that. He did said that. You made it up. And heres the deal. You make up a lot. Were going to be in a position where we can create hard good jobs by making sure the environment is clean and we all are in better shape. We spend billions of dollars now, billions of dollars on floods, hurricanes, rising seas. Were in real trouble. Look whats happened just in the midwest with these storms that come through and wipe out entire sections and counties in iowa. That didnt happen before. Because of Global Warming. We make up 15 of the worlds problem. We, in fact but the rest of the world, we have to get them to come along. Thats why we have to get back into the paris accord. All right, gentlemen wait a minute, chris, so, why didnt he do it for 47 years. Why didnt get the world china sends up real dirt into the air, russia does, india does, they all do. Were supposed to be good. And by the way, he made a couple of statements, the Green New Deal is 100 trillion. That is not my plan. The Green New Deal is not my plan. Going to rebuild gentlemen. He made his statement about the military. He said i said something about the military. He and his friends made it up and then they went with it. I never said it. Okay. That is not true. You are done in this segment. He called the military stupid bastards. I did not say that. He said stupid bastards. Sir, stop. Play it. Play it. Go ahead, mr. Vice president answered his final question. The final question is, i cant remember which of all his rantings. Im having a little trouble myself. About the economy and about this question of what its going to cost . The economy. The Green New Deal and the idea of what your environmental changes will do. The Green New Deal will pay for itself as we move forward. Were not going to build plants that, in fact, are great polluting plants. Do you superintendent port t the Green New Deal . No, i dont. Oh, thats a big statement. I support you lost the radical left. I support the biden plan that i put forward. The biden plan. Which is different than what he calls the radical Green New Deal. All right, gentlemen, final segment. Election integrity. As we meet tonight, millions of americans are receiving mailin b ballots, are going to vote early. How confident should we be that this will be a Fair Election and what are you prepared to do over the next fiveplus weeks, because it will not only be to election day, but also counting some ballots, mailin ballots after election day, what are you prepared to do to reassure the American People that the next president will be the legitimate winner of this election, in this final segment, mr. Vice president , you go first. Prepared to let people vote. They should go to iwillvote. Com. Decide how theyre going to vote, when, by what means theyre going to vote. His own Homeland Security director and the fbi director says there is no evidence at all that mailin ballots are a source of being manipulated and cheating. They said that. The fact is that there are going to be millions of people because of covid that are going to be voting by mailin ballots, like he does, by the way. He sits behind the desk and sends his ballot to florida, number one. Number two, were going to make sure that those people who want to vote in person are able to vote because there are enough poll watchers there to make sure they can socially distance. The polls are open on time. And the polls stay open until the votes are counted. And this is all about trying to dissuade people from voting because hes trying to square people into thinking that its not going to be legitimate. Show up and vote. You will determine the outcome this election. Vote, vote, vote. If you are able to vote early in your state, vote early. If you are able to vote in person, vote in person, vote whatever way is the best way for you, because you will he cannot stop you from being able to determine the outcome of this election. And in terms of whether or not, when the votes are counted and theyre all counted, that will be accepted. If i win, that will be accepted. If i lose, that will be accepted. But by the way, if, in, he says hes not sure what hes going to accept, well, let me tell you something, it doesnt matter, because if we get the votes, its going to be all over. Hes going to go. He cant stay in power. It wont happen. It wont happen. So vote. Just make sure you understand, you have it in your control to determine what this countrys going to look like the next four years. Is it going to change or are you going to get four more years of these lies . Mr. President . Two minutes. So when i listen to joe talking about a transition, theres been no transition from when i won. I won that election and if you look at crooked Hillary Clinton, if you look at all of the different people, there was no transition, because they came after me, trying to do a coup, they came after me spying on my campaign, they started from the day i won and even before i won, from the day i came down the escalator with our first lady, they were a disaster, they were a disgrace to our country. And weve caught then. Weve caught them all. We got it all on tape. Weve caught them all. And by the way, you gave the idea for the logan act against general flynn. You better look at that. Because we caught you, in a sense. And president obama was sitting in the office, he knew about it, too. So, dont tell me about a free transition. As far as the ballots are concerned, its a disaster. A solicited ballot, okay . Solicited, is okay. You are asking, they send it back, you send it back. I did that. If you have an unsolicited, they are sending millions of ballots all over the country. Theres fraud, they found them in creeks, they found some with the name trump just happened to have the name trump just the other day in a waste paper basket. Theyre being sent all over the place. They sent two in a democrat area, they sent out 1,000 ballots, everybody got two ballots. This is going to be a fraud like youve never seen. The other thing, its nice on november 3rd, you are watching and you see who won the election. And i think were going to do well, because people are really happy with the job weve done. But you know what . We wont know we might not know for months because these ballots are going to be all over. Take a look at what happened in manhattan. Look at what happened in new jersey, look what happened in virginia and other places. Theyre not losing 2 , 1 , which, by the way, is too much, an election could be won or lost with that. Theyre losing 30 and 40 . Its a fraud and its a shame and can you imagine where they say, you have to have your ballot in by november 10th. November 10th . That means thats seven days after the election, in theory, should have been announced. We have major states, all run by democrats. Two minutes is two minutes. Its a rigged election. Youre going to be able to continue. You have been charging for months that mailin balloting is going to be a disaster, you say its rigged, that its going to lead to fraud, but in 2018, in the last midterm election, 31 Million People voted mailin voting, that was a quarter, more than a quarter of all the voters that year, cast their ballots by mail. No gnaw th now that millions of mailin ballots have gone out, what are you going to do about it, and are you counting on the Supreme Court, including a Justice Barrett, to settle any disputes . Yeah, i think im counting on them to look at the ballots, definitely. I hope we dont need them, in terms of the election itself. But for the ballots, i think so. Because whats happening is incredible. I just heard, i read today where at least 1 of the ballots for 2016 were invalidated. They take them, we dont like them, we dont like them. What are you going to do about it . Millions of ballots going out right now. You do a solicited ballot no, im asking you about the fact that millions of people you go and vote. You go and vote. Im saying is like they used to in the old you either do, chris, a solicited ballot, where you are sending it in, they are sending it back and youre sending. They have mailmen with lots of did you see whats going on . Look at west virginia. Mailmen selling the ballots. They are being sold. Theyre being dumped in rivers. This is a horrible thing for our country. There is no evidence of that. This is not going to end well. This is not going to end well. Vpice President Biden five states have had mailin ballots for the last decade or more. Five. Including two republican states. And you dont have to solicit the ballot, its sent to your home. It has to be postmarked by election day. If it doesnt get until until the 7th, 8th, 9th, it still should be counted. Hes afraid of counting the votes because of the outcome. Youre long. I want to continue with you on this, Vice President biden, because chris, hes so wrong when he makes a Statement Like that. Excuse me. Vice President Biden, the biggest problem, in fact, over the years with mailin voting, has not been fraud, historical y historically, its been that sizable numbers, sometimes hundreds of thousands of ballots are thrown out because they have not been properly filled out or there is some other irregularity, missed the deadline. So, are you concerned that the Supreme Court with a Justice Barrett will settle any dispute . Im concerned that any court would settle this, because heres the deal. When you file, when you get a ballot and you fill it out, youre supposed to have an affidavit. If you didnt know, you have someone say that this is me. You should be able to, if, in fact, you can verify thats you when before the ballot is thrown out, thats sufficient to be able to count the ballot because someone made a mistake and not dotting the correct i. Who they voted for, testify, say who they voted for, say its you, that is totally legitimate. All right. No, no. Gentlemen, i have a final question. You know it cant be done. And already theres been fraud. Wait a minute, gentlemen. Final question. In eight states we can keep talking. In eight states, election workers are prohibited, currently by law, eight states, from even beginning to process ballots, even take them out of the envelopes and flatten them, until election day. That means that its likely, because theres going to be a huge increase in mailin balloting, that we are not going to know on Election Night who the winner is, that it could be d days, it could be weeks. Months. Until we find out who the new president is. So, i first, for you, sir, finally, for the Vice President , i hope neither of you will interrupt the other. Will you urge your supporters to stay calm during this extended period not to engage in any several unrest and will you pledge tonight that you will not declare victory until the election has been independently certified . President trump . Im urging my supporters to go into the polls and watch very carefully, because thats what has to happen. I am urging them to do it. As you know, today, there was a big problem. In philadelphia, they went in to watch. They were called poll watchers, very safe, nice thing. They were thrown out. They werent allowed to watch. You know why . Because bad things happen in philadelphia. Bad things. And i am urging i am urging my people, i hope its going to be a Fair Election. You are urging them what . I am 100 on board, but if i see tens of thousands of ballots being manipulated, i cant go along with that. And ill tell you what. What does that mean . Does that mean youre going to tell your people to take to the streets . It means you have a fraudulent election. And what would you do about it . Theyre not equipped these people arent equipped to handle it. Number one. Number two, they cheat. They cheat. Hey, they found ballots in a waste paper basket three days ago and they all had the name, military ballots, they all had the name trump on them. You think thats good . Vice President Biden, final question for you, will you urge your supporters to stay calm while the vote is counted and will you pledge not to declare victory until the election is independently certified . Yes. And heres the deal. They count the ballots, as you pointed out. Some of these ballots in some states cant even be opened until election day. And if theres thousands of ballots, going to take time to do it. By the way, our military. Theyve been voting by ballots since the end of the civil war, in effect. And thats whats going to happen. Why was it not why is it for them somehow not fraudulent . Its the same process. Its honest. No one has established at all that there is fraud related to mailin ballots, that somehow its a fraudulent process. Its been established. I asked you, you had an opportunity to respond. They have no what happened. He has no idea what hes talking about. I will accept it. And he will too, you know why . Because once the winner is declared after all the ballots are counted, all the votes are counted, that will be the end of it. That will be the end of it. And if its me, in fact, fine, if its not me, ill support the outcome. And ill be a president not just for the democrats, ill be a president for democrats and republicans and this guy i want to see an honest ballot continue. Gentlemen, thats the end of it. This is the end of this debate. I want to see an honest ballot count. Were going to leave it there, to be continued, as many more debates, as we go on. President trump, Vice President biden, its been an interesting hour and a half. I wasnnt to thank you both for participating in the first of three debates you have agreed on. We want to thank Case Western Reserve University and the Cleveland Clinic for hosting this event. The next debate, sponsored by the commission of president ial debates, will be october 7th at the university of utah in salt lake city. The two Vice President ial nominees, Vice President mike pence and senator kamala harris, will debate at 9 00 p. M. Eastern that night. We hope you watch. Until then, thank you and good night. Well, it is hard to know where to start. Im not sure how people are going to feel about that to be continued at the end. People have to make their own judgments about how the candidates handled themselves tonight. Who made the better case, who offered plans for the future, who told the truth and who deserves to be president. Those are all judgments that are going to be made over the next several days and weeks. But i have to speak personally here as somebody who has watched president ial debates for 40 years as somebody who has moderated president ial debates, somebody who has prepared candidates for president ial debates, someone who has covered president ial debates that was the worst president ial debate i have ever seen in my life. A lot more heat than light over some 98 minutes. I want to go to the room right now. Jon karl, you were there in the room, you covered the president , your thoughts . George, the debate was a total mess. It was a mess of interruptions, petty insults. I was in touch with some people on the floor who described who told me they were stunned by what they were seeing transpire on that stage. Donald trump came across like a bully, there was an avalanche of untruth statements that came out. Joe biden did not have a particularly steady performance. I could say really, honestly, it looks like both men lost this debate and in that sense, the real loser is donald trump. As we said at the start, donald trump needed to change the dynamic of this race. He is the one that is losing. He is the one that needed to change the trajectory. He needed a big win and that did not happen tonight. Mary bruce . Well, joe bidens campaign is feeling very good right now. They came into tonight with a goal not to get dragged into the mud with donald trump but to speak directly to the middle eastern American People and the Campaign Aide tells me that when joe biden went around the president and stared into the camera and spoke to voters, directly about a vaccine, about the economy, covid, about election integrity, they say every single one of those moments, they were winning. George, this was just remarkable. When you take a step back and you think about the fact that in a normal debate, every if you were to call your opponent a clown, racist, the worst president ever, to tell him to shut up or to shush, that would be considered crossing a line, but here tonight, that was part of a concerted strategy by joe biden to try and show that he could keep his cool, actually. Its part of an effort by joe biden that he can be the adult in the room, to guide the country out of these really turbulent times. Over and over again, he simply refused to give credence to the president s attacks, even though, lets be honest, there were parts of that debate that were simply unwatchable because the two of them were just talking over and over each other. Here in the room, it was really astounding. And it was apparent, as you watched it, that the president was often turned to the former Vice President , pointing his finger at time, speaking to him. Joe biden staring down the camera, trying to speak to the American People, making his point. The Biden Campaign says all you saw tonight from the president was chaos, what you saw from joe biden was stability, they say. Thank you, mary bruce. Chris christie, was that the debate you prepared for . No. But what ill tell you is th that i listened to the commentary already and i think people are missing some things. First off, rahm said earlier that it was the Vice President s job tonight to reassure. I dont think thats a reassuring performance by the Vice President tonight. He looked very shaky at many times. His numbers were way off. He would wander off in mid sentence and then used lots of namecalling and insulting language. Thats not rising above it. I have to disagree with mary. Or at least with what shes conveying from the biden folks. And yeah, i think on the trump side, it was too hot. Listen, you come in, decide you want to be aggressive and that was the right thing to be aggressive, but that was too hot. And so i think that what happens is, with all that heat, as you said before, you lose the light. That potentially can be fixed. Maybe, maybe not. Well have to see. On the trump side. On the biden side, id be very concerned that his problems cant be fixed because if you are not up to being able to stand up there for 90 minutes and be consistently coherent, people are going to wonder whether youre going to be able do that when you are sitting behind the desk in the oval office. Rahm emanuel . I think joe biden did a smart strategy of a rope a dope, because in fact president looked totally out of control and Chris Wallace basically said that. And the president needed to change peoples perception. He looked exactly like the bully that people have been exhausted by. I think the Vice President steadied as the night went on. When he talked about covid, when he talked about health care. When he talked about and he looked right at the American People, said this is about your family and your direction. When he talked about the integrity of bringing people together. And also, when he rebutted him about his son, beau, not calling him a pat sy he was serving. There was moments, who wouldnt get rattled when Somebody Just screams at you all night . And Chris Wallace basically said it. Like, hold on here. There are rules here. And so, i think the president hurt himself by only having a fifth gear. There was no second year, there was no third gear. And i think given that, i think the Vice President practiced a pretty good rope a dope strategy. David muir, were going to have to do it on gma tomorrow, youll have to do it on world news tonight tomorrow night. What is the lede of this debate . As we were going into this tonight, george, we were talking about the level of exhaustion in this country. We have to remember that the backdrop for this entire debate is this coronavirus pandemic, 200,000 american lives have been lost. The economy, millions on unemployment and people are exhausted. They want to know, when is this going to end . Who has a plan to help guide the way through . And you have to wonder if tonight did anything to further that argument or put people at home, and thats what we think about here as we do the news, did it put anyone at peace about the future of our country and the immediate months and years to come in how he navigate our way out of this moment . We talked about President Trump, this was a unique opportunity for him to come in and say, heres what i will do over my next four years, im not sure we heard a lot of that tonight. Joe biden had to come in, we said, no unforced errors, dont get pulled into the personal attacks. I think he was fairly steady in temperament and tone but i do wonder if people will be frustrated at home, no matter how difficult it was in those moments, that they didnt hear enough, really from either about their specific plans of guiding this nation forward. One thing that is getting a lot of notice, linsey davis, online, the president refused to condemn White Supremacists. He said he would, when he was asked, sure, i will, and he gave a call to action, saying stand back and stand by. That was something that really got my attention. And i was i cant say i was surprised, but it was really a moment that i think that people especially in the black community heard loud and clear. Got to take a quick break. Well be right back. Try natures bounty hair, skin and nails gummies. The number one brand to support beautiful hair, glowing skin, and healthy nails. And try advanced, now with two times more biotin. Back now after this first president ial debate. Want to go to sara fagan. You said there was that joe biden had a tougher job coming into the night. Is that the way you feel coming out of it . I think this was a total food fight. I dont think either candidate won. There were moments where the president was setting up the choice in this election, but they just devolved and too quickly. And the challenge for the president , i agree with jon karl, that, in a place where he doesnt command the stage in a president ial way, hes not getting atehead. Hes down seven points. I think hes probably still down seven points after it. Yvette . I think this was a disaster. Trumps performance has shown me exactly why our country is in the state that were in right now. The fact that weve survived to this point with that kind of leadership, i think, is amazing. Joe bidens challenge, as my grandmother said, dont make sense out of foolishness, or make a fool out of you. There was so much foolishness, i dont think there was a way for him to cut through and have the moments that he desired at the top. Completely out of control and the people who lose are the American People who, you know, as david has said, are looking for hope, are looking for real direction or looking leadership. Joe biden did the best he can, and out of the gate, he did a much better job. By the end, it was clear that even he was getting unsettled. Got a little too hot towards the end, too. I wish he had taken a deep breath. But he had a huge challenge, because donald trump really, really was a disaster and im really, really afraid for our country, unfortunately, if he wins another term. Matthew dowd, you worked for both democrats and republicans, of course, you worked for george w. Bush. Your thoughts . Well, i think this was an embarrassment. If you are in a foreign country, you look at our United States right now, if you watched that, youd think this was an embarrassment. If you are sitting in our country, its embarrassing and that embarrassment falls directly at the feet of donald trump. I actually think there was a winner tonight, and that was joe biden. If you are president of the United States and youre the incumbent, you have to convince people that everything is good in america and put me through another four years of this. And if you watched that debate, if you watched that debate as a citizen of the United States, youre not thinking everythings great in america right now. So, joe biden, yeah, he had good moments, he had some good moments, and as i said going into this debate, that Donald Trumps a bull in a china shop, well, the bull was let loose in the china shop, the moderator tried his best they could to control it. Joe biden tried to fend it off. But when you look at the end of this, donald trump had to convince the American Public that four years, four more years of this is a good thing the exact opposite conclusion, i think, theyre going to come to after watching that debate. Martha raddatz, i dont envy anybody the job Chris Wallace had tonight, but i wonder what lessons moderators Going Forward, supposed to be two more president ial debates, the Vice President debate, are going to take from this. As i said going in, it takes a lion tamer in a debate with donald trump and you needed ten lion tamers tonight. I think Chris Wallace tried. I think at some point, you just have to stop it. It was not a president ial debate, it was mud wrestling and as david pointed out, in the middle of a pandemic. I have been in touch with some voters who i met on our crosscountry trip. There was one man who was leaning towards trump, but going into the debate tonight, he was leaning towards biden, but he did not like the namecalling, he did not like biden dropping to the level he said of donald trump. And a lot of talk about the military tonight, as you know, george, im in touch with a lot of people in the military. One of them said to me tonight, this is the most shameful interaction between two leaders ever, ever, i am sad and ashamed. Martha raddatz, thank you very much. We have to take one more break. Well be right back. Im looking for my client. Im his accountant. Im so sorry. [ sighs ] hey hey man youre here. You dont trust me here is vegas, do you . Well. I thought we had a breakthrough with the volkswagen. We did. Yes. We broke through. Thats the volkswagen thats the cross sport. Wow. Seatbelts. Please, just tell me where were going. Natures bounty is here for you. Ready to take your immune support to the next level . 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Just a bit of time left here in on post debate analysis. See yececilia vega . Not at a lot of undecided voters in this race. I dont think they got a lot out of this tonight. I keep thinking about the 200,000 people dead in this pandemic, the high rate of unemployment that we are looking at right now and the takeaway for most americans after watching this tonight, i think, will be exhaustion. And one of the things we are already seeing online in the wake of this debate, a lot of people wondering, will there be more debates after this . Will we see the final two president ial debates . A lot of people disappointed in what they saw tonight, wondering if its something we should see again. Thats going to be it for us right now. Much more on nightline and abc news live. A lot more tomorrow on good morning america. For many of you right now, its time for your late local news. 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Oh, what a night it was President Trump and former Vice President joe biden went headtohead with 35 days left until the election and the debate covered a range of topic from covid19, the Supreme Court race, tax records and more. Our anchor in