Transcripts For GBN Free 20240703

We receive those, we will consider them. And if they meet the legal bar, then we will absolutely revoke and expel them and the first case is already under consideration in. In other news, to danger to life, weather warnings have been issued in england in the wake of storm babet severe flood alerts are in place around the river idle near retford in nottinghamshire, which is expected to reach record levels. The number of people who have died during the storm has risen to four after police found the body of 83 year old Maureen Gilbert in chesterfield , gilbert in chesterfield, Manchester United has opened a book of condolence at old trafford following the death of sir bobby charlton, the legendary footballer was a key member of englands World Cup Winning Team in 1966. Floral tributes and football shirts are being placed outside the Manchester United stadium with his former club saying hell always be remembered as a giant of the game. This is gb news of the game. This is gb news across the uk on tv, in your car, on Digital Radio and on your Smart Speaker by saying play gb news now its back to free speech nation. Free speech nation. There are calls for jihad on the streets of london. A swiss man is imprisoned for fat shaming , and man is imprisoned for fat shaming, and j. K. Rowling says shell be happy to serve time for misgendering. This is free speech nation. Welcome to free speech nation. Welcome to free speech nation with me andrew doyle. Well, this is the show where we take a look at culture, Current Affairs and politics and coming up on the show tonight, carol decker from tpau be carol decker from tpau will be here to discuss her memorable music career and the time she here to discuss her memorable muscancelledind the time she here to discuss her memorable muscancelled for the time she here to discuss her memorable muscancelled for saying1e she got cancelled for saying welsh was language. Ill be was a foreign language. Ill be joined professor who claims joined by a professor who claims he were he has new evidence. Were simply characters an advanced simply characters in an advanced virtual terrifying virtual world. Its terrifying stuff. And lawyer Dennis Kavanagh will be here to discuss the governments expected u turn on a ban on conversion therapy. And course, got and of course, ive got a fantastic here answering fantastic panel here answering questions from the studio audience and panel tonight audience and my panel tonight are nick dixon and are comedians nick dixon and steve allen, who well , welcome. Steve allen, who well, welcome. How are you, nick . How are you, nick . What have you been up to . What have you been up to . Ive literally just been working here. Youre here all the time. Youre here all the time. Almost every day. And then a few days. Im not. I just lie at home very still. Is that better or worse and is that better or worse than previous life . Than your previous life . Better. But i still find much better. But i still find ways to complain about it. Thats the impressive thing. Its skill. Its an impressive skill. Steve . You how about you, steve . Are you well . How about you, steve . Are you welmainly a child is mainly raising a child is what i do these days. Thats the problem. When you have those. It, have one of those. Thats it, isnt its game over. Isnt it . And its game over. Is constant. They they it is constant. They they i mean, hes 19 months now. Still hasnt learned to drive. Thats ridiculous. Its taken ridiculous. So yeah, its taken a while. Okay, some them are okay, well, some of them are slow but anyway, lets slow learners. But anyway, lets get questions from our get some questions from our lovely one lovely audience. Our first one comes alan, where alan . Comes from alan, where is alan . Hello, comes from alan, where is alan . Hel hi ladies. Comes from alan, where is alan . Helhi ladies. Oh, god. Hi there, ladies. Oh, god. Sorry. Thats outrageous, isnt it . Well, my question is , why it . Well, my question is, why are the met police so relaxed about the calls for jihad in the streets of london . Yeah, this was a disturbing video that went viral. And this was part of the march for palestine. Up to 100,000 people palestine. Up to 100,000 people were there. That was in london. But it was the video of a group there called hizb ut tahrir. And they well, certainly a member of they well, certainly a member of the group was calling for jihad. The group was calling for jihad. And then the police were contacted about it. And the contacted about it. And the police claimed that this wasnt a call violence. Well, lets a call for violence. Well, lets have look at the clip. Have a look at the clip. First one is the solution to liberate people in the concentration on palestine concentration camps on palestine jihad. What is the solution. Jihad. What is the solution. Neil kinnock. Well, kwasi dup neil kinnock. Well, kwasi dup sabina nessa you kwasi europol facing in the way of allah. Those who fight you, the zionist entity, has a military. They have a police force, they have a judiciary , they have an opponent judiciary, they have an opponent , an Army Fighting , killing, an Army Fighting, killing, massacring our people. Islam massacring our people. Islam saying jihad fisabilillah that the muslim armies move to rescue the muslim armies move to rescue the people of palestine. And the people of palestine. And thatis the people of palestine. And that is the solution that oh, okay. So , nick, i mean, hes so, nick, i mean, hes definitely calling for using words like army, the word jihad. Words like army, the word jihad. I mean, a lot of people have pointed out that when hizb tahrir, a group that are banned in many arab countries, when they Start Talking about jihad, you should concerned. You should be concerned. Mean, the police yeah, i mean, the Police Issued this ridiculous statement. Jihad statement. The word jihad has a number meanings, so its number of meanings, but so its like type of flower. Yeah, like this type of flower. Yeah, yeah. Mean, this is not yeah. I mean, this is not a religious book study group, you know its like we know what i mean . Its like we know what i mean . Its like we know meaning. Mean, he know the meaning. I mean, he said is jihad said the only solution is jihad by armies of muslim by the armies of the muslim countries. So i dont think its that ambiguous. Made it very clear that guys made it very clear hes made it clear. Hes made it very clear. The only the only argument you might have is like, is it incitement . If hes inspiring foreign perhaps not foreign armies, perhaps its not immediate the immediate incitement on the streets thats streets of london. Thats the only technicality think only technicality i can think of. Is completely absurd. I mean, the question comes down free speech issue, down to a free speech issue, doesnt it . Because i do believe in i think need in free speech. I think you need to cut it very fine, like harassment, inciting men to violence already illegal. Violence is already illegal. But i what qualifies i think what qualifies as harassment to be harassment to violence has to be a pretty high threshold, doesnt harassment to violence has to be a pdo y high threshold, doesnt harassment to violence has to be a pdo you gh threshold, doesnt harassment to violence has to be a pdo you think eshold, doesnt harassment to violence has to be a pdo you think thisld, doesnt harassment to violence has to be a pdo you think this qualifies . It . Do you think this qualifies . Mean, as nick just well, i mean, as nick just said, the many said, the defence is the many definitions the word jihad, definitions of the word jihad, which just following which could just mean following the god, i believe. But the rule of god, i believe. But then like to tie someone then phrases like to tie someone up has different meanings. And if going pop if i said, im going to pop round your and tie you up, round your house and tie you up, i might not mean give you a lot of you might not so of papennork. You might not so yousounds like an offer to me. Sounds like an offer to me. Sounds like an offer to me. It does. But either way, its incitement for something. I know what mean. Has to be what you mean. The bar has to be set but at time, the set high, but at a time, the context the context is the context is the context is the thing. Yeah. And the timing is part that context well. Part of that context as well. Yeah. In america they have well, in america they have the brandenburg test, which determines whether something classifies as inciting to violence. That violence. And the point of that is about imminency. You is its about imminency. You know, has to you and do know, it has to be you go and do this now. Now, talking this thing now. Now, talking to a crowd already fired a crowd who are already fired up, et cetera. So its very clear over there, but its less clear over there, but its less clear over there, but its less clear over here. Do you think that people that that these people like that should what they should be able to say what they want streets . Mean, want on the streets . I mean, youre i presume . Youre for protest, i presume . Protest to an well, im for protest to an extent. Mean, i got in extent. I mean, i got in trouble. Someone was telling me off because i said, if off recently because i said, if you flag, you you have a hamas flag, you probably shouldnt be in the country. Were saying, country. And people were saying, well, nick, i thought you were a free this group free speech, but this is a group that wipe out the that wants to wipe out the entire is line entire west. There is a line for me, not palestine flag, me, its not a palestine flag, but theres a big but hamas flag. So theres a big difference. I think its difference. And i think its become almost a cliche, but people of two people are sick of the two tiered system. Tiered justice system. I mean, we a lady got we had a lady who was got a visit the police for taking visit from the police for taking a of sticker was a photo of a sticker that was like a gender critical sticker. Yeah. Visit yeah. Kelly j. Keane got a visit for untoward for being, quote, untoward board about so and then we have about a. So and then we have a guy the guy shouting for jihad on the streets, are streets, and the police are like, lets him like, well, lets hear him out. Its like, well, thats and its like, well, thats kind of kind of important kind of thats kind of important as double standards kind of thats kind of important as to double standards kind of thats kind of important as to this, ble standards kind of thats kind of important as to this, whichmdards element to this, which is actually really, really important, you know . Kate scottow important, you know . Kate scottwof child, into front of a child, thrown into a cell calling a man, a man, cell for calling a man, a man, a man who identifies woman, man who identifies as a woman, a man. Would suggest that man. Now, i would suggest that if are going to be if the police are going to be policing offensive this policing offensive speech, this would qualify, wouldnt it . Yes, there who are there are lots of people who are offended by this. Yes. But i dont think you would. Make that would. Well, you make that point, think youd would. Well, you make that pointthe think youd would. Well, you make that pointthe police think youd would. Well, you make that pointthe police to. Hink youd would. Well, you make that pointthe police to police ud would. Well, you make that pointthe police to police every want the police to police every single word that everyone says. Saying is, i dont what im saying is, though, way they are though, that the way they are currently doing its currently doing it, its hypocrisy. Just hypocrisy. Its not just hypocrisy. Its not just hypocrisy. As hypocrisy. It comes across as having ideological having a kind of ideological drive know, drive of a kind of, you know, well certain they well do certain things if they if they go along with our beliefs things that dont. dont. Its not about the maybe its not about the ideology. What ideology. Its about what the next fear the next step will be. They fear the next step will be. They fear the next if you go around next step. So if you go around and someone did and ask someone like, why did you a sticker you take a picture of a sticker on theres not going on a poster, theres not going to be a huge protest. The next day, but maybe worry about to be a huge protest. The next dayjconsequences worry about to be a huge protest. The next dayjconsequences whatrabout to be a huge protest. The next dayjconsequences what would. The consequences of what would have arrested have happened if they arrested people have happened if they arrested peoi le they probably were i think they probably were very the consequences. I think cant yes, i think the police cant contain they know contain it and they dont know what to do. And also, its embarrassing the embarrassing for sort of the ruling through mass ruling elite who is through mass immigration, kind ruling elite who is through mass imthings,on, kind ruling elite who is through mass imthings, but kind ruling elite who is through mass imthings, but they kind ruling elite who is through mass imthings, but they dont kind of things, but they dont want to and very uncomfortable. All so they there arent a lot the people theyre part lot of the people theyre part of that crowd are british. Yeah, probably. I what do we do . You know, i dont know. But it become kind of it has become this kind of anarcho it, anarcho tyranny now, hasnt it, where basically law where you punish basically law abiding for example, for abiding people for example, for taking of a sticker and taking a photo of a sticker and you punish crime and this you dont punish crime and this is what people call a narco tyranny. Makes tyranny. And this is what makes people so furious. Well, its almost Police Almost as though the police dont to apply the law dont know how to apply the law in certain cases. Saw a police i mean, we saw a Police Account the day account on twitter the other day claiming someone claiming that calling someone a mean against the law. Mean name is against the law. And isnt. It just isnt. And and it isnt. It just isnt. And even i know that, you know, because people to me. Because people do that to me. All twitter. Can all the time on twitter. Can i get . Because that get them arrested . Because that would actually really help. It get them arrested . Because that would clean. Ly really help. It get them arrested . Because that would clean. Ly realltimeline. Would clean up my timeline. You yeah. People do that to you here, though, as they do. Were doing thats true. You were doing it you . Okay. Thats true. You were doing it get you . Okay. Thats true. You were doing it get another you . Okay. Thats true. You were doing it get another questioniy. Thats true. You were doing it get another question now lets get another question now from roger . From roger. Where is roger . Hello. From roger. Where is roger . Helhes rowling going to prison. Well, i do hope not. Its a good way to focus the mind, though, as a writer gives you lots i mean, jeffrey lots of time. I mean, Jeffrey Archer came out with a book when he was in prison, didnt he . So you pretty well, you know, its a pretty well, i dont she emulates him dont think she emulates him particularly. Would dont think she emulates him particulthis would dont think she emulates him particulthis is would dont think she emulates him particulthis is because would dont think she emulates him particulthis is because theres say. So this is because theres been big story last week. Been this big story last week. We discussed it on show we discussed it on the show where are implementing. Where labour are implementing. They to toughen up they say they want to toughen up hate that hate crime legislation and that that would causing that would include causing offence people who identify offence to people who identify as genders and critics as different genders and critics are saying, well, this could potentially youre potentially mean that if youre classifying as a classifying misgendering as a hate it does lead to hate crime, it does lead to a two Year Prison Sentence potentially legally. So this is something that critics are something that the critics are saying would saying whether that would actually or not, we dont actually apply or not, we dont know. J. K. Rowling has said, know. Butj. K. Rowling has said, you if she to go to you know, if she needs to go to pnson you know, if she needs to go to prison for two years, be prison for two years, shed be happy this, happy to. If it comes to this, because principle of because its the principle of the thing. Theyre not going to send potter send the author of harry potter to they . Seems to prison, are they . It seems unlikely be amazing. Not because i dont like j. K. Rowling, would rowling, but because it would expose absurdity of the law. Expose the absurdity of the law. Like she get like you say, she you get a decent book out as well. There is but it its kind of is that. But it its kind of like trump moment. Like trump at the moment. Theres gagging theres a theres a gagging order on trump that he couldnt say about. Pence say anything about. Mike pence positive say anything about. Mike pence posiofe say anything about. Mike pence posi ofe opponents the one of his opponents in the primaries. People are primaries. So some people are saying go saying trump should just go to pnson saying trump should just go to prison the then prison to make the point. Then hell get on appeal anyway, hell get out on appeal anyway, probably of hours. Probably in a couple of hours. So went so if j. K. Rowling went to prison, at expose prison, it would at least expose the these laws. And the absurdity of these laws. And what what this at what this law, what this at least idea shows is least proposed idea shows is that, you say it that, once again, you say it cant worse under labour. Cant get worse under labour. Its going be much worse. Its going to be so much worse. Its going to be so much worse. I break it to you. I hate to break it to you. The tories incompetent, tories are incompetent, etcetera, know. Etcetera, etcetera. We all know. But going bring in but labour are going to bring in things which i things like this which just i mean a lot of mean certainly a lot of feminists feel that labour has really against them and really turned against them and is basically an anti woman party at point. At this point. I what do you what do i mean what do you what do you this . You think you think of this . Do you think its likely that kind of its likely that these kind of legislations in . Legislations would come in . A problem with all i got a problem with all the headunes headlines on these stories that i think are misleading. The headune i think are misleading. The headline about the jk one was saying rather saying that she would rather go to accept trans to prison than accept trans people. Say exactly. People. She didnt say exactly. Thats saying. Thats not what shes saying. But mails but then the daily mails headline, like you say, the wrong and youre in wrong gender and youre in pnson wrong gender and youre in prison for two years. No it has to deliberately as to be deliberately done as trying to that as your way trying to use that as your way of causing offence and hate , not of causing offence and hate, not just, oh, i, but even that , who just, oh, i, but even that, who interprets that. But thats not what the headlines. No, thats right. And agree no, thats right. And i agree with that the headlines no, thats right. And i agree witikind that the headlines no, thats right. And i agree witikind theyret the headlines no, thats right. And i agree witikind theyre skewingidlines no, thats right. And i agree witikind theyre skewing itines are kind of theyre skewing it however be however they want it to be skewed. However they want it to be ske but. However they want it to be ske but headlines quite but headlines are quite short, though. Steve they cant get you just said there. No, i want want no, i want i want the headune no, i want i want the headline to be longer than the article. Know what i article. That way i know what i need help in need to know that would help in terms clickbait nuance. Terms of clickbait and nuance. If you take the but i mean, if you take the irish crime bill, i mean, irish hate crime bill, i mean, there sorts problems there are all sorts of problems with know, irish with that. You know, the Irish Government look, government are saying, look, were lock people were not going to lock people away the things that they away for the things that they say, trust us. But the legislation says that they can, right . You dont right . And so that is you dont want legislate on the want vague legislate on the statute you dont know statute books. You dont know whos going to be in power in five and dont five years time. And i dont even trust the ones that are in power now. Frankly, no, i totally you. Totally agree with you. Want all the want you want all of the details, dotted details, all of the is dotted and the crossed so that they and the ts crossed so that they cant be accidental, cant be in accidental, unintended law. Unintended consequence of a law. Cant define unintended consequence of a law. You cant define unintended consequence of a law. You know, t define unintended consequence of a law. You know, in define unintended consequence of a law. You know, in terms efine hate. You know, in terms of irish speech theyre irish hate speech law, theyre saying, means it saying, well, hate just means it means the word means hate. They use the word hate definition hate, hate in the definition of hate, which definition which is kind of the definition of definition. Of a circle of definition. But the problem with the dictionary defines dictionary is it defines everything by words. It does. Where what where are you finding out what the usually not the words mean, but usually not the words mean, but usually not the , you know . The same words, you know . But still, up word cabbage. It says cabbage. Its a its cabbage. 1cabbage cabbage. Its a its cabbage. 1cabbage ,� abbage. Its a its cabbage. 1cabbage , youige. Its a its cabbage. 1cabbage , you idiot,s a its cabbage. 1cabbage , you idiot, adds s cabbage. 1cabbage , you idiot, adds der a cabbage, you idiot, adds der to well. A cabbage, you idiot, adds der to yeah, ell. A cabbage, you idiot, adds der to yeah, exactly. Cabbage der ridiculous. Anyway, lets to another anyway, lets go to another question stephen. Question now from stephen. Its £96,000 is a fair price to pay for diversity. Its a good question , steve, its a good question, steve, and is to do with nhs, and this is to do with the nhs, of theres been of course the nhs. Theres been a big thing this week because the were advertising the nhs were advertising for a diversity and equity role, paying diversity and equity role, paying the princely sum of £96,000, and thats now being criticised caused by the health secretary, by steve barclay, thinks its too much. Do you thinks its too much. Do you think much, well, think its too much, nick well, when i first saw the headline, it diversity advert. Like , where did they i was like, where did they place advert . I was place this advert . I mean, was it of the super it on the break of the super bowl . Advert cost £96,000 . Bowl . What advert cost £96,000 . I then it was the i realised then it was the salary of the job, which is equally absurd, but theyve made a kind of strange defence of this. Claim its all this. They claim that its all just do with equal. I mean just to do with equal. I mean they its to do with they say that its to do with being everyone being being able to everyone being able to get where they want in life and we life essentially. And and but we already had already have. We already had that. It was called meritocracy. Didnt it was didnt work out. Nick it was a great it was the best great system. It was the best system weve ever had. And what they is replace it they want to do is replace it with of thing, this with this kind of thing, this edi people call with this kind of thing, this e[died. People call with this kind of thing, this e[died. Its people call with this kind of thing, this e[died. Its you people call with this kind of thing, this e[died. Its you know, eople call with this kind of thing, this e[died. Its you know, equity,all it died. Its you know, equity, diversity, its a diversity, inclusion. And its a terrible its terrible idea. Its always its equity, which is basically communism under a different name it they claim its just about everyone having an equal opportunity but its not really because inevitably involves because inevitably it involves certain old, certain groups usually poor old, straight white men getting shunted out and other groups coming in. But thats not the same thing as equality, because i bogosian same thing as equality, because i this, bogosian same thing as equality, because i this, the bogosian same thing as equality, because i this, the americanyogosian about this, the american philosopher, was saying philosopher, and he was saying that, words that, you know, those words actually opposite actually mean the opposite of what mean. Actually mean the opposite of whiso mean. Actually mean the opposite of whiso when mean. Actually mean the opposite of whiso when they mean. Actually mean the opposite of whiso when they saynean. Actually mean the opposite of whiso when they say diversity, so when they say diversity, they excluding they mean theyre excluding people think same they mean theyre excluding peopyes. Think same they mean theyre excluding peopyes. When think same they mean theyre excluding peopyes. When theyre same they mean theyre excluding peopyes. When theyre saying me way. Yes. When theyre saying inclusion, theyre actually excluding people, you know, and that is problem. That is that is a problem. For instance, example of instance, he gave the example of if panel you if you have a panel and you say that this is to be that this panel is going to be diverse, cant have a black diverse, you cant have a black conservative panel conservative on that panel because thats what they because thats not what they mean by diverse. Thats yeah, thats a its almost a second secondary isnt it . Secondary problem, isnt it . Back words. The word were back to words. We what word but we know what the word means. But the which its applied, the way in which its applied, appued the way in which its applied, applied is the issue. And i realise about realise that were talking about diversity here with a question asked include of steve asked by steve include of steve about a minister called steve. Yep really were showing yep so really were showing a lot of diversity. Did that deliberately. We did that deliberately. I see is a very smart show. See this is a very smart show. There are layers to this show that people dont appreciate. They didnt mention that in the but fair the email. Yeah, but fair enough. Scripted. Look, enough. Its all scripted. Look, even though there are ways of defining those words that you talk about, actually are talk about, there actually are good but dont good goals. Yes. But you dont need person being paid need to have a person being paid nearly it. The nearly 100 grand doing it. The nhs filled with people who nhs is filled with people who have these administrative jobs pp have these administrative jobs pop in tray. Why cant pop in their in tray. Why cant they . They get paid well enough. Have thought i would have thought a dialysis have been dialysis machine would have been a better investment. I dont know. Riffing here. A better investment. I dont know riffing here. A better investment. I dont know mean, riffing here. A better investment. I dont know mean, theriffing here. A better investment. I dont know mean, the other here. Is but i mean, the other thing is that already hugely that the nhs is already hugely diverse. For diverse. We depend on for immigration the nhs to run right . It is a diverse employer. It doesnt need this. Yeah. Of people that and all of the people that are is the are saying that this is the reason have reason why you should have it are arguing diversity are just arguing why diversity is not shouldnt is good, not why that shouldnt be someone who already be done by someone who already works the of works there. So the idea of having extra money having to spend extra money from the fund a new the Dialysis Fund to hire a new person do a job that people person to do a job that people there already doing is there could already be doing is entirely thats entirely wasteful. And thats probably the pretty probably why the nhs is pretty good it. Good at it. Absolutely. You can absolutely. Well, you can hear three men talking hear three white men talking about these issues the about these issues after the break. Im going to be joined after the break by the wonderful singer musician carol decker singer and musician carol decker from tpau for a chat about her life and career. See you in life and career. See you in a couple of minutes news radio. Welcome back to free speech nation. So. My first guest tonight is singer and musician whose career has spanned a long time, five decades. And it was although it was the five weeks spent at number one with her band taboo in 1987 that brought her global fame. Band taboo in 1987 that brought her global fame. And of course, her global fame. And of course, its the single china in your hand reaching number in hand reaching number1 in 7 countries. Please welcome carol decker,. Carol, i mean , decker, who. Carol, i mean, youve had such an amazing career. Youve written so many fantastic songs. This is the thing you, you know, thing about you, you know, people know you as singer people know you as a singer and performer, co wrote all performer, but you co wrote all of idid, performer, but you co wrote all of i did, yeah. And its not i did, yeah. And its not five decades. Im not ten years longer than madonna. Longer than madonna. Sorry. Four decades. No, sorry. Four decades. No, sorry. Four decades. Decades . Yes four decades . Yes four decades . Yes yes. Thats an important correction. Thats where the similarity ends. Have quite ends. We dont have quite the same career. Same bank account or career. Give time. Same bank account or career. Give time. Madonna right. Give it time. Madonna is on slide. Is on the slide. Yeah, an 80s, babe. Yeah, yeah, im an 80s, babe. Yeah, but shes got that knee problem. History. She does exactly history. Its madonna its over for madonna. Madonna but, you know, youve written so many incredible songs and people would interested would be interested to know about how. How were you inspired to do this . They probably dont know in your know that china in your hand is partly based on Mary Shelleys frankenstein. Yeah. Songwriting it is, yeah. So songwriting for me and for my mainly songwriting partner , rob rogers, songwriting partner, rob rogers, its quite eclectic. So we can get ideas from some chords and melody by heart and soul. Our first Big International hit was written because we got a keyboard with a sequencer in so you can program the notes and it plays on a loop. And ronnie programmed and da da da da da da da , which is the bassline to da, which is the bassline to heart and soul. And so we wrote that song around a new toy. And then i do love my tele and i do love a documentary. So so i was watching this fantastically informative documentary about frankenstein , and i didnt know frankenstein, and i didnt know that mary shelley well, she was married to Percy Bysshe Shelley and she was 19 when she wrote it. Yes. And it was this big pulp fiction hit and caused so much fracture in their sort of elite intellectual , their group elite intellectual, their group of friends. They fell out with the lord byron. It was, you know , there was lots of going on. And i thought, well, thats wheels within wheels. So the, wheels within wheels. So the, the thing with the whole thing with frankenstein , an where man frankenstein, an where man plays god and he creates. You god and he creates. Yes. You know , in his own image. And its know, in his own image. And its a terrible tragedy. Its a very a terrible tragedy. Its a very sad. Yes. And then within sad story. Yes. And then within that is all the trouble that story is all the trouble the book caused. So it the book caused. So it captivated me. And i wrote the song china in your hand, which is like fragility. Be careful what you wish for. Careful of your yeah. Be careful of your dreams and dreams becoming reality and everything happen. Dreams becoming reality and everyiand happen. Dreams becoming reality and everyiand interesting, n. Yeah. And its interesting, isnt ive isnt it, that, you know, ive been listening also to some of your songs your more recent songs and theyre just as good as the older and theres a real older songs and theres a real continuity in terms what you continuity in terms of what you do. Just some things do. And its just some things take point and some take off at some point and some things was things dont. Heart and soul was huge not so huge in america, but not so big here, huge in america, but not so big her no, was a huge flop here. No, it was a huge flop here. And was. Thanks to the and it was. Thanks to the American Public and the billboard and the late billboard chart and the late great casey kasem, who seemed to wear a christmas sweater every great casey kasem, who seemed to wea of christmas sweater every great casey kasem, who seemed to wea of the istmas sweater every great casey kasem, who seemed to wea of the year, s sweater every great casey kasem, who seemed to wea of the year, who eater every great casey kasem, who seemed to wea of the year, who pioneered day of the year, who pioneered us. Got rereleased in the us. And it got rereleased in the uk. Yes and it went to number four in the uk and then it went top five around europe and lots of other places as well. So we top five around europe and lots of oa|er places as well. So we top five around europe and lots of ca reprieve. As well. So we top five around europe and lots of ca reprieve. Butnell. So we top five around europe and lots of ca reprieve. But yeah,§o we top five around europe and lots of ca reprieve. But yeah, it we top five around europe and lots of ca reprieve. But yeah, it was got a reprieve. But yeah, it was the label over here were not happy and their record happy and their brutal record companies, youre out if you dont make them their money back straight got straight away. So we got a reprieve then got to have reprieve and then got to have but when started power but when you started to power did expect it to become as did you expect it to become as big did . No, not not big as it did . No, not not really. I dont know what i really. I dont know what i expected entirely. All i wanted was i wanted to have a single out. Yes and then i wanted to be on top of the pops because thats who doesnt. Yeah, that was we all was the show that we all watched. Was watched. And it was multigenerational. And there was. There wasnt choice multigenerational. And there was. was; wasnt choice multigenerational. And there was. was there . T choice multigenerational. And there was. was there . There choice multigenerational. And there was. was there . There wasyice multigenerational. And there was. was there . There was just then, was there . There was just that so its like that one big show. So its like box that box. Tick box box tick that box. Tick that box. Then china in your. And then when china in your hand off like a rocket, it hand took off like a rocket, it opened so many doors for us. And then lots of boxes were ticked. We sold out wembley , we sold out we sold out wembley, we sold out the nec. I was we sold out wembley, we sold out the nec. I was on all the big festivals. I was flying all over the world meeting the great and the world meeting the great and the good. We did the Princes Trust concerts, me and diana like that. This is a true story. Like that. This is a true story. We were doing a photo call after a Princes Trust and the photographer said the corniest thing. He said, everybody say cheese. And i was next to her cheese. And i was next to her standing on a box because we were about four foot difference in height and she went to me. She said, say, you get a sexier smile. Yeah thats fantastic and smile. Yeah thats fantastic and super fun. Yeah. And all of this happens very quickly and you suddenly become big, suddenly become famous. You famous. And of course, you werent that. Know, famous. And of course, you werewas that. Know, famous. And of course, you werewas a that. Know, famous. And of course, you werewas a wholehat. Know, famous. And of course, you werewas a wholehat. Different this was a whole new, different world. Did find it . World. How did you find it . Loved it. I took to it like i loved it. I took to it like a water. You know, its. A duck to water. You know, its. Its what i wanted. I wanted to its what i wanted. I wanted to be successful and i wanted to be famous. I didnt know to what degree it would go , so i got degree it would go, so i got used to it very, very quickly. Used to it very, very quickly. See, i know some of the bands struggled bit, particularly struggled a bit, particularly ronnie rogers, who was my partner at the time. Hes quite a reserved guy and he found a lot of the attention , quite a lot of the attention, quite a strain. Oh, hes hes much more strain. Oh, hes hes much more of a proper creative musician was i was going to be a star. I was i was going to be a star. I was ready for my close up. Hes not a diva. Hes not a diva. No, hes not a diva. No, hes not a diva. No. No. And so and it was hard on the rest of the band. A lot of them were married at one point. We were married at one point. We were on the road for 17 months straight. Marriages straight. All those marriages all went really well. Youre all went really well. Youre away from home in our business, the more successful you get, the more youre away home. More youre away from home. Yeah, hear its really. Yeah, you hear about the on about the stress on the on famous theyre out famous people when theyre out on the road. Oh, find comfort. Oh, they can find comfort. Oh, theres always someone in the fonnard. Okay ready to come fonnard. Okay lets not get too many details on that. But, you know, we should definitely a of you definitely see a clip of you performing , if thats all right, performing, if thats all right, carol. I weve carol. I think weve got something lined up. Lets have a look. Close to body to do the look. Close to body to do the triangle here, tom moore is to hard because they make all true and she cant better you dont know what you might have said one more say yes. Gerry moynihan one more say yes. Gerry moynihan. Absolutely fantastic. Absolutely fantastic. Oh that is wonderful. And oh that is wonderful. And thats i mean, it really suits thats i mean, it really suits that big kind of song. Having a full orchestra that was last year, wasnt it . Having a full orchestra that wasthat year, wasnt it . Having a full orchestra that wasthat was, wasnt it . Having a full orchestra that wasthat was probably t . Having a full orchestra that wasthat was probably a couple of that was probably a couple of years ago. But ive done that show last year so that that same orchestra, north, show last year so that that same orchnarea, north, show last year so that that same orchnare big north, show last year so that that same orchnare big shout north, show last year so that that same orchnare big shout out north, show last year so that that same orchnare big shout out to north, show last year so that that same orchnare big shout out to opera. Who are big shout out to opera north are fantastic. And cliff north are fantastic. And cliff masterson, our conductor there. Masterson, our conductor there. And obviously back in and yes, well obviously back in the day we used synthetic strings and that was they were born in the 80s, those big jupiter eight keyboards and the amazing sounds. You couldnt amazing sounds. You couldnt tell it wasnt an orchestra, to be honest, but with that be honest, but to play with that calibre of musician. I do a lot of orchestral shows now. I did a huge tour across germany last december with a 60 piece orchestra tingles up the back of my neck every night. Theyre just epic and its such a privilege to work with. But you do like the drama, dont you . Just i dont mean that in terms of the style of song writing as well. I mean, you have you have there is actually a big range of styles and things. You know, a song like soul destruction, very different that very different to that kind of very poppy different to that kind of very p0ppy but different to that kind of very poppy. But also poppy. Yeah, but but you also have ballads have the big ballads and it feels like you really let yourself when to yourself go when it comes to those do. Those sorts of i do. Lot of those songs and a lot of those songs i have to give ronnie his credit because ronnie loves hymns, right . And his dad used to play the organ. So you know, all those massive chord. I im always ripping hymns off really didnt realise they were the source of inspiration. No, just that. No, just that. That kind of style. Yeah. Yeah. I that kind of style. Yeah. Yeah. I dont. I dont want to get sued. By god. That kind of style. Chord style. The magnificent chord progressions. And for me, my progressions. And for me, my parents record collection, my father in particular for all the divas, Barbra Streisand , shirley divas, Barbra Streisand, shirley bassey, ella fitzgerald, dinah washington. So i was raised on big voices and big hair. Yeah. So big voices. Big voices and big hair. Yeah. So big voices. Big hair. Its so big voices. Big hair. Its a great motto. A great motto. And, you know, those those sort of shows youre doing all the time now. And theyre big stadiums theres stadiums now. And theres something very interesting about the rewind the they call it the rewind festival where festival, for instance, where theres from the theres various bands from the 80s and 90s coming together and theyre popular, arent they . Absolutely massive. And the absolutely massive. And the original rewind is in henley on thames. Thats i think , thames. Thats now, i think, 40,000 yeah. And its a 40,000 strong. Yeah. And its a huge festival and theres other brands as well that do a similar thing. And its fantastic thing. And its fantastic because i do four songs and then im back at the bar. Oh, yes, of course. Because youre sharing the. Yeah and the audience get the hits. So its like its like a compilation album on the stage. So theres no fillers, no boring bits. Of course. Of course. Of course. You got any gossip about all the old 80s stars . You know what i havent. You know what i havent. Its going to be boring. If youd have me back in the youd have asked me back in the top were all top of the pops day, we were all ready each other. But ready to about each other. But now all hail now were all. Its all hail fellow that fellow well met. Were all that much weve all much older, and weve all survived in a very tricky business. So its usually a glass of wine. And how you doing . And ill. Ill see you at the next one. Because bump into . And ill. Ill see you at the next otheriecause bump into . And ill. Ill see you at the next otheriecathe bump into . And ill. Ill see you at the next otheriecathe time. Jmp into . And ill. Ill see you at the next otheriecathe time. Its, into each other all the time. Its, you were all on these you know, were all on these different were different festivals and were always working all always working together all the time. Always working together all the tim its great in terms the its great in terms of the whole process career. What whole process and career. What do you prefer . Do you prefer getting the studio and getting in the studio and crafting the songs, putting it all it things all together, or is it things like out in like that . Just being out in front audience . Front of the audience . Of both. I love its a combo of both. I love making a song work and its still fascinates me. 40 years after i wrote my first song, listening to some crumb of an idea build and get created and get layered and all the rest of it but when i do a gig like that one, you just showed, its just epic. Its and i cant believe all these years later, im im still doing it. Youre still doing it. But you must get the audiences are a big part of it, arent yes big part of it, arent they. Yes in what they give to in terms of what they give to you as a performer as well. Yeah. Gn fin en well, i barely have to sing china hand because china in your hand because everybody sings at you, you know . Sometimes if i get know . So and sometimes if i get the wrong, do. The lyrics wrong, i do. Does that happen . Does that happen . Does that happen . I do, you put something i do, yeah. You put something from the second verse into the first and people will first verse and people will write to and say, why . Why write to me and say, why . Why did there . Did you sing that line there . Theyre like, really . Theyre like, really . Great that but its really great that you perform to but its really great that you huge perform to but its really great that you huge audiences to but its really great that you huge audiences because such huge audiences because a lot of people dont get to do that. No. And musicians, lets be dont a deal be honest, dont get a good deal out digital world, out of out of the digital world, out of spotify, those of we spotify, out of those sort of we dont know the top 2 that can call the shots. The rest of us mere mortals stream is decimated. Yes, our royalty income. And you know , royalty income. And you know, dont get out your tiny violin and all the rest of it. Lots and all the rest of it. But lots of musicians, theyre not of musicians, its theyre not making of money. Im lucky making a lot of money. Im lucky to have some hits in the 80s to have had some hits in the 80s that generate that still generate something for grateful for for me. And im grateful for that. But a lot of it emerging musicians, theyre not earning any so the Record Company any money. So the Record Company will get it. And the platform will get it. And the platform will they get the will get it and they get the crumbs its right. And crumbs and its not right. And were for our were always lobbying for our fair share. Thats all want. Fair share. Thats all we want. Our share. Our fair share. Also, know, as well, also, you know, as artists, this artists, youve put all this into then , you know, into it and then, you know, you deserve rewarded for it. Deserve to be rewarded for it. Absolutely. Of people absolutely. Now, a lot of people watching will be wondering how they are they can see you, but you are performing all time. So how performing all the time. So how will you how will people able will you how will people be able to and go and see your to find you and go and see your shows . Shows weve got the shows . This shows weve got the website which is dewbs co,. Co. Uk. And then theres facebook is too powerful slash carol decker, and still on x, but im and im still on x, but im thinking of coming off it because i get pulled into arguments and i get into trouble. Oh, dont all stop . Oh, dont we all stop . Oh, dont we all stop . And then instagram, you can find. And if you want to come find me. And if you want to come and see us or if you want to avoid us, you can find out where we are. Yeah carol, its been a pleasure talking carol decker, talking to you. Carol decker, everyone. And coming up next on everyone. And coming up next on free speech nation, are we living in a computer simulation . Living in a computer simulation . Im going to be joined by a physicist who claims he has new evidence that were simply characters an advanced characters in an advanced version world. You will not want to miss that. See you in to miss that. See you in a moment. And youre listening to gb news radio. Radio. Welcome back to free speech nafion. Welcome back to free speech nation. Later in the show, ill nation. Later in the show, ill be turning agony uncle with the help of my panel, steve allen and nick dixon to help you deal with your unfiltered dilemmas. With your unfiltered dilemmas. So if youve got any problems at all, us all, just email us at gbviews gbnews. Uk. Com all, just email us at gbviews gbnews. Uk. Corn and well gbviews gbnews. Uk. Corn and well do our best to answer all of your problems. So many of you will familiar with will be familiar with the blockbuster the blockbuster movie franchise the matrix. Protagonist , matrix. The films protagonist, neo, played keanu reeves, neo, played by keanu reeves, discovers were living in a simulated reality hundreds of years from now. But what if it was true . Melvin vopson is an associate professor in physics at the university of portsmouth, and he claims we may be characters an advanced characters in an advanced virtual world. Delighted to virtual world. Im delighted to say. He joins me now. Welcome to the and this is your book, the show. And this is your book, melvin. This is reality reloaded , the scientific case for a simulated universe. Reality reloaded. Is that a reference to matrix reloaded , by any chance . Matrix reloaded, by any chance . Kind of , yes. Kind of, yes. Kind of, yes. So this is truly fascinating research. What i really did is to discover a new law of physics i call this the second law of information dynamics. And this is in analogy to something that we already know called the second law of thermodynamics. Second law of thermodynamics. And this tells us how everything evolves in the. Universe to the evolves in the. Universe to the highest disorder and the Lowest Energy state and the physical system and the entire universe tends to evolve into a specific way. In fact , actually, i can way. In fact, actually, i can demonstrate this. I thought about this. I have a magical liquid here. Okay its called red wine , so im just going to red wine, so im just going to put a bit of red wine into this glass of water and what you are going to see there , you are going to see there, you are going to see there, you are going to see firsthand how ill show the audience how the physical entropy works. Essentially, the two liquids mix mix up each other and they will reach an equilibrium state where for the maximum disorder is achieved and all the molecules are equally mixed into a pinkish colour and this is the highest entropy we can bad wine at this point. Its exactly its undrinkable. So this is we can actually put a number on this. We can measure it, calculate it. We can measure it, calculate it. The entropy of my kids bedroom approach is infinite. If the level of disorder. But what i discovered, i discovered that if you examine the entropy of information states not physical entropy, just information states it goes exactly in opposite direction to the physical entropy. So instead of what boltzmann tells us, it should increase over time. Yes, the information entropy decreases over time. Now , why would that signify now, why would that signify that none of this is real . Its a very good question to answer that, i need to explain what is information entropy. So this do we have time to one paragraph . Im done. Lets see. Lets see. So in 1941, shannon claude shannon, an american mathematician, he gave us the information theory and essentially he gave us the unit of digital data and the unit of a bit, okay . And he gave us a formula for the information entropy formula that gives us the most , most entropy formula that gives us the most, most optimal, optimal, compressed way of transmitting data or storing data if you want, in a nutshell, and i found that the universe does this in everything , and so the universe everything, and so the universe follows this same pattern or this same law that are applied to computational processes and optimised and compression of data. Okay, so why would the universe do that unless we its a giant computer or maybe we live in a simulation. But, but okay, so i suppose the counterpoint to that might be speaking someone who be im speaking to someone who knows this, knows nothing about any of this, but to try anyway. If but im going to try anyway. If youre detecting the youre detecting that the Natural World follows these laws and that are and patterns that are reminiscent of the way that Computers Work and Computer Systems operate. But surely if systems operate. But surely if this is a world that is created by might oh, no, by computers, they might oh, no, im going to get in this. How does this work . Melvin like, could it not be this is just a fingerprint. This is just a supporting evidence. Im not saying we are in a simulation. All im saying is i discovered law. Yes, is i discovered a new law. Yes, its a mega addition to physics and to our tools to understand nature. So youve outlined it in this book . Nature. So youve outlined it in thisltsok . Nature. So youve outlined it in this itsoksthere . Its in there . Its in there . Yes. Okay. Yes. Okay. Do talk in the do you talk at all in the book how what would the book about how what would the ramifications be, though . I mean, if you say were mean, you know, if you say were in a simulation, thats good question. W m question. Is simulating us . Who runs simulation . Who runs the simulation . Who runs the simulation . The simulation hypothesis is a philosophical theory. Okay. So a philosophical theory. Okay. So im not doing philosophy. Im not even speculating who is doing this for what purpose, whats our role in the simulation . Thats not your all. Im looking is like a deep Scientific Evidence prove Scientific Evidence to prove or disprove yes so this is my interest. But can it ever be disproved . But can it ever be disproved . You know, the things because you know, the things that youre discovering as fascinating as they are, theyre never to going be confirmation fascinating as they are, theyre nethis, going be confirmation fascinating as they are, theyre nethis, are ing be confirmation fascinating as they are, theyre nethis, are they . E confirmation fascinating as they are, theyre nethis, are they . Unlessnation fascinating as they are, theyre nethis, are they . Unless we on of this, are they . Unless we wake in the amniotic wake up covered in the amniotic fluid pole in the back of fluid with a pole in the back of our head, then well know to you, everyone here and you, me and everyone here and everyone else. It will make difference it will make no difference whether we or not in a whether we are or not in a simulation thats the reason simulation and thats the reason is we dont a reference is we dont have a reference frame distinguish whats real is we dont have a reference frarrwhats stinguish whats real is we dont have a reference frarrwhats notguish whats real is we dont have a reference frarrwhats not real. Whats real is we dont have a reference frarrwhats not real. So ats real is we dont have a reference frarrwhats not real. So letseal and whats not real. So lets lets it lets make it clear so it wouldnt make difference. Wouldnt make any difference. The make is the only difference will make is in deep Scientific Investigations and understanding the physics and how the world works. Okay, so you need to look for if we lets assume we live in a simulation. For if we lets assume we live in a simulation. Okay, so what in a simulation. Okay, so what doesit in a simulation. Okay, so what does it mean . It means there is a program or a code running the universe. Okay. So that implies a program and implies a lot of information that makes this possible. Yes so to prove that we are in a simulation , you need we are in a simulation, you need to find one of the two things. Either you find the information that makes this possible, all the variables, code itself the variables, the code itself and everything, a proof of and everything, or a proof of the code. Think i found the code. And i think i found the code. And i think i found the proof of the code through the proof of the code through the law of information dynamics. So the codes that. So the codes that. Okay, but codes that are okay, but the codes that are computed, the sort of systems that detecting are that you are detecting are similar nature. The similar to that in nature. The codes that are in our Computer Systems, just nature systems, its not just in nature , even in dna rna. , even in dna and rna. So this discovery is actually so remarkable. It challenges dannins evolution theory. I discovered that genomes are mutating, not randomly , as is mutating, not randomly, as is the consensus today. I discovered they are mutating in a way that always the information entropy reduces. So information entropy reduces. So even leaving organisms are following this rule that permeates the entire universe and transcends physics, biology , and transcends physics, biology, cosmology, everything. Atomic physics. So it looks like there physics. So it looks like there is a optimisation mechanism built into the fabric of the universe. Okay, to optimise the Data Processing the computational process and does it trouble you at all . Well, you know, when dannin discovered his theory, he hated it. He was hated. I hate it as well. I was not looking for the matrix. I was just investigating the information entropy and time information entropy and the time evolution in various diverse systems. And that is a almost an systems. And that is a almost an accidental conclusion of my research. But its not. I was not looking for that. Well, you know, youve baffled me. Im honest. But i. I wonder what the audience think about it. Do the audience just by a show of hands, how many of you think we are living in a computer right . Computer simulation . None right . Youre going to have a lot of work to do, melvin, but. Well, by my book. Well, by my book. But you have book. But you have got a book. And the is called the book is called reality reloaded for reloaded the scientific case for a simulated universe. Good luck with read it with it, melvin. I will read it because fascinated, but because im fascinated, but i dont pretend to understand any of thank okay thanks, of it. Thank you. Okay thanks, melvin. And next on free speech melvin. And next on free speech nation, its our regular dive into the arts and culture. Im going to be joined by historian and dave oldroyd bolt. Do and writer dave oldroyd bolt. Do not go anywhere. Thanks thats lovely. Thank you so welcome back to free speech nation. So its time for our regular look at the latest news from the world of culture and the arts. And here to join me the arts. And here to join me once again, its the broadcaster the arts. And here to join me onceauthor. Its the broadcaster the arts. And here to join me onceauthor. Its tioldroyd aster the arts. And here to join me onceauthor. Its tioldroyd boltr the arts. And here to join me onceauthor. Its tioldroyd bolt. And author David Oldroyd bolt. Hello, david. As usual, thank you for coming back, as usual. You have a few stories up your sleeve relating to the world of arts and culture. What would you like to start with . Well, lets by saying well, lets start by saying happy france list. Happy birthday france list. Everyone was thinking that. Everyone was thinking that. Its on yes, i know its on everybodys the pub everybodys tongues in the pub at nobody could at lunchtime and nobody could talk of else. France talk of anything else. France list was born this in list was born on this day in 1811. Of you 1811. And for those of you who are memory are having a slight memory blank, the great blank, he was the great hunganan blank, he was the great hungarian composer, the first real star of music before real rock star of music before list. There had been celebrated musicians, list was the musicians, but list was the first to travel around the then known world. He went from america to russia, and right down all around europe, women would take locks of his hair. They would take his cigar butts. They would take his cigar butts. They would take his cigar butts. They would swoon over him and catch gloves. That he would catch his gloves. That he would throw into the audience. And the suffix was coined for suffix o mania was coined for list list mania. So he is the tom jones of his day. He was my delight. Im sorry. I shouldnt say that well get cancelled. We probably will and list i say, this wonderful list as i say, this wonderful pianist and on wednesday night at the Queen Elizabeth hall at the royal Festival Hall in london, wonderful english london, the wonderful english pianist. There arent too many of those of this level. Benjamin grosvenor, very young grosvenor, who is a very young man. First public man. He first came to public attention the age of ten when attention at the age of ten when he won the bbc. Musician he won the bbc. Young musician of the year. So, he was of the year. So, yes, he was extraordinary a recital extraordinary and gave a recital that was entirely in the key of b minor, might sound odd , b minor, which might sound odd, but course of the but over the course of the evening , of course, the music evening, of course, the music goes through different yes goes through different keys. Yes the was this the centrepiece of this was this great in minor, the centrepiece of this was this great was in minor, the centrepiece of this was this great was written in minor, the centrepiece of this was this great was written , n minor, the centrepiece of this was this great was written , whichinor, the centrepiece of this was this great was written , which people which was written, which people probably know. Im sure they will. It is one of the monumental pieces in the piano literature. It was dedicated to robert schumann, although roberts disliked it roberts wife, clara disliked it intensely, view just intensely, which in my view just makes better piece of music makes it a better piece of music. Written and premiered. It was written and premiered in 1854, an extraordinary work, and ben proceeded this with a modern work by sophia gulbenkian , who i say modern. It was post Second World War and finished it with chopins third sonata in b minor, opus 58. It was a marvellous recital and i think lovely to see a young think its lovely to see a young pianist really daring to perform in a somewhat Old Fashioned way. Yeah, hes not straight down the line terribly earnest. He takes liberties with tempo that people dont nowadays take. It harks back to a much earlier performance tradition, which is in fact in the performance tradition of that period of music. So that was lovely to hear you when say about hear when you when you say about lists mean, lists popularity, i mean, people think of that of people think of that kind of mania associated with mania as being associated with very much our age. Presley, the beatles, elvis presley, that thing. But if you the beatles, elvis presley, that back, thing. But if you the beatles, elvis presley, that back, you ng. But if you the beatles, elvis presley, that back, you know, ut if you the beatles, elvis presley, that back, you know, richardson , look back, you know, richardson, when richardson and when richardson wrote pamela and clarissa , he was the equivalent clarissa, he was the equivalent of like the Jurassic Park of his day. Sort of merch day. There was sort of merch dies were writing dies and people were writing letters to him saying dont kill her all sorts stuff. Her off. And all sorts of stuff. But about list but what is it about list particularly that generated that kind of, suppose fever . Kind of, i suppose fever . Well, he was incredibly good looking. Was tall, he was looking. He was tall, he was slim, he was handsome. Had slim, he was handsome. He had a great aura. And he great charisma and aura. And he was self publicist. Was a very good self publicist. So everywhere he went, you could buy lockets with picture. Buy lockets with his picture. You busts , you could you could buy busts, you could buy sheet music and this was buy his sheet music and this was a time, of course, when everybody considered or everybody who considered him or herself the herself educated would learn the piano every piano. The piano is in every house, so it was that equivalent of a a real miniature, of of a of a real miniature, of a fever rock star. And hed fever of a rock star. And hed taken paganini did on the taken what paganini did on the violin, which was technical violin, which was his technical brilliance fireworks brilliance, these fireworks and transported it onto the piano, wrote these extraordinary pieces, these paraphrases. He pieces, these paraphrases. He called them fantasies on opera arias, which were at that time, they the well pieces they were the well known pieces of yes you know, of music. Yes you know, everybody not an everybody its not an exaggeration, i think, to say that humming them that everybody was humming them because would have heard because you would have heard them these them everywhere in these transcriptions. Made transcriptions. And he made spectacle out of music, which really was extraordinary for the time he invented the piano recital. All think now of the recital. We all think now of the pianist on stage with the piano side, audience. He was side, on to the audience. He was the do that. Side, on to the audience. He was the he do that. Side, on to the audience. He was the he was do that. Side, on to the audience. He was the he was a that. Side, on to the audience. He was the he was a showman. Was he was a showman. He was a brilliant showman. He was a showman. He was a brilliantthen man. He was a showman. He was a brilliantthen from the 1840s and then from the 1840s onwards, stopped it and took minor orders and became labourlist. He took minor catholic order. Should say, catholic order. I should say, and became very severe and withdrawn of really withdrawn and sort of really said, no, that was my young life and now i give my life to the church he gave his life to church and he gave his life to perform benefit of perform for the benefit of charity. But he had and this is the point of tonights story tonight, hes being performed in budapest. Only the second performance in europe anywhere. In fact, of the one act that survives of an opera by list at and this is thanks to a cambridge academic who went and found in the gerta archive in weimar this 152 page sketch really of sardanapalo now sardanapalus or sardanapalus is a poem by byron, which was dedicated to gerta who lived in weimar. So its a big weimar connection here about a terribly un pc thing, an assyrian king whose iron and slave girl falls in love with him and tells him hes got to defeat the dreadful rebels who are invading the kingdom. So its just what the people to people are to going love to heat people are to going love to hear. Absolutely. And sergianopoulos , in this act sergianopoulos, in this one act we of lists is an we have of lists is an incredibly intriguing piece because it shows that list was absolutely on top of what was then the predominant operatic theme that is the italian bel canto. But was bringing into it all own musical ideas. All of his own musical ideas. There was bit of wagner in there was a bit of wagner in there who became his son in law. There who became his son in law. There is lots of lists, own style of fireworks and his own harmonic idiom. He clearly harmonic idiom. He clearly understood what verdi was doing over the previous sort of ten years. But i think it really points out hadleys decided points out that hadleys decided to abjure entirely his pianistic idiom. He would have been idiom. He would have been a seriously brilliant opera composer, and its a great shame he pursue that. And he didnt pursue that. And youre thats only the youre saying thats only the second its been. Yes, it second time its been. Yes, it was performed at first in cologne has been cologne and now it has been given in budapest by Kirill Karabits, the first karabits, who gave the first performance. To performance. It was supposed to happenin performance. It was supposed to happen in budapest years happen in budapest two years ago, which would have been the 210th anniversary of his birth. But because of covid, it didnt. Yes. So its happening tonight as the list as the culmination of the list festival. Budapest of course, is the capital city of hungary. List was hungarian ethnically and his most and wrote probably his most famous pieces to the general public. Rhapsodies public. The hungarian rhapsodies , or there a great , or when there was a great flood budapest. , or when there was a great flood budapest. He , or when there was a great flood budapest. He gave flood in budapest. He gave a concert raised the money concert which raised the money to redo all the damage and build the bridge. He was an extra ordinary giver to charity and those of you who want to hear it, youtube and it, you can go on youtube and search sergianopoulos list. Search for sergianopoulos list. Kirill karabits there is the Kirill Karabits and there is the recording the first recording from the first performance. Its a most wonderful piece. Its only 15 minutes long because just the first act, i think it shows minutes long because just the first. List i think it shows minutes long because just the first. List could hink it shows minutes long because just the first. List could haveit shows minutes long because just the first. List could have become. And what list could have become. And for music and for those who love his music and want hear something want to hear something different, its there. And for those who love 19th century opera, a really intriguing thing. So definitely worth checking out. Yeah. Youve also got another that you wanted to another story that you wanted to cover yes. Whats another story that you wanted to cove all yes. Whats another story that you wanted to cove all about . Yes. Whats another story that you wanted to cov this about . Yes. Whats another story that you wanted to cov this about . Third s. Whats another story that you wanted to covthisabout . Third annuals this is the third annual series Roger Scruton series of sir Roger Scruton memorial sure memorial lectures. Im sure Everybody Knows that Roger Scruton a Great British scruton was a Great British philosopher, died in 2020, just before the covid pandemic hit, and before his death was cancelled horribly after he was produced by the new statesman for he was accused of having said that, all Chinese People were alike. And there was no difference between them. They were automatons. This was a quote taken out of context entirely. The new statesman later apologised, but he was saying the opposite , wasnt he . Saying the opposite, wasnt he . Was saying that the he was saying that the chinese treated them Chinese Government treated them that way exactly. Was cut to make it but he was cut up to make it seem had said this to seem like he had said this to and eternal shame. And its, i hope, eternal shame. The conservative party binned him commission on which him from the commission on which he then sat the building back. He then sat the building back. Beautiful commission, conservative leapt to conservative mps leapt to condemn him and he was treated in the most appalling way. Now, just before died of cancer, just before he died of cancer, he redeemed. But it was a he was redeemed. But it was a very way to treat great very poor way to treat a great pubuc very poor way to treat a great Public Servant and a great pubuc Public Servant and a great public now, for public intellectual. Now, for the two these three the past two years, these three years now, these lectures have happened. Years now, these lectures have happened. Douglas murray began happened. Douglas murray began last week, on monday, talking about the and legacy of sir about the life and legacy of sir Roger Scruton and that ended with kevin spacey , who your with kevin spacey, who your views, im sure will remember , views, im sure will remember, was not guilty of the was found not guilty of the things which was accused things of which he was accused reading soliloquy from reading the great soliloquy from timon athens. Yes. You timon of athens. Yes. Which you as a shakespeare scholar will know complains all know where he complains of all the turned against know where he complains of all the yeah, turned against know where he complains of all the yeah, very turned against know where he complains of all the yeah, very apt. |rned against know where he complains of all the yeah, very apt. Yes, against him. Yeah, very apt. Yes, indeed. Then we indeed. And then we had alexander speaking Alexander Stoddart speaking about iconoclasm and why people pull down statues. Tomorrow pull down statues. Yes. Tomorrow night lionel the night, lionel shriver, the spectator columnist and novelist, speaks about what the effect is on culture when people wish to cancel. And then finally on wednesday night, peter thiel, who was a founder of paypal , who was a founder of paypal, early investor in facebook, early investor in facebook, early investor in spacex, will talk about the diversity myth and is this still happening at the sheldonian . This is at the sheldonian. This is at the sheldonian. Free to attend. Its free to attend. It begins. At 5 30 on monday and begins. At 5 30 on monday and wednesday and goes on until about 7 00. And i really , really about 7 00. And i really, really recommend that all of you who can get there do. And its great that they are talking about these issues relating and relating to cancellation and ostracisation et cetera. But of course, scruton wrote about so much well, scruton much more. Yes well, scruton was the polymath. The great polymath. There is nobody in post war british intellectual life to compare with him. He was a composer. He was aesthetician composer. He was an aesthetician an he novelist, published an he was a novelist, published novelist. He wrote of politics. Novelist. He wrote of politics. He wrote of history. He wrote of culture. Wine. Culture. He wrote of wine. He wrote pretty much anything wrote of pretty much anything that you could turn your mind to. Roger some point or to. Roger at some point or another did so. And think his another did so. And i think his resurrection post mortem , i resurrection post mortem, i think its apt to remember those lines of tennyson, though much has gone much yet abide that which we are. We are one equal temper of Heroic Hearts made weak by time and fate , but weak by time and fate, but strong in will to strive to seek, to find and not to yield. Seek, to find and not to yield. Because roger never yielded even at the end when he was cancelled , he never yielded. Well, thats a great note to end david, robert, thanks end on. David, robert, thanks very indeed. Thats all very much indeed. Thats all weve got time for. Dont but join us because theres a lot more now to come between now 9 00. Between now and 9 00. Moment. See you in a moment. See you in a moment. Welcome to your hello there. Welcome to your latest weather forecast. Latest gb news weather forecast. Im snell. Well, looking im craig snell. Well, looking ahead , for most of ahead to tonight, for most of us, should largely dry , us, it should be largely dry, but turn quite but its going to turn quite chilly. See some icy chilly. Could even see some icy patches across the north. Thats chilly. Could even see some icy pat down rcross the north. Thats chilly. Could even see some icy pat down to ss the north. Thats chilly. Could even see some icy patdown to this1e north. Thats chilly. Could even see some icy patdown to this ridgeth. Thats chilly. Could even see some icy pat down to this ridge of thats chilly. Could even see some icy patdown to this ridge of high. s all down to this ridge of high pressure, which is just building in time, settling in for a brief time, settling the weather down, albeit very briefly. As you can see, this next area of low pressure just waiting out in the atlantic. So as we end sunday, most of us will on a largely dry and will end on a largely dry and clear note. Still the risk of a few showers western few showers across some western parts, under the clear parts, but under the clear skies, especially across parts of north of of scotland, the far north of england, we could just see a few icy stretches. So just aware icy stretches. So just be aware if out and about and if you are out and about and just take a little extra just take a little bit extra time on your journeys. So as we start morning, most us start monday morning, most of us starts bright starts off on a fairly bright note. Few mist and fog note. A few mist and fog patches, thing, patches, possibly first thing, but for most of us its going to be a largely dry and bright day risk of some rain times for risk of some rain at times for northern ireland, maybe the far west of wales, South West England time england too. And all the time the best of sunshine really the best of the sunshine really up across parts scotland. And up across parts of scotland. And for temperatures is for most of us, temperatures is throughout very similar throughout the day, very similar to seen over the to what weve seen over the weekend into tuesday. A very different for a large part different day for a large part of the uk. Rather cloudy with of the uk. Rather cloudy with some of rain. Some of some outbreaks of rain. Some of that rain could potentially be fairly eastern that rain could potentially be fairly of eastern that rain could potentially be fairly of england eastern that rain could potentially be fairly of england. Eastern that rain could potentially be fairly of england. Thetern that rain could potentially be fairly of england. The best of parts of england. The best of sunshine into the afternoon, down towards southwest england and actually part of and actually a good part of scotland largely dry. Scotland staying largely dry. But that really sets us up for an unsettled part of the an unsettled middle part of the week. Temperatures generally around average. Around average. Who is it . Were here for the show , for energy this time. Show, for energy this time. Welcome to the dinosaur hour. Welcome to the dinosaur hour. I was married to a therapist and you survived. I thought we were getting hugh laurie, second best. My bellys de man. You interviewed Saddam Hussein . Interviewed Saddam Hussein . Whats that like . I was terrified. Im playing strip poker with these three. Oh, no , poker with these three. Oh, no, thank you. My cds need to be put in alphabetical order. Oh are you going to be problematic again . Going to be problematic again . The dinosaur hour sunday, the 29th of october at 9 00 on gb news. And theres plenty more still to come on free speech nation this week. But lets get a news update first from lisa hartle. Update first from lisa hartle. Im lisa hartle. Here are the latest headlines. Gaza has been hit by a fresh wave of airstrikes. A number of wave of airstrikes. A number of explosions have been seen after israel issued a warning to residents to leave the area. Residents to leave the area. Leaflets were dropped in the north of the strip, saying if they stayed there , life was in they stayed there, life was in danger and there may be identified terrorist identified as terrorist sympathisers. Earlier, Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu told troops the war against hamas is do or die for his country. Troops the war against hamas is do or die for his country. A do or die for his country. A second convoy carrying humanitaria aid had to abort a delivery into gaza. Earlier, witnesses say they heard a blast and the sound of ambulance was near the rafah crossing. Yes today, 20 trucks delivered suppues today, 20 trucks delivered supplies to the strip after the border with egypt was opened for the first time in two weeks. As in london, an israel solidarity rally was held earlier in trafalgar square. The bring them trafalgar square. The bring them home protest, called for the release of all hostages being held by hamas. The Israel Defence forces now says there are 218 people being detained in gaza. Are 218 people being detained in gaza. The earlier a man was gaza. The earlier a man was arrested for allegedly shouting anti semitic abuse from a car driving past it comes after days of pro palestinian protests and claims some people have been inciting violence. Immigration inciting violence. Immigration minister Robert Jenrick says the accusations are being taken seriously. Ive written to all chief chief constables across the country saying that they should refer individuals that come to their attention to the home office. There is a Legal Process office. There is a Legal Process to be followed, but as and when we receive those, we will consider them. And if they meet the legal bar, then we will absolutely revoke and expel them. And the first case is already under consideration in in other news, to danger to life. Weather warnings have been issued in england in the wake of storm babet severe flood alerts are in place around the river idle near retford in nottinghamshire, which is expected to reach record levels. The number of people whove died dunng the number of people whove died during the storm has risen to four after police found the body of 83 year old Maureen Gilbert in chesterfield , manchester in chesterfield, Manchester United has opened a book of condolence at old trafford following the death of sir bobby charlton. The legendary charlton. The legendary footballer was a key member of englands World Cup Winning Team. In 1966, floral tributes and football shirts are being placed outside the Manchester United stadium with his former club saying hell always be remembered as a giant of the game. This is gb remembered as a giant of the game. This is gb news across remembered as a giant of the game. This is gb news across the game. This is gb news across the uk , on tv, on Digital Radio and uk, on tv, on Digital Radio and on your Smart Speaker by saying play gb news now its back to free speech nation. Free speech nation. Welcome back to free speech nation. With me, andrew doyle. Lets get some more questions from our lovely studio audience. Our first question is from amolo. First question is from amolo. Hiya hello. Insults are now hello. Insults are now illegal in switzerland. Well yeah, you might be right about this. That sounds made up, but its true. Theres a writer whos been sent, sentenced to 60 days in jail for referring to a journalist as a fat lesbian. Journalist as a fat lesbian. Now, lots of lgbt plus groups apparently very happy about this. Im not very happy about this. I mean, i you know, i get called a lot worse on a daily basis. Its not all about me, but i get called exactly that sometimes. I have been called that. I have been called that. So you know, why cant you know whats going on . Well, the big question is, was lesbian . Because was she a fat lesbian . Because if was , then isnt that just if she was, then isnt that just factual . We need to bmi factual . We need to see a bmi and need to know what her and we need to know what her habits are. The thing is the thing is, Louis Schaffer has called me fat both and off called me fat both on and off screen. Beard was screen. He said my beard was unattractive. Send louis unattractive. Can i send Louis Schaffer no and do schaffer to prison . No and do you good lawyers . You know any good lawyers . Because like to do that. Because i would like to do that. So, i mean, but its just so, i mean, but maybe its just a thing that youre not a swiss thing that youre not allowed to in switzerland, allowed to just in switzerland, but you but like you say. But thing i think she but the thing is, i think she was a fat lesbian. Yes am i going to go prison now going to go to prison now for saying thats what saying i think thats what she actually technically was. Lesbian part of that and the lesbian part of that description the insulting bit. Well, neither is fat. Well, neither is fat. No, but some people might mean it in a a mean way. Yes mean it in a in a mean way. Yes you say mean way, you can say it in a mean way, but activists, its use the but fat activists, its use the word a as positive word as a as a positive term. Maybe just trying so maybe he was just trying to her up a bit. So maybe he was just trying to her up a bit. I should to build her up a bit. I should have been his defence lawyer that arguments did awful lot that arguments did an awful lot of , hasnt it, of gymnastics, hasnt it, to turn around. Turn that around. I meant in nice way. But i meant it in a nice way. He a bit of a stretch. No, i get that because, you know, gay used to be a playground insult the way you say youre say it, if you say, oh, youre gay, not insulting. Oh, gay, thats not insulting. Oh, youre but youre gay. Thats clearly. But either shouldnt to either way, you shouldnt go to pnson either way, you shouldnt go to prison for it. Thats true. Its my view thats true. Youre if it is an youre right. If it is an insult. Are other youre right. If it is an insult. As are other youre right. If it is an insult. As well. Are other youre right. If it is an insult. As well. I are other youre right. If it is an insult. As well. I think re other youre right. If it is an insult. As well. I think re thezr things as well. I think in the article he was saying he called article he was saying he called a thats isnt it . Deranged is worse. Deranged is worse. We paying so why arent we paying attention we attention to that . I think we might end up having the battle in wrong area. In the wrong area. This is the yeah, but this is the question. These of question. With all these sort of speech speech speech laws, hate speech laws coming and coming in across europe and no one really knows what hate means. It means. Everyones defining it differently. Really means. Everyones defining it differen me, really means. Everyones defining it differen me, nick, really means. Everyones defining it differen me, nick, re. You worries me, nick, because, you know, ireland. Know, its happening in ireland. Its scotland. Its happening in scotland. When you come these laws and you come in with these laws and you come in with these laws and you how to define you dont know how to define it, this thing happens. You dont know how to define it, this get thing happens. You dont know how to define it, this get caught1appens. You dont know how to define it, this get caught in pens. You dont know how to define it, this get caught in theis. You dont know how to define it, this get caught in the net, people get caught in the net, you know . Yeah, well, im against laws, period against hate speech laws, period , america because. Yeah, hate subjective. And yeah, hate is subjective. And this new thing where its if you feel it was hateful , then you feel it was hateful, then you can essentially send to jail can essentially send me to jail because like that. Because you just felt like that. But i control your but how can i control your subjective feelings . Ive tried. You have tried. Thats the key thing, nick, because again , as this because again and again, as this legislation emerges, theres a book by paul coleman called censored, all of the censored, which takes all of the hate speech legislation presents it can see for it in a book so you can see for yourself. Across europe, it in a book so you can see for yoursiare across europe, it in a book so you can see for yoursiare all across europe, it in a book so you can see for yoursiare all lean. ;s europe, it in a book so you can see for yoursiare all lean. Forurope, it in a book so you can see for yoursiare all lean. For ajpe, it in a book so you can see for yoursiare all lean. For a start. There are all lean. For a start. They cant agree on what the definition is, but all of the various governments, of various governments, a lot of them, leaning this them, are leaning towards this idea of perception. So if i perceive something offensive, perceive something is offensive, it how do i it is hateful. But how do i know, you know, cant read know, you know, i cant read your not psychic. Im your mind. Im not psychic. Im not saying youre a hateful person, interpreted person, but if i interpreted something youd said as hateful, could i . Then call the police . No. And its. Its the only no. And its. Its the only category of crimes where we do that. No one asks, do you feel like you were burgled . Yeah, exactly. Yeah, exactly. You to go to so you have to go to objectively measure something for be real. Othennise, as for it to be real. Othennise, as you say, because 99 of Society Might be right when might actually be right when they i felt insulted and they say, i felt insulted and you were. But therell be some people just absolutely people who just absolutely get it still be it wrong, but theyd still be control ing the narrative of that crime. May be the case that and it may be the case that this guy this in order to this guy said this in order to be to nasty, be mean, in order to be nasty, and had effect. But and that it had that effect. But even then, i just dont think this be. Even then, i just dont think thisand, be. Even then, i just dont think thisand, bknow, you mentioned and, you know, you mentioned paul actually my he was actually on my podcast. Called current podcast. Its called the current thing. And he he was involved podcast. Its called the current thing. Case he he was involved podcast. Its called the current thing. Case of he was involved podcast. Its called the current thing. Case of paivi was involved podcast. Its called the current thing. Case of paivi rasanen,lved in the case of paivi rasanen, who has had multiple year hate who has had a multiple year hate speech for quoting the speech case for quoting the bible, just literally quoting the bible. But in the in the context of pride month. And so context of pride month. And so shes a multiple year shes been in a multiple year legal battle about this. So it sounds sounds sounds like to her it sounds like answer dont go to like the answer is dont go to sort countries sort of cold European Countries that are quite wealthy because switzerland and finland just sound gone even sound like theyve gone even more than of the west. Yeah, it is very and yeah, it is very worrying and we that under we might go that way under labour right . Labour government, right . Yeah. Dont vote laboun im allowed say that were im allowed to say that were not cycle, are we . If you like, but yeah, i dont think im allowed to say it that i can do balance if you want. Yeah. Vote labour. There you go. There you go. Gb news is the home of balance. Move on to another lets move on to another question from dominic. Wheres dominic . Dominic. I shirts dominic . Hi, dominic. I shirts and chinos. And chinos. Now the clothing of choice for yobs. Im glad you mentioned that. Im glad you mentioned that. Dominic Cardiff Students Union have banned chinos and blue shirts specifically blue shirts. And this is to do with apparently a lot of the more violent people in these various groups. They like to wear that groups. They like to wear that look. Its a sort of preppy look, i suppose chinos and blue button down shirt. But instead of banning the people who cause trouble what do, trouble, which is what i do, they banned the things that the people wearing. Yeah. Is people were wearing. Yeah. Is this going on . This whats going on . Well, its an attack on straight white men, andre, because who else would a because who else would wear a blue shirt chinos and so i blue shirt with chinos and so i feel personally. We feel attacked personally. We were this story on were doing this story on headlines. Literally headlines. I was literally wearing the wearing a blue shirt at the time. Steve. So both time. So was steve. So we both took very, personally. Took it very, very personally. Is everything on this channel is planned. Was planned. Yeah, this was this was about about rugby. About this was about rugby. Freshers in cardiff. So all freshers in cardiff. So all of those things are far more likely to lead to violence than a shirt. Being a rugby in a blue shirt. Being a rugby in a rugby team, a fresher and in cardiff lets break down cardiff so lets break this down because there are there are these who are violent. These people who are violent. Trouble. Theyve caused trouble. Right. The things right. If you ban the things they they can just wear they wear, they can just wear Something Else still commit Something Else and still commit the same violence. And just a flaw in the plan. Yeah. Get through the system. Yeah yeah, exactly. Thought it they just havent thought it through, have they . Love mentality of like, i love the mentality of like, we made we probably could have made world a lot shorter world war ii a lot shorter if only have those only we would have changed those uniforms. It the uniforms. Exactly. It was the hat that did it. If you hugo boss, the if you ban hugo boss, the wont win. Interesting i travel back in time and just change the fashion. Yeah, thats it. Is mad, though, isnt it . I mean, yeah, youre right that it doesnt achieve anything unless these dont work out that these people dont work out that they different outfits, they can wear different outfits, in which theyre stupid. In which case theyre so stupid. To pass theyre not going to pass that okay weve got maybe. Okay weve got a question now from daniel. Where is hi, daniel. Annie is daniel . Hi, daniel. Hi, annie. Before. The. Youve been here before. The pair of you choose patrick pins. Pair of you choose patrick pins. Yes, until it becomes illegal. So youre the comedy twins that to my show . Something that come to my show . Something like whats like this . Yeah. Whats your question . This question . Whos asking it this time . Okay. Okay. Should writers stay in the lanes . Should they stay their should they stay in their lanes . Was to do with lanes . Okay. This was to do with an , an article. An article, not an article. It was interview. Wasnt was an interview. No, it wasnt even an interview. It was a talk that rushdie was given. A that Salman Rushdie was given. A salman great Salman Rushdie was the great novelist midnights novelist who wrote midnights children, novelist who wrote midnights childremany , many novels, all of many, many, many novels, all of which and adore. He which ive read. And adore. He is that hes worried is saying that hes worried about young writers being too uncertain about the thing to write about things that theyve not directly experienced. Its going to the old cultural going back to the old Cultural Appropriation debate , isnt it . Appropriation debate, isnt it . Its saying that, you know, theres a lot of activists who say that writers shouldnt write about , that about identity groups, that theyre of themselves. Theyre not part of themselves. And industry has and the Publishing Industry has what sensitivity what they call sensitivity readers to check that. If youve written about someone isnt. Written about someone who isnt. So novel about so if you wrote a novel about a black nick, they would black lesbian, nick, they would say, well, not a second say, well, youre not a second novel. Novel a novel. A second novel about a black lesbian. Novel. A second novel about a black lefirstn. Novel. A second novel about a black lefirst one was the best the first one was the best seller yet. Was a wonderful it was it was a wonderful piece work. It was it was a wonderful piece work. But but it was it was a wonderful piece work. But but nowadays piece of work. But but nowadays youd get a sensitivity reader looking at it, wouldnt you . Yeah. So this is yeah. So this is a complicated one. Firstly, its salman saying it now. Salman rushdie saying it now. You could be forgiven if Salman Rushdie a bit you could be forgiven if salman rush brave a bit you could be forgiven if salman rush brave with a bit you could be forgiven if salman rush brave with your a bit you could be forgiven if salman rush brave with your writing, more brave with your writing, you forgiven you could be forgiven for going. Im given went im not sure, given how it went for know how did for for you, you know how did for years then stabbed. Like, years then stabbed. Youre like, im want to be a im not sure if i want to be a part but the other part of that. But the other point making is point he was making is completely valid, which is if you your you cant write outside of your lived its over you cant write outside of your livethe its over you cant write outside of your livethe novel its over you cant write outside of your livethe novel its about for the novel because its about inhabiting experiences. For the novel because its about inhaonlyg experiences. For the novel because its about inhaonly novel experiences. For the novel because its about inhaonly novel left eriences. For the novel because its about inhaonly novel left would es. The only novel left would be the buildings. The only novel left would be the buildings. Roman andrew to buildings. Roman andrew just to throw reference. Throw in a literary reference. Good. German good. Thats a thats a german thing. Education novel. Good. Thats a thats a german th means education novel. Good. Thats a thats a german th means coming� ducation novel. Good. Thats a thats a german thmeans coming ofcation novel. Good. Thats a thats a german thmeans coming of agewn novel. Good. Thats a thats a german thmeans coming of age novelel. It means coming of age novel about yourself. The about yourself. So the only thing write thing you could write is autobiography. Autobiography. Exactly. Basically. And that is as samra is a problem isnt as samra rushdie. Has been rushdie. You know, he has been through and he knows what through it and he knows what hes about hes talking about here, about brave brave as a writer. Brave being brave as a writer. Not writers who are more brave. I would suggest thats true. And hes making and the point that hes making about, feel free to about, oh, no, feel free to write about something that youre brave youre not. Its hardly brave in comparison to his level of bravery. Yeah, hes bravery. Yeah, yeah, hes basically oh, just basically saying, oh, dont just you could also write about a gay character youre not gay. Character if youre not gay. Whereas hes done and been whereas what hes done and been through very different through is a very different story therell no story. Yes, therell be no science fiction. No, its an science fiction. No, its an entire genre based on things that dont actually exist. You cant have lived experience of being robot. Being a robot. This this comes now, this well, this comes from the idea of causing. From the idea of causing. Sorry, carry on. Sorry, carry on. This comes from labour. It comes from the idea of dont causing offence. Right . So people would say, well, you can write about aliens because auens write about aliens because aliens dont exist and therefore youre not to going them. Youre not to going offend them. But about gay but if you write about gay people and youre not gay, then you cause offence to those you might cause offence to those people. Who cares . Yeah, i just dont care if someone offends me, fine. But you also might cause you also might not. Cause offence. Yeah. You do offence. Yeah. And if you do cause offence people should cause offence then people should say offensive and a say thats offensive and have a discussion argument discussion and an argument about that. Exactly. That. Thats fine. Exactly. Yeah. Totally as if im yeah. So i totally as if im going to i agree with Salman Rushdie. Why . Look how good rushdie. Why . Look how good i am. Way more about this am. He knows way more about this than cant go than i do. But if you cant go outside then you will outside your lane, then you will lose lot of creativity, some outside your lane, then you will loswhicht of creativity, some outside your lane, then you will loswhicht of cr make , some outside your lane, then you will loswhicht of cr make , som errors. Of which might make some errors. And lived and people with a lived experience ill experience can go well. Ill tell you what wrong with tell you what was wrong with that. Would miss that. But you would miss out on so that created. So much that was created. Exactly. Do well, exactly. Writers do generally well, exactly. Writers do general if theyre writing about anyway if theyre writing about people groups places people or groups or places that they havent they they they havent been to, they they check its check to see first whether its authentic. I think actually authentic. And i think actually an or someone reading an editor or someone reading it and doesnt and saying, oh, that doesnt strike authentic. Strike me as authentic. Thats a legitimate criticism and something that a good writer will on but someone will take on board. But someone saying offensive, saying, i find that offensive, therefore you must remove it from book that i think is abominable. Its theres obviously its but theres obviously a philistinism at the heart of the woke movement or whatever you want art. Woke movement or whatever you wan all art. Woke movement or whatever you wanall about art. Woke movement or whatever you wan all about activism art. Woke movement or whatever you wanall about activism. Art. Woke movement or whatever you wan all about activism. Its its all about activism. Its inherently anti art. The only positive i can is that the positive i can find is that the novel basically over anyway novel is basically over anyway because read because no one can read past about two tweets then they about two tweets and then they lose, tick tock has lose, you know, tick tock has ruined peoples brains anyway. Lose, you know, tick tock has rui who eoples brains anyway. Lose, you know, tick tock has rui who e right . Jrains anyway. Lose, you know, tick tock has rui who e right . Youre anyway. Lose, you know, tick tock has rui who e right . Youre not yay. So who is right . Youre not writing i love so who is right . Youre not writnovel i love so who is right . Youre not writnovel as i love so who is right . Youre not writnovel as well. I love so who is right . Youre not writnovel as well. But i love so who is right . Youre not writnovel as well. But who nve so who is right . Youre not writnovel as well. But who is the novel as well. But who is who sort of who is writing sort of significant michel significant novels . Michel welbeck around. Hes welbeck is still around. Hes probably the most jm coetzee, but there really . But who else is there really . Yes , theres Kazuo Ishiguro yes, theres not many. Not many, because a not many, because its not a significant art anymore. Significant art form anymore. And the and people have talked about the death of the novel for years and years. But now years. Yeah. And, but now it does relevant anymore . Does it seem relevant anymore . Im well, my thing, if im reading if i want to read reading a new if i want to read a choose a novel a novel, i always choose a novel that before was that was published before i was born. Guarantees born. And that guarantees a certain quality. Yes, certain degree of quality. Yes, it way to do honestly, it is a way to do it honestly, because the novel because you poisoned the novel when. Because you poisoned the novel wh you. Because you poisoned the novel wh you because its old . You mean because its old . You mean because its old . To be good because its going to be good because its old. Going be its old. So its going to be good. Do. I do mean that. Good. And i do. I do mean that. I think thats really good tip i think thats a really good tip because writing because theyre just writing used wont used to be better. It wont be long not allowed long until youre not allowed to do your do a tweet unless its your lived experience. Well, lived experience. Yeah well, its going to be slippery its going to be a slippery slope people. Very slope for a lot of people. Very much weve got final much so. Okay weve got a final question comes question now. This one comes from emma . Hello. From emma. Where is emma . Hello. Hi. Secret learnt hi. How victorias secret learnt their. Their lesson. Oh, yeah. Oh, yeah. This is. Actually so this is. And actually theres cases like theres been a few cases like this, was victorias this, but this was victorias secret. Lingerie brand , secret. Its a lingerie brand, apparently, and i dont know about this stuff. And basically they decided to employ new models plus size models, transgender models, sort of, i suppose , models that would tick suppose, models that would tick certain boxes that werent necessarily beautiful. Necessarily beautiful. Yeah, i like the way you havent even heard of it because not really within lived not really within your lived experience, but experience, is it not . But speaking but look, speaking of that. But look, andy, the point the fact is the reality want reality is people want to see attractive people. This is why im tv. All right. Thats my im on tv. All right. Thats my biggest tonight, which is biggest laugh tonight, which is i insulting people want to i find insulting people want to see attractive people. Thats its aspirational. And thats its aspirational. And thats the point of it. They came out with incredible with this incredible quote, victorias secret. They said they were trying to do both. Basically, all basically, theyve been all inclusive. Hasnt worked out. Inclusive. It hasnt worked out. Theyve theyve theyve tanked. Theyve lost lots theyre lots of money. Now theyre retreating and they retreating back to sexy and they came with this with came out with this with this line sexiness can inclusive. Line sexiness can be inclusive. Its calm. Really, it cant its so calm. Really, it cant at all. Hey, babe , come and at all. Hey, babe, come back and well marginalised well talk about marginalised groups. All groups. It doesnt happen. All right. The devil wears right. Look at the devil wears prada. Supposed prada. Its supposed to be the most sort of, you know, elitist possible industry. Thats the point. Point of it. Well, a bit like well, its a bit like athleticism, know , if i say athleticism, you know, if i say that you should not allow. You should play the should let me play for the England Rugby even though England Rugby team, even though i rugby and i have no i cant play rugby and i have no muscle strength whatsoever because i want to do it and i will be offended if you dont let me. Surely there are some jobs that are just off limits, right . Well, i dont think thats well, i dont think thats exactly because well, i dont think thats exanjob because well, i dont think thats exanjob of because well, i dont think thats exanjob of the because well, i dont think thats exanjob of the model because well, i dont think thats exanjob of the model , because well, i dont think thats exanjob of the model , theyre e the job of the model, theyre not performing to see the not performing to see whos the most they are most attractive. They are selling their selling through their attractiveness. You could attractiveness. And you could make you make the argument, oh, you should more of a should show people more of a realistic array of body types. Realistic array of body types. But thats not what is that . Different because people have different sexual you should sexual tastes. So you should just cater for everyone. Is that what you mean . Well, no. Think thats the i mean, i think thats the idea behind it. But in reality, theres one part of your theres often one part of your life thats not quite as balanced and right on and all the rest of it. And thats the sex part. You can spend all of your being most your life being the most fair person, but theres that bit of your brain actually quite your brain that actually quite likes the idea of being either dominated dominated. Dominated or dominated. Youre revealing a lot. Youre revealing a lot. Youre revealing a lot. Yes. Hang on, hang on. Look if i were prince william, i would. Its fine. Sometimes you would. Its fine. Sometimes you just want to feel like youre not the person. All im saying is that Lewis Schaefer , hes not is that Lewis Schaefer, hes not available today , so i thought available today, so i thought id shave this up. No, this is the one area where i can understand why they have to go back is you just back to sexy is that you just revert to the oh, i like sexy. But the point is, advertising is fantasy, is supposed to be a fantasy, right . If youre selling new is supposed to be a fantasy, right orf youre selling new is supposed to be a fantasy, right or jaguar� selling new is supposed to be a fantasy, right or jaguar� sewhatever new is supposed to be a fantasy, right or jaguar� sewhatever itew is supposed to be a fantasy, rigyoure|guar� sewhatever itew is supposed to be a fantasy, rig youre showing nhatever itew is supposed to be a fantasy, rigyoure showing itiatever itew is, youre showing it like driving around a kind of mountain with other Mountain Range with no other cars. Dont trapped cars. You dont show it. Trapped in traffic, right. In bank holiday traffic, right. Youre not youre not showing reality. Youre not youre not showing realitjit the case that is it not the case that beauty standards do change over time . Absolutely time . And they absolutely do. They do. You they do. They absolutely do. You know, while the know, for a while we had the fashion of the anorexic fashion for sort of the anorexic look scrawny look very, very, very scrawny look. The look. But back in the renaissance more renaissance, theyre more voluptuous plump. No. Voluptuous and plump. No. Basically, all tests so basically, all tests basically show people agree roughly almost exactly who roughly on almost exactly who the attractive people its the attractive people are. Its not changed. Thats leftist not changed. Thats the leftist propaganda, which is exactly what you. What id expect from you. Well, anyway, next on okay. Well, anyway, next on free speech nation lawyer Dennis Kavanagh be to discuss kavanagh will be here to discuss the ministers expected the Prime Ministers expected u turn conversion u turn on a ban on conversion therapy. Dont go anywhere. News radio. Welcome back to free speech nafion. |f welcome back to free speech nation. If reports are to be nation. If reports are to be believed, rishi sunak is set to roll back on plans for a ban on lgbt conversion therapy after more than 40 tory mps signed a letter demanding a u turn. The Prime Minister is said to be willing to no longer include legislation to ban the practise in the kings speech next month. Theres a lot to unpack here, so joining discuss is joining me to discuss it is barrister and director at gay mens kavanagh. Mens network, Dennis Kavanagh. Welcome back, dennis. First thing to ask is what do they mean by conversion therapy . Well all this is pure onnell. These bans are in place all over the planet and principally theyre directed towards the field of paediatric medicine, believe it or not. And thats not what people will think of when you mention gay conversion therapy. Were talking about therapy. But were talking about therapy. But were talking about the trans conversion therapy bit. Its being conflated, though, hasnt it . Thats correct. So when think conversion when you think of gay conversion therapy back the therapy, you think back in the 60s, putting electrodes 60s, people putting electrodes on try and cure them. On gay men to try and cure them. And agree that and obviously, we all agree that thats and needs thats horrific and it needs to be banned. Do. Yeah i certainly do. Yeah i certainly do. Yeah but its not going yeah. And but its not going on much. On all that much. Not happening at all no, its not happening at all in country. Thankfully we in this country. Thankfully we could have done with the gay conversion ban about conversion therapy ban about 50 years so were legislating years ago. So were legislating over a problem that doesnt exist so far as gay conversion therapy is concerned in terms of therapy is concerned in terms of the conversion the so called trans conversion therapy, found no therapy, the government found no evidence of this at all when they university they went to Coventry University for study on this, we asked for a study on this, we asked them what it is. We asked them what a ban would look like. And im afraid what we know from looking around the planet is what do what they really want to do is they want expose they want to expose paediatricians to the risk of prosecution when theyre treating children who are in explosive numbers , presenting explosive numbers, presenting with gender incongruence 5,000 increase in females. Well, girls, little girls at the tavistock between 2003 and 2013. So what the trans activists want is they want a situation where a doctor is forced to accept the self diagnosis of a child, right . Yes. Thats a problem, isnt yes. Thats a problem, isnt it . Because, i mean, Hannah Barnes book on this subject, time to think, that there time to think, found that there were all of other issues were all sorts of other issues going with Young Children who going on with Young Children who who say they are gender dysphoric or experiencing symptoms of such such as autism, domestic violence, abuse, all sorts of other things that require a therapy interrogation. Well, of course , you should well, of course, you should mention Hannah Barnes. I have some statistics from her book here. To here. Over 70 of referrals to gids had more than five associated features of co morbidities, abuse, depression , even self harm, depression, even self harm, suicide 35 were on the autistic spectrum, compared to 2 in the population, 42 of referrals had lost a parent through death or separation. 25. Thats a quarter had spent some time in care. These are alarming statistics. This is this is a medical scandal of global proportions. This is why dr. Hilary cass, in her interim review on this matter, has said, look, this this the affirmation approach. So thats the approach that this lot wants. And they want to enforce with their conversion therapy ban. She said that that is causing tremendous harm in effect and it should be replaced east with a multidisciplinary model where talking therapies are employed, where you know, doctors try to get to the bottom of this. Because, look, this is of this. Because, look, this is the only field of medicine, isnt it, where actavis guests are saying someone involved in psychotherapeutic. Psychotherapeutic interrogation. And i remind everyone of little children, confused little children, confused little children, vulnerable kids, autistic kids, kids, kids. According to the tavistock, 80 and 90 are same sex attracted. So its mainly gay kids. Thats who were talking about. Yes, but but the activists would say that when a child says im in the wrong body, that you must automatically believe them. And if you dont and if you try about those other try and talk about those other potential issues that could have led that feeling, youre led to that feeling, youre effectively convert effectively trying to convert them from true trans them away from their true trans identity. Thats the idea, isnt it . Well , thats what they say, well, thats what they say, but we can. Lets look well, thats what they say, buthis we can. Lets look well, thats what they say, buthis seriouslye can. Lets look well, thats what they say, buthis seriously. Can. Lets look well, thats what they say, buthis seriously. And lets look well, thats what they say, buthis seriously. And ass look at this seriously. And as adults, if you leave these children alone. All right. If you employ whats called watchful waiting or normal exploratory therapy , because exploratory therapy, because thats what you normally do as a psychic tiatrist Something Like 90 of those children born will desist from their trans identification during puberty. Thats right. Puberty is the cure. And look , the more and cure. And look, the more and more i look at this debate, the more i look at this debate, the more and more i form the conclusion puberty is a human right. And want to talk right. And if we want to talk about the real conversion therapy going on in this therapy thats going on in this country and around the planet, it is gay conversion therapy by genden it is gay conversion therapy by gender. Dr. David bell said in 2018 of the tavistock there are homophobic parents here. Matt bristow, one of the psychotherapists there, said it feels like a new form of gay conversion therapy. Sonya appleby the safeguarding lead said you cannot discuss the safeguarding issue of homophobia are either coming from families or internalised homophobia. And its not just staff at the tavistock. Dr. Hilary cass, in her interim report, said , we her interim report, said, we have spoken to lesbians young lesbians. These are kids, remember , who felt under remember, who felt under pressure to adopt a trans identification because lesbians felt they were at the bottom of the heap that is modern gay conversion therapy. What is conversion therapy. What is going in the gender medicine business . So people are going to find that very confusing because effectively what youre saying that very confusing because ef that yely what youre saying that very confusing because efthat toy what youre saying that very confusing because efthat to opposevoure saying that very confusing because ef that to oppose trans saying that very confusing because ef that to oppose trans sorry,j is that to oppose trans sorry, to promote, sorry to oppose trans conversion therapy is a form of gay conversion therapy. I told you it was pure onnell i well, thats the problem. You know, its difficult even to get your head around it. So is the problem when it to the problem when it comes to the government with government getting involved with these that they just these things that they just dont understand , that the dont understand, that the language in fact, blinded language has, in fact, blinded well intentioned people to a grotesque evil that could be taking place . Absolutely. Im sure thats right. Theres one thing that the other side gender are right. Theres one thing that the cat. side gender are right. Theres one thing that the oat. Itse gender are right. Theres one thing that the oat. Its language der are right. Theres one thing that the oat. Its language games. We good at. Its language games. We see time and see this all the time and debates are often framed in ways that sound agreeable, that sound nice. Wants gay nice. Nobody wants gay conversion therapy. No one wants anybody subject to what anybody to be subject to what is, in effect, a form of modern torture. Thats not what torture. But thats not what this. So youve look this is. So youve got to look at this with some nuance. What this is, is threat criminal this is, is a threat of criminal prosecution a therapist doing prosecution to a therapist doing their job, to a therapist, prosecution to a therapist doing theirjob, to a therapist, doing their job, to a therapist, doing heard as hakim doctor as hakim or showed just the other week. He calls the affirmation only approach a form of grooming , approach a form of grooming, form of reassuring a child that the trans gender identity theyve adopted is a good thing for them, that they should stick with. This is about concretising identities in very young people at a time when their experiment. And thats a key point, isnt it . Talking about it . Were talking about children, it children, you know, when it comes adults should comes to adults should be able to with to do whatever they want with their cetera. Their bodies. Et cetera. But when talking when were talking about children to simply say, children in just to simply say, yes, diagnosis is yes, a childs self diagnosis is what persist with and what we must persist with and put on drugs which lead to put them on drugs which lead to cross sex hormones almost all cross sex hormones in almost all cases can lead to cases which can lead to irreversible surgery. I mean, the ramifications are the ramifications here are extremely serious. There tragic. Theres a case in North Carolina today of a young lesbian whos now suing all the various gender doctors who shes been involved with. Shes had a double mastectomy. Shes had a double mastectomy. Shes had a double mastectomy. She has Serious Mental Health problems rest her she has Serious Mental Health prob youve rest her she has Serious Mental Health probyouve interviewed her life. Youve interviewed numerous transitioners here who tell exactly the same story, whos the price for these whos paying the price for these luxury beliefs that you can change your sex, which as a matter of science, you just cant. Whos paying the price . Its vulnerable. Children who its vulnerable. Children who are price for this. Are paying the price for this. And now we are in the era of lawsuits because as youve pointed out, this isnt just therapy. These arent just small decisions. Puberty blockers will lead in most cases to problems with bone density density. God knows what they do to brain maturation. Cross sex hormones maturation. Cross sex hormones will render children infertile. These are serious issues, and its important to point out that the cass review has said that we just dont have enough evidence about the long term effects of puberty about the long term effects of puberdoesnt and there it doesnt exist and there are long term studies. Are no long term studies. Right. What well, thats right. What dr. Hilary there hilary cass said was there was no evidential no safe no evidential there was no safe evidential basis for the prescription blockers prescription of puberty blockers , and they should no longer be prescribed matter prescribed as a matter of routine. Someone dug into routine. Now, someone dug into the cass data and professor kathleen stokes looked at it this week. And the data this week. And once the data were disaggregated, found were disaggregated, they found actually puberty blocker actually the puberty blocker cohort, 70 had neutral to negative Mental Health effects. So these drugs are either doing nothing for part of the cohort or theyre actively hurting them. At the end of the day, its experiment. An its an experiment. Its an experiment on kids. Dennis kavanagh, thanks so much for me. Much for joining me. And coming up next on free speech nation, my interview with the american conservative author Christopher Rufo on his new book called americas cultural revolution. Revolution. See you shortly. Listening to gb news radio. Listening to gb news radio. Welcome back to free speech nafion welcome back to free speech nation with me andrew doyle. Now this week i had the pleasure of sitting down with writer christopher f rufo. We discussed his brand new book, americas cultural revolution how the radical left conquered everything and what the path could be for a conservative counter. Lets take a look. Counter. Lets take a look. Well, the premise of the book is tracing the radical lefts long march through the institutions from 1968 to that summer of 2020, which was erupted in riots all over the United States. And i tell this story through the through the profiles of Herbert Marcuse, angela davis, Paulo Ferreira and derrick bell. These are the pivotal figures in critical theory, starting from the philosophical underpinnings by Herbert Marcuse to the neo marxist philosopher all the way to derrick bell, who was the mentor and really the father figure for Critical Race Theory in the late 80s and early 90s. And so it was a long patient blitz through americas institutions for many years. It happened really under the radar. The public was not aware of what was happening, but in that summer of 2020, i think it was clear to just about everyone something has radically shifted in our institutions. This book in our institutions. This book explains exactly what happened and exactly why the world felt so different in the last few years. Years. Well, lets start with the third section of your book, which is about Paulo Ferreira, whos the marxist thinker, and you make a very convincing case that his views on education have really now taken hold and now dominate in education, that being the idea that education really learning how really isnt about learning how to read and write so much as about awaking critical consciousness. In other words, making kids woke, in other words, turning kids into activists. Is that where we are currently at at the moment . Yeah thats right. You know, Paulo Ferreira, whos not really a household name, is a huge name in academia. Paulo fair is the third most cited author in all of the social sciences. His work of the social sciences. His work has had a profound influence on graduate schools of education, which assigned his book pedagogy of the oppressed, almost as a big text for k through 12 teachers. And its very simple. He believes that all education should be about awakening the revolutionary consciousness of students and then turning them again past an oppressive society. In our case the United States. But more broadly , any states. But more broadly, any kind of third world or first world eurocentric , colonising world eurocentric, colonising populations. And we saw just populations. And we saw just this week the results of this ideology. You had academics, professors and students cheering on the butchery of innocent people in israel , false ideology people in israel, false ideology , justifying it as a effort of decolonisation and so its not just theory anymore. Other just theory anymore. Other people are putting it into practise in the third world and would love to put it to practise in our countries as well. So well, as you as you mentioned in the book, Paulo Ferreira did actually say that revolutionary violence was an act of love, that was the phrase that he used to it. But we that was the phrase that he used to it. But we are that was the phrase that he used to it. But we are now to describe it. But we are now in position children are in a position where children are being indoctrinated, i suppose, rather. But of being indoctrinated, i suppose, rath points. But of being indoctrinated, i suppose, rath points you. But of being indoctrinated, i suppose, rathpoints you make. But of being indoctrinated, i suppose, rathpoints you make iniut of being indoctrinated, i suppose, rath points you make in the of being indoctrinated, i suppose, rathpoints you make in the book, the points you make in the book, which i think is very important, is kids be is that these kids may be turning proficient turning out to be proficient activists , but the data seems to activists, but the data seems to suggest it that theyre not particularly literate or numerate or any of the other things you might expect when numerate or any of the other thingleave might expect when numerate or any of the other thingleave schoolexpect when numerate or any of the other thingleave school. pect when they leave school. Yeah, i mean, thats right. And its a simple function of priority. You know, public priority. You know, Public Schools can only have one priority that displaces other priorities lower on the hierarchy. And so when you say that politics and active ism and revolution are the central principles of education, those basic Building Blocks of literacy , of mathematics, of literacy, of mathematics, of arithmetic , of history fall by arithmetic, of history fall by the wayside. Were seeing that the wayside. Were seeing that everywhere. And i think its really a cynical move. Its very hard to raise test scores, especially for the low performers in a large complex society like the United States. But its very easy to get people riled up in favour of revolution and favour of violence and favour of political activism. And so teachers hours, unfortunately, and many of the Largest School districts in the United States have abandoned the traditional goals of learning, of transmitting knowledge. Of transmitting knowledge. Theyve substituted it wholesale for blm, for democratic socialism, for decolonisation theory and other ideologies which make their job easier in the short term, even if ultimately theyre doing grave damage to our society. I wanted to ask you, you talk about the long march through the institutions, but to what extent do you think that this has been a planned, deliberate method . I mean, i know that the early architects of the idea of the long march through the institution were explicit in their aims. Institution were explicit in their aims. But has it institution were explicit in their aims. But has it really their aims. But has it really played out that way , or do you played out that way, or do you think that really this is kind of happened almost by accident . Combination of both. I its a combination of both. I think at the beginning it was a deliberate initiative. It was a plan. They had written about it in late 1960s and early in the late 1960s and early 19705. In the late 1960s and early 1970s. But as you go over the decades, as these early conquests start to be achieved , conquests start to be achieved, as they get academic departments in university , as as they get in university, as as they get departments in later years, then it starts to become a decentralised process where all of these ideas travel. Me medically, they travel through this process of osmosis, through through institutions. Its not a top down ideology anymore , top down ideology anymore, unfortunately. Its a complex , unfortunately. Its a complex, networked ideology that works through incentives, that works through incentives, that works through kind of copycat behaviour and so its a difficult challenge. Ive had difficult challenge. Ive had people say, well, chris, whos leading this . And we can maybe target that person or that organisation and we can be done with i wish it were so, but with it. I wish it were so, but unfortunately this is something thatis unfortunately this is something that is diffused through public life, diffused through institutions and for that reason as much harder to defeat because it has many nodes that are operating simultaneously. Operating simultaneously. I think thats such a key point because ive always wondered why a lot of the critical social justice activists will cite foucault and the postmodernists. They tend to not cite Herbert Marcuse for instance, even though his essay on repressive tolerance feels like a kind of blueprint for the way that activists behave today, that violence is acceptable when way that activists behave today, thcomesmce is acceptable when way that activists behave today, thcomes to e is acceptable when way that activists behave today, th comes to shutting ptable when way that activists behave today, thcomes to shutting down when way that activists behave today, thcomes to shutting down anyen it comes to shutting down any kind of right leaning thought. So almost though the so its almost as though the activists imbibed activists have imbibed these ideas without necessarily knowing where theyve got it from. That right . From. Is that right . Yeah, thats right. I mean, i think theyve boiled down now to slogans. Theres really no one slogans. Theres really no one on the left that is doing the complex theoretical work , like complex theoretical work, like Herbert Marcuse. Look, im not a fan of Herbert Marcuse, but if you read his books, you know that he was a serious thinker. He steeped in the he was steeped in the philosophical tradition of the west. And so but now we have something that is like ibram kendi, someone that deals in platitudes, someone that deals in slogans, someone that deals in slogans, someone that deals in very kind of simple level thinking. And so these people arent reading the sources of their own ideology. Theyre merely repeating what they see on the streets , what they see in on the streets, what they see in k through 12 classrooms, and what they from these second what they see from these second rate that have rate academics that have populated our universities. And populated our universities. And so in some ways , if you read the so in some ways, if you read the book, americas cultural revolution, you will know left wing ideology better than most of the people who are practising it today. It today. And this is really key. This is why i think people should definitely read the book is part of a lot of of the problem is a lot of people know what is people dont know what it is theyre mean, this theyre up against. I mean, this week we had the black lives matter chicago matter chapter in chicago posting in support of terrorist activity. And people seem activity. And people seem shocked by this. But of course, shocked by this. But of course, if you know about blm have if you know about what blm have written then written in the past, then you wouldnt shocked. It wouldnt be shocked. So is it really question of really just a question of informing people about what the aims of these activist groups really and how to sort of really are and how to sort of see through the linguistic tncks see through the linguistic tricks that they play . Tricks that they play . Yeah, thats right. Tricks that they play . Yeah, thats right. I mean, you know, activist groups in the modern period have done very sophisticated language work laundering their violent and decolonial ideologies through very anodyne and very warm, very friendly language. I mean, if friendly language. I mean, if you think about the words themselves , black lives matter. Themselves, black lives matter. Thats you know, a tautological. Thats you know, a tautological. Its something that no one could disagree with. But when you actually say, okay, well, we agree the premise, what do agree on the premise, what do you to see as practical you want to see as a practical output . They see output . They want to see violence , right . They want to violence, right . They want to see decolonial action. They want to see the seizure of wealth and redistribution of wealth along racial lines. They want to see the obliteration of the american constitution. Charleton and constitution. Charleton and so when you actually get specific and one of the key questions that i answer in the book, but i think is also essential for people at home to ask is what do they want . Ask that question over and over and over until you actually concrete answers. Actually get concrete answers. Its going to look very different the slogans that different than the slogans that youll are more media youll see that are more media friendly. Friendly. And for people to be alert to how present the activists are in our everyday lives, what we see as diversity, equity and inclusion departments or hr departments, these are actually mechanisms to deliver these ideas that you talk about in the book. I mean, you talk about how critical theory has effectively morphed into di, is right . Morphed into di, is that right . Yeah, thats right. And i think that the, the events of this week have really driven home this point apartments for now many years have gone into hysteric fits about microaggressions about about offences to African American hairstyles, about secret coded language that has some malign intent. I language that has some malign intent. I mean all of language that has some malign intent. I mean all of these language that has some malign intent. I mean all of these in a sense, trivialities draw these huge condemnations from officials. We had a perfect opportunity to show respect for, lets say, diversity and inclusion. Even when hamas inclusion. Even when hamas terrorist its attacked and butchered more than a thousand innocent israelis. And these innocent israelis. And these departments were silent for the most part. They didnt really statements. They didnt go into a kind of moral cause. They didnt hold lectures and events on campus to promote tolerance, to promote inclusion , to fight to promote inclusion, to fight an actual violent hatred. And so that really shows you that these are not institutions that actually promote what they say theyre promoting their institutions for the most part, that are practising a very hard left ideology using public funds, using public universities, not actually to promote any kind of inclusion in a human sense, but to promote left wing ideology under the guise of those very phrases. Guise of those very phrases. And we are running out of time. But since you mentioned higher education, i think thats a really key element to your bookis a really key element to your book is talking about not just how this these ideas have permeated society as a whole, but how really the engine of all of this is academia. What can be done about the groupthink in academia . You very, very clearly academia . You very, very clearly chart the way in which universities have effectively become echo chambers, where to have a more right leaning or conservative point of view makes you a kind of pariah. Conservative point of view makes you a kind of pariah. And we are you a kind of pariah. And we are at that situation now. So what do we do to kind of reinstall diversity of ideas of thought into the University System . Into the University System . Well, it very simple. You just need to do exactly that. You need to have administrations at universities that unapologetically bring in conservative voices , bring in conservative voices, bring in right leaning voices, bring in heterodox voices that have been systematically excluded from campus. Ive heard through the campus. Ive heard through the grapevine that you yourself might be coming to an American American College Campus in the near future to do some lecturing. These kind of initiatives are very important, and i think that we need administrators and trustees with the backbone to say if were going to have a Classical Liberal arts education, if were going to really be educating students, we need to have a wider variety than freire , angela than just paolo freire, angela davis and Herbert Marcuse. Davis and Herbert Marcuse. Absolutely. Christopher and id heard that rumour too. So ill look into that. Thanks so much for your time and congratulate us on the book. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And that was christopher f rufo. His book, americas cultural revolution, is available to buy right now. And next on free speech nation, emily blunt says sorry for calling someone anonymous 11 years ago. And a nun tackles a climate protester. Its almost time for social sensations. To go. Lets go back to with Timothy Andrew doyle. Well, its time for social sensations. Time for social sensations. Thats the part of the show where we at whats been where we look at whats been going week on social going viral this week on social media. First up, if you media. So first up, if you missed world missed the Rugby World Cup semi finals this weekend, dont worry, a video of a nun worry, heres a video of a nun rugby tackling a climate protester. No rugby tackling a climate protester. No. Thank you protester. No. Thank you. I dont know why that went viral. Dont know why that went viral. I went to a Convent School and i know that nuns are tough. I mean, they are there. You get tackled like that often for not bringing your vicious, vicious. You wouldnt believe the stories could tell. Do stories i could tell. What do you that, steve . You make of that, steve . Im just desperately trying to to get a pun to find out to how get to a pun about. Dirty habit, but about. Thats a dirty habit, but i cant think of how to it. I cant think of how to do it. I think i that. Think i did that. That sufficient. Yeah. That was sufficient. Yeah. Yeah. Any yeah. Nick, do you have any thoughts that thoughts of that on that video . Just why arent we well, just why arent we deploying nuns to with just deploying nuns to deal with just stop country so no stop oil in this country so no one them off the road. Stop oil in this country so no onejust them off the road. Stop oil in this country so no onejust need hem off the road. Stop oil in this country so no onejust need ton off the road. Stop oil in this country so no onejust need to deploy|e road. Stop oil in this country so no onejust need to deploy thewad. Stop oil in this country so no onejust need to deploy the rugby nuns. Exactly. Deploy the rugby nuns. Thats quite, quite the call to arms. So next up is this call to arms. So next up is this video that resurfaced online of the actor emily blunt. Emily blunt, who is being particularly blunt in this video. Lets have a look. The girl who was serving me was enormous. You know, i think she got freebie meals at chillis. Nothing wrong with that. Nothing wrong with that. And she comes out and she goes, ever you goes, did anyone ever tell you you like emily blunt . You look a lot like emily blunt . And thats it. Shes got in a lot of trouble for that. Whats going on there . Its actually not. Even less bad than that its even less bad than that because jonathan teed up, because Jonathan Ross teed up, teed it up said that theyre teed it up and said that theyre all america. And she all enormous in america. And she just the person just went, well, the person that served and then served me was enormous. And then she regretted it she probably, like regretted it in or. In her head or. So she introduce the word. No, no. And mhall no, no, no. And its just all it is, is an actor trying to be funny on a talk show, which we know yeah, know rarely goes well. Yeah, right. Make look right. I know. I make it look easy. She she. Easy. But what she does, she. She she. It so nothing. She she, she. It was so nothing. And say years ago and i just say its 11 years ago and this grovelling and shes issued this grovelling apology. Way, seems apology. By the way, this seems to no other kind of apology to be no other kind of apology in media days. Was to be no other kind of apology ingrovellingr days. Was to be no other kind of apology ingrovelling apology. Ays. Was a grovelling apology. Shes issued apology issued a grovelling apology saying, any hurt saying, im so sorry if any hurt was. Insanity clown was caused. Insanity clown world. Thats that is i mean, come on, steve. I even you must concede i mean, even you must concede , that is a bit , even me, that that is a bit much like. Yes. I mean, no offence would have been caused. Yes. I mean, no offence would hav no, yen caused. Yes. I mean, no offence would hav no, no caused. Yes. I mean, no offence would hav no, no onesed. Yes. I mean, no offence would hav no, no one cares. Yes. I mean, no offence would havthe no one cares. Yes. I mean, no offence would havthe person cares. Yes. I mean, no offence would havthe person shes talking the person shes talking about see that about probably didnt see that clip. Seen now clip. Might have seen it. Now you and made you mentioned it again and made it talking it go viral. And were talking about spreading the about it here. Spreading the upset. I have some sympathy upset. But i have some sympathy for emily blunt in this because shes hollywood and shes a hollywood actress and therefore everyone is enormous to her. Yes, because theyre small people. I must look like small people. I must look like a row of houses to her. Yeah. And thats the way think and thats the way i think she the devil she was in the devil wears prada. Whole time prada. They spend the whole time calling fat , even calling Anne Hathaway fat, even though incredibly though she was incredibly skinny. And the skinny. Right and the whole character character character was like a character calling and stuff. So calling people fat and stuff. So why not just it . Yeah, why not just own it . Yeah, absolutely. A girl, you cant absolutely. A girl, you cant get away with that, nick. You cant pull that off. What else was she in . Emily . I dont know is. Know who she is. Really. She was in the one with where have with her husband where they have to the they to be quiet. The reason they made that they couldnt made that film, they couldnt say because it say any words is because it stopped calling fat. Yeah. Yeah. Okay so yeah. Yeah. Okay well, so finally, we got this one. Has battered storm babet has battered britain this week, and a dog walker in mug. Beck in stirlingshire filmed an eerie scene in the forest of the wind lifting up the ground. Now, this has been seen more than 4 million times. So lets make it 4,000,001. And there you see the power of Mother Nature in all her ferocity. Its scary, right . Its also shows how stupid dogs are. Yeah its true that this is a patch of earth over there that looks like it might flip. Lets go and have a look. Yes, its got the vibe of a mans toupee in the wind, that is. Yeah except thats less harmful. Harmful. This. I mean, that looks apocalyptic to me. Yeah. I dont want to overdramatise slightly overdramatise, but i already did. Yeah what do you think . Am i being overdramatic . No it makes me think the earth is fake, know, you is fake, you know, like, you know, like some people say its flat. Going one further. I flat. Im going one further. I think fake. Did think its fake. Yeah did it look like. Like the truman show. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Been cobbled its just been cobbled together peter, and together on blue peter, and theyre oh, the earth together on blue peter, and they down. Oh, the earth back down. That harris . Yeah. In that guy, ed harris . Yeah. In his weird hat. Hes just going put earth back down. Thats put the earth back down. Thats whats the whats happening there. Yeah the earth there we go. You heard it here. You heard it here. Me to comment on earth. First me to comment on earth. Its impossible its almost impossible to say anything that. Anything of interest about that. An interview earlier, we had an interview with saying we lived in with a guy saying we lived in a simulation. Go. Simulation. There you go. So there is consistency. Theres almost this almost a dramatic arc to this episode free nation. I episode of free speech nation. I think. This is think about that now. This is the of the show where we the part of the show where we talk through all of your unfiltered and unfiltered dilemmas. And the first in from first dilemma has come in from stuart stewart, said, is it stuart stewart, who said, is it wrong that ive already got my Christmas Tree up . Yes, that is deeply evil. I think thats a kind of. What do you think . I think thats a kind of satanic thing to do. I dont want to overd ram atise. I overdramatise. I yeah, i think its a bad person. I wouldnt go all the i yeah, i think its a bad persto i wouldnt go all the i yeah, i think its a bad persto satanism. T go all the i yeah, i think its a bad persto satanism. Igo all the i yeah, i think its a bad persto satanism. I justll the i yeah, i think its a bad persto satanism. I just think way to satanism. I just think his friends him. But thats his friends hate him. But thats all hes going to be talking about. Why is doing it exactly . Why is he doing it exactly . You because clearly hes you know, because clearly hes making kind statement. Making some kind of statement. Look how christmas yeah. Oh, look how christmas im than everyone else im earlier than everyone else with so festive im earlier than everyone else with giving. So festive im earlier than everyone else withgiving. Oh so festive im earlier than everyone else withgiving. Oh i so festive im earlier than everyone else withgiving. Oh i betso festive im earlier than everyone else withgiving. Oh i bet his estive im earlier than everyone else withgiving. Oh i bet his gifts and giving. Oh i bet his gifts are terrible. I bet they are. And was i bet they are. And i was actually offended. Was in a actually offended. I was in a shop day and was shop the other day and i was selling cards selling christmas cards and tinsel. Anyone tinsel. And so anyone who buys tinsel. And so anyone who buys tinsel at this time of year should be throttled with it, shouldnt they at you know, they should at least halloween least be the rule of halloween and straight after halloween would for me. But would be too soon for me. But hey, to compromise. Hey, im willing to compromise. Offended am . Are you as offended as i am . Are you as offended as i am . No, no. Think christians no, no. I think christians are so up against it in this country. Have country. We should just have christmas year Christmas Trees up all year round. You. Expect round. Thank you. Didnt expect any agreement with that. I mean, i saying absolute i was just saying some absolute Lewis Schaefer nonsense to Lewis Schaefer esque nonsense to just give take and just give another take and immediately agreed with by just give another take and imncrowd. Ly agreed with by just give another take and imncrowd. So agreed with by just give another take and imncrowd. So yeah,reed with by just give another take and imncrowd. So yeah, sod with by just give another take and imncrowd. So yeah, so there by just give another take and imncrowd. So yeah, so there you just give another take and ierear d. So yeah, so there you just give another take and ierear round eah, so there you just give another take and ierear Round Christmas ere you go. Year round Christmas Trees. Have its because you have a magnetism charisma. They magnetism and charisma. They just to agree just feel they have to agree with much. With you so much. Jesus yeah, okay. Like jesus Christmas Trees. Yeah, okay. Like jesus chr sorry. Trees. Yeah, okay. Like jesus chr sorry. Christmas trees all sorry. Christmas trees all year round. Thats nick dixons solution. Weve got another dilemma here. This is coming from susie in bromley. Susie has said , im really tempted to come said, im really tempted to come and watch your show in person, but im wondering if you could guarantee a free gb news mug guarantee me a free gb news mug before i sign up. Well, weve had. Well, theres a noise from the audience there because theres been a few thefts of those. And i see this very those mugs. And i see this very much as you trying to case the joint susie , i dont trust her. Joint susie, i dont trust her. What do you think . No and can she cope with the heat . I dont mean in a metaphorical sense. Mean, metaphorical sense. I mean, its very in studio. Very hot in the studio. Is quite in the studio today. And actually and in the metaphorical. Take the heat . She cant take of live she cant take it of the live 10s. Your response, steve . You shouldnt allowed no, you shouldnt be allowed a audience a mug if youre an audience member, have to put a mug if youre an audience merwork have to put a mug if youre an audience merwork in have to put a mug if youre an audience merwork in and have to put a mug if youre an audience merwork in and gig have to put a mug if youre an audience merwork in and gig for|ve to put a mug if youre an audience merwork in and gig for aboutput a mug if youre an audience merwork in and gig for about 15t the work in and gig for about 15 years then on tv and have years and then be on tv and have that fail. And then under that career fail. And then under here. How can here. And thats how you can end up mug. Here. And thats how you can end up there nug. Here. And thats how you can end up there we|. Here. And thats how you can end up there we are. Thank you and there we are. Thank you so much forjoining us for and there we are. Thank you so much for joining us for free speech this the week so much for joining us for free speec the this the week so much for joining us for free speecthe met this the week so much for joining us for free speecthe met police the week so much for joining us for free speecthe met police turned week when the met police turned a blind jihad. Blind eye to calls for jihad. Cardiff banned Cardiff University banned a chinos and victorias secret realised that going woke wasnt such a good idea. Thank to such a good idea. Thank you to my nick dixon and steve my panel, nick dixon and Steve N Allen and to all of my guests this evening, carol decker, professor vopson, David Professor melvin vopson, David Oldroyd bolt, Dennis Kavanagh and Christopher Rufo. And if you want to join us live in the studio and be part of our wonderful dead wonderful audience, that is dead easy just to w dot easy to do, just go to w dot sro audience. Com. You can see the website on the screen right there. Come along. Stay tuned, there. Come along. Stay tuned, by the way, because mark dolan tonight coming next. Tonight is coming up next. And dont headliners the dont forget headliners the paper preview with paper preview show with comedians is on at 11 00. Thanks very much for watching free speech nation. We will see you next week. Next week. Hello there. Welcome to your latest news weather forecast. Im craig snell. Well, looking ahead to tonight , for most of ahead to tonight, for most of us, it should be largely dry , us, it should be largely dry, but its going to turn quite chilly. Could even see some icy patches across the north. Thats all down to this ridge of high pressure, which just building pressure, which is just building in time, settling in for a brief time, settling the weather down, albeit very briefly. As you can see, this next area of low pressure just waiting atlantic. So waiting out in the atlantic. So as sunday, most of us as we end sunday, most of us will end on a largely dry and clear note. Still the risk of a few showers some western few showers across some western parts, under the clear parts, but under the clear skies, especially parts skies, especially across parts of the far north of of scotland, the far north of england, we could just see a few icy. So be aware icy stretches. So just be aware if out and about and if you are out and about and just a little extra just take a little bit extra time journeys. So as we time on your journeys. So as we start monday morning, most of us starts off a fairly bright starts off on a fairly bright note, mist and patches note, a few mist and fog patches possibly first thing. But for most us its to be most of us its going to be a largely and bright day risk largely dry and bright day risk of some rain at times for northern maybe the far northern ireland. Maybe the far west wales, southwest england west of wales, southwest england too, and all the time the best of sunshine really across of the sunshine really up across parts scotland. And for most parts of scotland. And for most of temperatures throughout of us, temperatures throughout the similar to what the day very similar to what weve into weve seen over the weekend into tuesday. A very different day tuesday. A very different day for a large part of the uk. Rather cloudy with some outbreaks of rain. Some of that rain could potentially be fairly outbreaks of rain. Some of that rain c across tentially be fairly outbreaks of rain. Some of that rain c across easternv be fairly outbreaks of rain. Some of that rain c across eastern partsxirly outbreaks of rain. Some of that rain c across eastern parts ofy heavy across eastern parts of england. Best of sunshine into the afternoon, down towards southwest and actually a southwest england and actually a good part of scotland staying largely but that really largely dry. But that really sets us up for an unsettled middle part of week. Middle part of the week. Temperatures generally around average its coming up to 9 00 on television, on radio and online in the United Kingdom and across the world. This is mark dolan tonight in my big opinion, the biased bbc is supposed to bring us all together , but instead is us all together, but instead is leaving a nation divided the credibility of the state broadcaster is hanging by a thread. My mark meets guest is one of the most respected and influential figures in british politics. The honourable ian paisley mp in the big story following double by election defeat this week and a mammoth that swing to labour , is it time that swing to labour, is it time for the tories to throw in the towel and accept defeat or does rishi sunak have one last trick up his sleeve . Ill be asking up his sleeve . Ill be asking rock star politics professor Matthew Goodwin and tv entertainment legend and lifelong tory christopher biggins. It lifelong tory christopher biggins. It might take a ten. The halo has slipped for saint David Beckham as an alleged ex lover speaks out. Its time for goldenballs to spill the beans about his activities on and off the pitch. Hes been and off the pitch. Hes been such a naughty boy and im going to be naughty tonight. Naughty but nice to hours of big opinion, big debate and a bit of entertainment along the way