Transcripts For GBN The 20240704

Dead from the wildfires on the Hawaiian Island of maui. It is Hawaiian Island of maui. It is the deadliest us fire in more than a century. The deadliest us fire in more than a century. That the deadliest us fire in more than a century. That number, though, is expected to significant rise in the coming days as authorities continue the painstaking task of identifying the bodies. Search teams with the bodies. Search teams with sniffer dogs have been sifting through the remains of the historic resort town of lahaina. As of last night, just 3 of the search area had been covered. And Robert Kennedy jr, whose father and uncle were assassinated because of their political views, says his Family History hasnt discouraged him from attempting to run for the white house. His uncle, president john f kennedy, was assassinated in 1963, as was his father, robert, while running for the democratic president ial nomination in 1968. Robert kennedy jr is hoping to challenge joe biden to be the democratic candidate for the 2024 president ial election. 2024 president ial election. I, i think all of it, everybody in my family is aware of the risk. Of the risk. But, you know, i think, you know, life is filled with risks. So and i think once cheryl was convinced that that there was a path to victory and that i think she felt like , you know, because she felt like, you know, because ihave she felt like, you know, because i have a passion to do this, to solve some of these problems for our country. And im in a unique position to be able to do that, that she gave me the green light. Well, this is gb news across the uk, on tv, on Digital Radio and on your smart speaker. Thats it. Well be back with more in about half an hours time. But now its the Camilla Tominey show. Tominey show. Good morning and welcome to the Camilla Tominey show the only politics show being broadcast on british tv this morning. So dont go anywhere. Morning. So dont go anywhere. Sean, lovely to speak to you this morning. Obviously, the first question ive got for you in your capacity as former Northern Ireland secretary is to discuss this dreadful hack thats gone on with Police Service Northern Ireland, 10,000 officers details have been compromised. I mean, do we think that theres a question of Police Officers safety now being in danger because this . Sean in danger because of this . Sean there could be. And the short answer , keir mather, is we dont answer, keir mather, is we dont really know. And following a request for freedom of information, a terrible error was made in the Police Service of Northern Ireland. Adding to the request whats called source data, which meant that actually the search names, initials and the search names, initials and the departments in which 10,000 Police Officers in Northern Ireland suddenly found online their details had been posted. Now, in Northern Ireland, a lot of policemen go to work every day, not dressed in their uniforms. So men and women leave home in plain clothes. Their neighbours dont know what they go to do, so theyve had to keep their work secret in order to protect themselves and their families. The risk here is that some of those peoples identity have been compromised. We dont know enough. Its a statement that so far has come from the chief constable , which is that chief constable, which is that theyre investigating it. The theyre investigating it. The chief constable returned from holiday, had a meeting with the oversight body in Northern Ireland that that looked at these issues and some people wanted the chief constable to resign. The chief constable said he didnt think it would be helpful to resign. Do you think helpful to resign. Do you think helpful to resign. Do you think he should resign . The chief constable. Well, the point about resignation is does it actually do anything . I mean, right now we need somebody to find out whats going on and im not sure it would actually help if because a mistake, chief because of a mistake, the chief constable leaves his job, leaving at the top of the leaving nobody at the top of the tree to try and sort out what is actually happening. And to protect officers concerned. Protect the officers concerned. Theres already probably thats the decision for now. But the right decision for now. But maybe secretary state maybe the secretary of state might a statement on this might make a statement on this because this is one of those areas where because of power sharing, not working properly in Northern Ireland, there are undoubtedly is a vacuum that needs to be filled. And what we needs to be filled. And what we need you need your viewers need to know is our Police Officers right now in danger and what is being done to protect them . Yes well get on to power sharing in just a moment. The other question i was going to ask is theres already talk in todays newspapers about some of these Police Officers suing service in suing the Police Service in Northern Ireland. I mean, you cant blame them, can you . This is an extraordinary of is an extraordinary breach of their as youve said, their data. But as youve said, it compromises their safety. Do you idea that there you support the idea that there should a class action . Well should be a class action . Well what i support at the moment is actually knowing how much in danger these Police Officers are i lets be frank about this. If lets be frank about this. If its no good getting money, see if somebodys subsequently loses their life because their identity has been compromised. And i think , however and i think, however understandable it is , and im understandable it is, and im sure there are lawyers out there, ambulance chasing as its called right now, trying to put this class action together. What this class action together. What really needs to happen right now is the Police Service of Northern Ireland. Those responsible in Northern Ireland. The secretary of state here needs to get a grip on actually whats happened and protecting people. And after weve protected them, lets worry about suing people for mistakes. But what we need to do right now is protect people who, in my experience , as i think labours experience, as i think labours longest serving secretary of state, found these men and women to be extraordinarily Public Service people. Yes. And we owe a huge debt to them for protecting the people of Northern Ireland, whatever their denomination. I think we understand that theyre a Roman Catholic Police Officer has already moved his family out of Northern Ireland because of the data breach. As you say, there , youre the you say, there, youre the longest serving Northern Ireland secretary dodi, how do you characterise at the moment relations between republicans and loyalists in the district . And loyalists in the district . Well, i think people have still got to be congratulated on the achievement now of more than 25 years of the political process and the Peace Process working and there have been a huge challenges in in recent months and years, not least the fact that now for a year and a half , there has actually been no half, there has actually been no power sharing vehicle up and running in Northern Ireland. And the politicians is not least the dup really do need now to get back into government and start working together because wouldnt it be better now if the executive was functioning in Northern Ireland and they were the people talking to you about what should be happening . And again, all i have to say here is the secretary of state has a responsible duty to get this all working. And i think its working. And i think its a great shame that weve actually seen the absence of the secretary of state yet again in the last few days when i would like to have seen more of them. And i think its been interesting that the taoiseach interesting that the taoiseach in the republic of ireland has been a very visible presence in the last few days trying to talk to the parties and get them working again. Lets speak about leo varadkar because he said this week that if the stormont power sharing cant be sharing institutions cant be re established autumn, re established in the autumn, well then i think at that well then i do think at that point we have start point we will have to start having conversations about alternatives, about plan b, what would plan b look like in your mind . Sean well, would plan b look like in your mind . Sean well , thats a very, mind . Sean well, thats a very, very good question because as i was as you know , camilla, very was as you know, camilla, very pleased when rishi sunak became Prime Minister of our country. Im a labour politician , but im a labour politician, but he is our Prime Minister at the moment. I hope that changes. But he is who weve got. And unlike bofis he is who weve got. And unlike boris johnson, he put a huge amount of effort into Northern Ireland at the start of his time as minister. Now since as Prime Minister. Now since that time, hes made promises that time, hes made promises that he would get the executive up and running again and i think he has been somewhat distracted by all the other problems hes got from actually making progress on that. So plan b requires the british Prime Minister to get in there with the irish t shirt and everybody else to find a way to get a resolution. Now i presume what plan b means is finding a way for the Irish Government and the British Government to be working together for to a way to together for to find a way to get the institutions is still in Northern Ireland up and running, and that might be bringing about elections. Yes. But again , what elections. Yes. But again, what i really feel here is whats missing is what we saw under tony blair and gordon brown and less so increasingly with conservative Prime Ministers we need the engagement of the british Prime Minister. It doesnt matter whether theyre tory or labour, the british pm needs to be in there making these people work together. And a combination of money legislation and time and thats the crucial thing. Time time is what is missing from the british Prime Ministers agenda in Northern Ireland. You mentioned tony blair there. Obviously, he worked under blair and brown. Im intrigued by the story in the front of the sunday times. Sean, i wondered if youd comment. Blair kept advising Blair Institute kept advising saudi after saudi government after khashoggis. Thats khashoggis murder. Thats a misjudgement from tony blair, isnt it . Well, you and i and i suspect every viewer watching this programme will have been sickened by the death of mr khashoggi and what we learn about the circumstances behind that. Yeah. And as i understand it, and i dont work for the tony Blair Institute , but the tony Blair Institute, but the decision was made not to cancel a contract that was in play with the tony Blair Institute and the saudi government at misjudged, though the saudi government is modernising, that doesnt for one second condone what happened happenedin one second condone what happened happened in turkey with the murder of mr khashoggi. But what you and i know , camilla, you you and i know, camilla, you have to ask yourself, is the rhetoric and a sudden action is easy. So, for example, if the chief constable of Northern Ireland had resigned, would that have made any difference to protecting Police Officers today . So if everybody had withdrawn from communications withdrawn from communications with the saudis , yeah, would with the saudis, yeah, would that have helped . And an obvious example here, but was it wrong, sean , to carry on with this sean, to carry on with this funding cost of energy and petrol prices would for example, withdraw from every cooperation withdraw from every cooperation with saudi arabia after the death of khashoggi . Okay. And lets say the saudis Cutting Oil Production as a response would a further belt on the cost of living crisis. Okay, sean , do living crisis. Okay, sean, do anything to help people in britain. Britain. Okay. Thank you. Sorry. Were going to have to leave it there, but lovely to speak to you this sunday. Thank you very much, indeed. More to come. Indeed. Lots more to come. In just a minute, im going to be speaking to the mayor of West Midlands, street, about the midlands, andy street, about the shocking that shocking destruction of that famous pub famous crooked house pub in staffordshire. All that after the that warm feeling the weather that warm feeling inside from boxt boilers proud sponsors of weather on gb news news. Hello there. Hello there. Im Greg Dewhurst and welcome to your latest gb news weather forecast. Weve got rain coming forecast. Weve got rain coming up through the next 24 hours. Could be heavy at times, but the good news is that it does start to turn drier by the middle of the week. Low pressure in charge the week. Low pressure in charge at the moment, but that moves out the as head towards out the way as we head towards wednesday. High pressure wednesday. And High Pressure replaces settling our replaces it, settling our weather this evening. We weather down this evening. We have outbreaks of heavy rain pushing in across the west country, wales spreading north pushing in across the west coureastwards spreading north pushing in across the west coureastwards as reading north pushing in across the west coureastwards as weiing north pushing in across the west coureastwards as we move rth pushing in across the west coureastwards as we move through and eastwards as we move through into early hours. This into the early hours. This turning heavy at times over parts northern wales, parts of northern wales, Northern England met office Northern England. The met Office Warning in force here. Clear skies Northern Skies for Northern Ireland. Scots and some rain in scots and some showery rain in places and temperatures generally remaining in double figures. So a wet start across england and wales monday morning. Heavy rain across trans pennines routes in particular. If youre travelling here, rain heavy as well across parts of wales, just slowly pushing eastwards through day. Eastwards through the day. Sunshine and showers for Northern Ireland and scotland. Northern ireland and scotland. Again, these heavy at again, some of these heavy at times too, temperatures times too, and temperatures generally teens to low generally the high teens to low 20s quite a muggy feel where we do any sunshine across do see any sunshine across central and western parts of england and wales later on tuesday, a much calmer picture, High Pressure starting to build in as that low pressure moves out of the way. Still fairly unsettled. So a day of sunny unsettled. So a day of sunny spells and scattered showers. Some of the showers on the heavy side. And then it settles down wednesday into thursday. Plenty of sunny spells and temperatures starting to rise. Starting to rise. That warm feeling inside from boxt boilers. Proud sponsors of weather on. Youre listening to gb news radio. Radio. Welcome back to the Camilla Tominey show. Now in just a moment, joining me in the studio will be the mayor of West Midlands, andy street, and then former foreign former Australian Foreign minister downer will minister Alexander Downer will be small be discussing the small boats crisis. Delighted crisis. Im absolutely delighted to say that the mayor of West Midlands, andy joins me midlands, andy street, joins me in now. Andy, good in the studio now. Andy, good morning. Thank you very much for making south to come making the journey south to come and us look, and speak to us today. Look, weve got to start this weve got to start with this crooked house pub. Its on your patch. I know youve been quite vocal about it. I appreciate that. There is a Police Investigation being carried out, but its been put to me by a correspondent this morning that there something that seems a there is something that seems a Little Cricket crooked little more cricket crooked about this than just the pub. About this than just the pub. So we do have to respect the Police Inquiry and of course, the authority is also the local authority is also investigating. The investigating. Is there the planning the Planning Authority . Theyre the ones powers to act over ones with the powers to act over a rebuild. Ones with the powers to act over a rebuild. But you are ones with the powers to act over a rebuild. But you are right, a rebuild. But you are right, theres two underlying points here. The local people are really outrage gauged by this. They see this as an attack on their heritage, their history , their heritage, their history, and particularly people in the Black Country are very, very proud of that. But then the other underlying point is , is other underlying point is, is there legal there sufficient law Legal Protection for building laws like this . And i think its for those two reasons that this is becoming a story of National Significance , even interNational Significance, even interNational Significance, even interNational Significance, because people feel there two underlying important points. People who are watching the show were just showing some images of this being burnt images of this pub being burnt out. Was before it was out. That was before it was razed to ground with razed to the ground with a digger apparently had been digger that apparently had been booked even burnt booked before the pub even burnt down. If youre listening on the radio, were just seeing images of of this of the burnt out shell of this building and then lo and behold, its razed to the ground, its then razed to the ground, seemingly without anyone being able stop it. Ive read able to stop it. Ive read reports about the pathway the reports about the pathway or the road to the pub being blocked by huge mounds something huge mounds of soil. Something seems extremely fishy about the entire thing. I think from the publics perspective. Lviv publics perspective. Lviv theyre asking themselves two questions. First of all, how on earth is this able to happen . How could those diggers have got in done this without in and done this without seemingly anyones permission . Point one a e and point two what legal redress does anyone locally have . Youve talked about this pub being rebuilt brick by brick. How can you enforce that . Yeah. Okay. So they are the points. Youre right. So what is a statement of fact is that there was no permission to demolish this pub. Very clear. Demolish this pub. Very clear. Permission has to be given by the local authority for a demolition to occur. That permission was not given. So in a sense, thats an established fact. Weve got to then follow through the consequences of that. Now when i say the pub must be rebuilt brick by brick, clearly thats the local requirement. But there are also precedents law. Precedents for that in law. Theres a wonderful story of a pub in maida in london, the pub in maida vale in london, the carlton tavern that was knocked down without permission was rebuilt brick by brick. Of course, its going to be rather more difficult with a very quirky like this, but quirky building like this, but thats ambition, because thats the ambition, because its like a principle its almost like a principle that heritage that we cannot see heritage erased in this way. I mean, when you talk about it being rebuilt, are you saying exactly the form that was exactly in the form that it was before . Because it was before . Because obviously it was crooked a result of crooked as a result of subsidies . Would have to be subsidies . It would have to be built a very unique and built in a very unique and perhaps peculiar to recreate perhaps peculiar way to recreate the magic but is that what your the magic. But is that what your vision is for this . Well, this going to be well, this is going to be very isnt it . And were very hard, isnt it . And were perhaps further through perhaps a little further through the ideally, ideally, people just ideally, ideally, people want indeed ideally want it is indeed an ideally that so. That should be so. But weve got to just face reality. Its going to be rather challenging to exactly the challenging to get exactly the quirkiness. That quirkiness. But the mission that we with the local we set out with and the local authority have the power to authority who have the power to demand exactly the demand this are in exactly the same ive had discussions same place. Ive had discussions with this week. That is with them this week. That is what out to do, what were setting out to do, because matters as because it matters as a precedent, a principle, and what about the owners then . This, isnt its difficult, this, isnt it . Sold by the marsden it . Its sold by the marsden Brewery Private individuals brewery to private individuals rules. We dont quite know what their involvement is with any of this. Its being this. As you say, its being investigated by the police. The police also at police are also looking at a potential case. So its potential arson case. So its quite complicated. Yes. But can quite complicated. Yes. But can they be forced to have to rebuild the pub on their own land, land that they own because its a diktat from somebody in Central Government or some other body . Is that can that actually happen . Is body . Is that can that actually happen . Is it feasible . We are of course, just going through the detail of the law, andifs through the detail of the law, and its why its so interesting whats the power the law . But whats the power in the law . But my understanding is that the local authority have the power to that. But thats just to enforce that. But thats just been worked through and we must give time for the local authority to actually do their investigation and determine that, because this is quite technical legal stuff. But that technical legal stuff. But that is my hope to be clear as well. On another point, marsden sold that pub very legally fine. So there is an underlying point to there is an underlying point to the citizens watching thinking this is terrible. Support your local pubs as well. Yes, its obvious point they sold it because it wasnt trading well. Its hard thing to its a hard thing to acknowledge, but its true. So lets heritage lets support these heritage buildings people of buildings the good people of dudley help you ensure dudley do to help you to ensure because determined because you seem very determined that this pub is going to be rebuilt so very determined rebuilt. So im very determined because of what the good people of dudley have said. Actually so i say anyone watching i would say to anyone watching from or indeed other from dudley or indeed the other local has been local areas, your voice has been heard. Youve something heard. Youve done something really week. Really powerful this week. Youve said, this is our history. Were going defend our. Were going to defend our history. Proud black history. Were proud Black Country people. We know of our history. Done that history. Yes, theyve done that now. To leave the now. They have to leave the local Authority Police local authority and the police force the fire service to do force and the fire service to do their investigations. And i know patience is a hard thing to ask for, it is whats required for, but it is whats required in this case. Thank you very much on all of that, andy. Lets move to the web and me web midlands then and tell me how things and how are things going . And obviously weve the obviously weve got the governments levelling up agenda. Are the government levelling up places the levelling up places like the West Midlands . Know youve West Midlands . I know youve been kind been a bit critical of this kind of begging culture around of begging bowl culture around some funding. Yeah. Some of the funding. Yeah. Whats situation you . Whats the situation for you . Moved on since that whats the situation for you . Was moved on since that whats the situation for you . Was back ed on since that whats the situation for you . Was back ini on since that whats the situation for you . Was back in aboutnce that whats the situation for you . Was back in about march it that was back in about march when i was critical the when i was critical of the begging bowl culture, as i called it. And the idea there, there was a small pots of money allocated through there was a small pots of money allo levelling through there was a small pots of money allolevelling up through there was a small pots of money allo levelling up fund through there was a small pots of money allolevelling up fund and hrough the levelling up fund and i didnt believe that the best didnt believe that was the best way of achieving investment into the west or indeed the West Midlands or indeed anywhere but actually anywhere else. But actually theres a big since theres been a big move since then a bit then and it sounds a bit technical, the government technical, but the government have now agreed a devolution deal with ourselves and greater manchester, in manchester, a third deal and in that actually that they actually moved to transferring large amounts of cash and power and decision making. In principle, theres never enough, is there . But theres large amount. But the theres a large amount. But the principle is that we take the decisions locally about how were going to spend that. They call it a pot. So we take call it a single pot. So we take those trade off decisions and make all of our energies make sure all of our energies around skills, transport, housing, they can sort of be coordinated made locally. Coordinated, made locally. And thats big breakthrough thats a big breakthrough because were deciding , because if were deciding, rather than for little rather than asking for little bits government , hopefully bits from government, hopefully we plan together. We can get a plan together. Do you think that the country is being up . Obviously is being levelled up . Obviously in weve heard a lot in the past weve heard a lot about north south divide, not just north south divides. Maybe divides between prosperous cities , even in the north and cities, even in the north and left behind towns, particularly seaside towns. Yeah. What do you seaside towns. Yeah. What do you think the picture is, andy . Because think there are people because i think there are people in the north, particularly following boris following the fall of boris johnson, who voted for johnson, people who voted for brexit, dont think the brexit, who dont think that the government has delivered on those so called those promises. The so called red are people in red wall. There are people in those constituencies feeling really, really disillusioned. They lost. They feel politically lost. Our because this isnt so our because this isnt just a north issue, this applies to the midlands as well. And as you say, there are places in the south would described as south that would be described as by some as left behind. So its not a north issue. Our not just a north issue. Our evidence of this is that pre pandemic. Were doing very pandemic. We were doing very well that gap. Well. We were closing that gap. But actually the pandemic has pushed our performance backwards. Makes backwards. So it makes this agenda even more important. It agenda even more important. It and actually what you see because you talk about boris but what this government under rishi and jeremy hunt have done, they are investing billions in areas outside of the south east. If i look at our experience , £8 look at our experience, £8 billion for transport investment is huge money for developing skills , huge amounts of money, skills, huge amounts of money, and recently half £1 billion more for building affordable homes. So the cash is being put on the table by the government. And what people on the ground want to see is actual delivery. Now, you say that and maybe when you talk about big checks being written for infrastruc thatcher projects for thatcher and other projects for regeneration projects, thats great. Honest. And great. But lets be honest. And i ask you also with your former john on the high john lewis hat on the high street is suffering. Weve heard this that wilkinsons this week that wilkinsons wilkos, wilko right now, people would like to refer to it is in administration. Its closing down. Weve also had nigel farage complain about the banks on this channel revealing that a thousand Bank Accounts a day are being closed and that were moving towards this Cashless Society closing out society that is closing out smaller businesses that deal in cash. Mean , you know well cash. I mean, you know as well as i because you must go as i do because you must go shopping and boarded high shopping and boarded out high streets, inability park where streets, inability to park where you want ltns and ulez making life difficult for the motorist its not contributing to. I would say, an aspirational sort of british town centre. Is it . Of british town centre. Is it . No, its very challenging at town centres, but but the government should be doing more to help people, shouldnt they. But are already small but they are already Small Businesses. Businesses though. Andy think Small Businesses andy i think Small Businesses complain that theyre not giving the they need. I recall the support they need. I recall that actually made that you actually made a complaint businesses complaint about Small Businesses perhaps given as much perhaps not being given as much help with their energy bills as householders. Thats true. So this issue still continues. So lets be fair to the government. First of all, the support for Domestic Energy users has been incredible , actually. But if you look at business support, i was vociferous earlier in the year saying those who ended up with a high charge because of what happened at the end of last yean happened at the end of last year, theyre sort of locked into that now. A lot of work has been done. Ive spoken personally with all of the energy about actually Energy Companies about actually this extending the this this sort of extending the contracts able people contracts to able people to bnng contracts to able people to bring term down bring the short term price down and but there still and extend. But there are still some are left with the high some who are left with the high cost from last year. And i would like to see. Yes straight answer. I would like to see more action on that because that continues to be particularly for hospitality businesses. Yes, thats very challenging. What kind of action, though . I mean, suppose way to i mean, i suppose one way to look would be that the look at it would be that the Corporation Tax hike was a mistake. Its clobbered Small Businesses should be reversed. So i would like to see the fund thats already on fund thats already been put on the table, £5 billion from the Government Energy support government for Energy Support for to for businesses at the moment to be much more targeted. Not a little off everybody, but little bit off everybody, but those got a real hike those who have got a real hike left beached by last years arrangements. Much more focus on those need it. Business rate relief and Corporation Tax. Always believed ive always believed that business are very, very Business Rates are very, very challenging and i would like to see complete reform of see a complete reform of Business Rates because if you look at whats happening, the high is paying high street is paying disproportionately high street is paying disproportotherely forms of rates and other new forms of business probably pay a less business probably pay a lot less. Theres really big long. So theres a really big long term issue there. Corporation tax. I would like to see it come down over time, lets be down over time, but lets be honest, the government has got to its finances well. To manage its finances as well. What you like to see if what would you like to see if corporation be . Corporation tax be . We had somebody on because we had somebody on the week saying john the show last week saying john redwood, in fact. Okay, keith thatcherite. But at the same time it should be 12. 5 time he said it should be 12. 5 to match ireland. So we were at about 19. That was very competitive within the g7. Was very competitive within the 67. If was very competitive within the g7. If we could get towards back to that, that very competitive position. And the government has position. And the government has been clear, they want been really clear, they want to get to that. The get back to that. When the pubuc get back to that. When the public finances allow. And we cant that were in cant deny that were in a particularly difficult position and finance is a and good sound finance is a conservative principle. One final question. The one final question. The Commonwealth Games and the future Commonwealth Games is in jeopardy because victoria have pulled out. We hear that pulled out. We now hear that alberta in canada cant host 2030. Birmingham step in 2030. Could birmingham step in and save the day . So the interesting phrase, the word in that question is could of course we could a brilliant job was done across birmingham and the West Midlands last weve seen the last year and weve seen all the figures inward invest figures around inward invest moment the brand of birmingham around world being enhanced around the world being enhanced by to host is by so youd like to host is should we should we should you should we should we should you should my answer to that at the moment is no, what the moment is no, because what the commonwealth needs for its Commonwealth Games needs for its long success an long term success is for an australian state step australian state to step forward. Canadian state to forward. A canadian state to step and wouldnt step forward and it wouldnt be quite if it was just in quite the same if it was just in one location as as we in one location as much as we in a sense would love to do it again. Its not yet the right answer and street, lovely to see you this morning. You. I love the west thank you. I love to the West Midlands you return. Thank midlands when you return. Thank you for your now you very much for your time. Now weve plenty more to come on weve got plenty more to come on todays going todays show shortly. Im going todays show shortly. Im going to to the longest to be speaking to the longest serving foreign minister of australia, Alexander Downer. Serving foreign minister of austriforget,zxander downer. Serving foreign minister of austriforget, weve r downer. Serving foreign minister of austriforget, weve also vner. Serving foreign minister of austriforget, weve also got. Dont forget, weve also got that exclusive interview with Robert Kennedy jr. Hes going to be discussing his political ambitions. He wants to take on ambitions. He wants to take on donald but he also talks donald trump, but he also talks to us about what it was like to find out that uncle had been find out that his uncle had been assassinated. Then, assassinated. And then, of course, later, find out course, years later, to find out that his father, Bobby Kennedy, had been killed similar had been killed in similar circumstance,. Let them. And youre youre listening to gb news radio. Listening to gb news radio. So. So. Lets discuss whether the government actually can stop the boats with Alexander Downer lovely to see you this morning. Its a great pleasure to be here. Look, its not a great weekend, is it . Weve seen more deaths in the channel weve had this i mean , id say its this i mean, id say its a fiasco with the bibby stockholm home having to be removed of migrants because of legionnaires. Was meant to legionnaires. It was meant to be. The legionnaires. It was meant to be. The stop the boats week. Can in on our Peoples Panel wanted me what can the me to ask you what can the government do to rescue this. I government do to rescue this. I would say shambolic approach to trying to stop the boats because its not working. Alexander well, at the heart of it is going to be third country processing of these Asylum Seekers. And so that is rwanda. And so that is rwanda. And so that is rwanda. Yeah, i know. But then theyve said as labour have said, theyve sent more home secretaries to rwanda than actual deportees. Well they havent sent any deportees to rwanda and think deportees to rwanda and i think two have been two home secretaries have been to , so two is more than to rwanda, so two is more than nought. However, they just have nought. However, they just have to overcome the legal problems they have. One way or another. They have. One way or another. They have to do that. So its now going to the Supreme Court. These Court Hearings and decisions. They just take forever. But theyve got theyve got to be determine , ed, to got to be determine, ed, to pursue this whole rwanda as we call it, the rwanda option, because you have to break the Business Model of the organised crime gangs who are bringing these people across. You have to these people across. You have to break their Business Model. And break their Business Model. And its as simple as this that the people, the Asylum Seekers pay three ,4,000 per person to come across if they know now that they cant get to the uk or cant stay in the uk and will end up in rwanda or anywhere else , and they wont pay the else, and they wont pay the 3 to ,4000 in the first place. When you tried to break that business, when you tried it in australia and obviously you successfully put people off landing on australian shores by processing them in nauru, did you have all of these legal challenges . I mean, is the difference between us and you, the echr and the fact that we probably have to leave it in order to further our own . So number one policy aims, we anticipated there would be, you know, what a hare called lefty lawyers. Yeah , lodging, all sorts of yeah, lodging, all sorts of cases , that there would be cases, that there would be a massive litigation. So we lined massive litigation. So we lined up the laws as best we could to avoid that, to make sure, because after all, the parliament makes the law , not parliament makes the law, not the lawyers. So the laws were the lawyers. So the laws were substantially changed in australia. I wont go into how we changed them. And secondly , we changed them. And secondly, it is a fair point where australia is not part of the europe, not part of europe, is not part of the European Convention on human rights. The uk is the Strasbourg Court has expanded its remit very substantially over the last few years and that is potentially be potentially not for certain, potentially not for certain, potentially a major legal obstacle, but well see when the Supreme Court finally rules on this case. But if the government wins in the Supreme Court, then more or less figuratively, the next day they can start sending people to rwanda. Id say the people to rwanda. Id say the other thing is its got to be comprehensive. Everybody who comes across on a small boat like this needs to know theyll end up in rwanda. They all need end up in rwanda. They all need to know that if we lose in the Supreme Court, do we then look at leaving the echr . Well, it depends why the home office would lose in the Supreme Court. It would depend what the court said. That the law said. Its possible that the law could changed and its could be changed and its possible that there could be some modification of the scheme in rwanda in extremists. I suppose the uk could leave the European Convention. That would be pretty dramatic to leave a Convention Like that. Hopefully the legal problems can be solved without that being necessary. No , that you did this review no, that you did this review into our border force and you gave it to former home secretary priti patel. I just wouldnt mind your analysis of the home office. I mean, back in the day when he was home secretary i think it was 17 years ago, john reid fit for reid said it wasnt fit for purpose. The phrase im always told about the home office is that a basket case. Do you that its a basket case. Do you agree does it need agree with that . Does it need total reform this time . I know the home office reasonably well. 40,000 reasonably well. Its 40,000 people. Of them are people. Some of them are geniuses and some of them arent. Has a very, very arent. So it has a very, very difficult job. Some of the work they do , they do very well. They do, they do very well. Lets just take this issue of Illegal Migrants picking them up, bringing them in, processing them, understanding who has arrived, making sure people dont get here unaware accounted for. They do a pretty good job. I mean, yes, historic high of 100,000 coming in by the channel over several years though since 20 still much higher than it was pre pandemic. No. What they what theyit pre pandemic. No. What they what they it seems like theres a complete lack of grip, actually, and a of distinguishing and a lack of distinguishing between ligita remotely between people. Ligita remotely seeking in this country seeking asylum in this country and economic migrants. You yes. Come come to that. So i think theres some of the some of the functional things the home office does is actually does quite well. Its easy to be critical, but i actually think some of the things they do, they do quite well. Here is a real issue that i dont think is being addressed in the uk and thatis being addressed in the uk and that is why why do so many people who apply for Refugee Status have it granted in the uk where i mean , i stand to be where i mean, i stand to be corrected, but i think Something Like 70, 75 of all applicants applications are approved by the home office , whereas in the eu, home office, whereas in the eu, in a country like france , its in a country like france, its only about 35. This is the question. Is it this is the question. Is it because there are officials in the home office who are anti the governments own immigration policy . No. And are ticking boxes and letting people in when they should. Im not sure its the im not sure of the answer to this, but it its possibly not the officials. Its possibly the law. Yes. And that the government hasnt sufficiently changed the law to define more strictly what a refugee is now, a refugee is meant to be somebody who is fleeing from tution and looking for, if you like, protection , to for, if you like, protection, to use the word of the refugee language of the refugee convention, looking for somewhere safe to go. That isnt somewhere safe to go. That isnt the same thing as turning somebody into a migrant. No. And what the government is doing is making all people who apply for Refugee Status, who havent granted, and were not sure on what basis it is being granted, on what basis theyre just fleeing a country that nobody likes as distinct from them personally fleeing, persecute. Personally fleeing, persecute. An theyre personally, personally being persecuted and then theyre turned into migrants, whereas in australia, one of the things we did was with people who were found to be refugees. We gave them temporary protection visas. We said, okay, protection visas. We said, okay, well look after you for a year , year, and at the end of that year well review your situation. And if back home the persecution has come to an end, theres political change or whatever has happened and its safe for you to go home. Well send you back home. But our obugafion send you back home. But our obligation is to protect you, to not convert you into a migrant. Not convert you into a migrant. We have a separate program for migrants and we decide who comes to australia as thats what youd recommend. Our government does. Our government does. I would recommend they review a lot of these things that weve been talking about this morning. So i think they should reintroduce temporary protection visas. I think the home secretary and other ministers , secretary and other ministers, the immigration minister need to look at the definition of refugees. They need to look at refugees. They need to look at the refugee convention, look at what the courts have been doing , and ask the question why are so many applications being accepted in the uk, whereas theyre being rejected in the eu . All of these questions, i think, are really important questions to follow through. I mean, these are questions that have been facing the tories for the last 13 years, but Alexander Downer, thank you very much for your insight. Much indeed for your insight. Lovely this lovely to speak to you this morning. Welcome back to the Camilla Tominey show now us documentary filmmaker daphne barak has interviewed democratic president ial hopeful Robert Kennedy jr in a gb news broadcast exclusive. Mr kennedy talks about the painful memories of the assassination of his father, former us attorney general and senator Bobby Kennedy and uncle and former president j. F kennedy. This interview forms part of an upcoming documentary for the 60th anniversary of the assassination of jfk. And were going to be playing segments throughout todays gb news programming. When you decided to run, i mean, of course , youre run, i mean, of course, youre coming from a family that your uncle was assassinated. It was a big shock for the nation, for the whole world. Then your father was suddenly did you have a conversation with your wife, cheryl, with your children . Should i do it . Should i shouldnt i do it . I mean, its normal, right . I you know, i think all of it everybody in my family, she is aware of the risk. But, you aware of the risk. But, you know, i think , you know, life is know, i think, you know, life is filled with risk. So and i think once cheryl was convinced that that there was a path to victory and that. I think she felt like, and that. I think she felt like, you know, because i have a passion to do this, to solve some of these problems for a country. And im in a unique position to be able to do that. That she gave me the green light. Now, do you remember you were very young. You were probably nine years old, right , you were probably nine years old, right, when your uncle was assassinated. Do you remember assassinated. Do you remember how you found out about it . I was picked up from school early that day. I went to Sidwell Friends School in washington, dc. And my mother picked us up early and while we were leaving, we saw a man in front of the school, lowering the flag to half mast. And i asked my mother why he was doing that, and she said that a bad man had shot my uncle and the shot uncle jack and i, you know. Then shot uncle jack and i, you know. Then when i went home, my father was actually walking in the yard with the director of the yard with the director of the cia , John Mccullough , and he the cia, John Mccullough, and he had been the first one to my house because cia was only about maybe a half mile from our house in hickory hill. Maybe a half mile from our house in hickory hill. And the in hickory hill. And the director came over every day and swam in our pool. And my he had he had appeared at our house. My father actually that day , the father actually that day, the first call that he made was to the cia, to a to the desk chief, and asked and he asked him he was in a you know, in a state at the time. And he asked , did your the time. And he asked, did your people do this . That was his people do this . That was his first thought. And then he called enrique ruiz, who had been one of the commanders of the cuban brigade. And who was one of the brigade leaders who had remained very, very close to my father. And he we saw him he my father. And he we saw him he came to dinner often. He came on ski vacations with us. And he had fought along side of castro and then turned on him. And he and then turned on him. And he had been part of the bay of pigs brigade. And he was in washington, dc, at a hotel that day. And my fathers next call was to him. And he said , did was to him. And he said, did your people do this . And then when mccain came over, he asked him the same question as he walked in the yard. When we came walked in the yard. When we came in the driveway , my father left in the driveway, my father left mccain and came up and hugged us. And then took us for a walk around the yard. And there was a cedar tree at the bottom of our yard and we all sat on, stood under that together and i, you know, and hugged my dad because we could see how upset he was that he was destroyed. And it that he was destroyed. And it took him it took him many, many months to recover. He walked around like a ghost or for several months after that, this horrible day. Is it your father is in a Los Angeles Hotel and hes being shot. At this point, youre 14, right . How did you learn about that . That . Well, i. I was woken up. I was at that time going to Georgetown Prep school in washington. And i was woken up by a priest at around 5 00 in the morning. And i was told that the morning. And i was told that there was a car waiting for me. And he didnt say why. And i went right to hickory hill, which was probably a 15 minute drive to our home. And people were very upset. And i remember were very upset. And i remember somebody saying that they were closing all the Campaign Offices at this point. My father was not dead and when they said they were closing the Campaign Offices, i, i understood for the first time that how badly he was injured. And then we went and got on air force two, which is hubert humphrey, the Vice President s aeroplane , as president s aeroplane, as opposed to us one, us one, us two, and we went to los angeles. So and we went to the hospital, the Good Samaritan hospital, where my father was. So i was with my father when he died. Oh, my god. Oh, my god. And, and then we brought him back to new york. I mean, we brought him to the airport, which was extraordinary because there was 100 he had a he had, you know, he hadnt used the police. He hadnt trusted the lapd. And they were very racist at that time. And so he hadnt used them in his campaign and he wouldnt use the j. Edgar hoover offered him the fbi. But he didnt want the fbi protection because he knew j. Edgar hoover would be spying on his campaign. And was telling Lyndon Johnson everything because hoover hated my father and was very close to johnson. And so he used, you johnson. And so he used, you know, the Dallas Cowboys lineman and a few of his a few kind of former us marshals and former fbi people as security. And then when they were they had a convoy of hundreds of motorcycles , of hundreds of motorcycles, falls from the motorcycle gangs around california and had had, you know , who were following my you know, who were following my father. And they all came out to the airport and when we were taking off, they all came out on the runway. And i remember the runway. And i remember looking out of the window of the plane and seeing that the motorcyclists tried to stay at pace with the wing of the plane, and one of them getting blown off his bike by the power of the engines. And we came back to new york. We wake him at st barts at Saint Patricks. And i was at Saint Patricks. And i was one of the pallbearers. You one of the pallbearers. You know, we waked him up overnight , but so we didnt an all night vigil. And then i was one of the pallbearers the next day, and it was an extraordinary, extraordinary moving ceremony on an and, you know, inspiring and yet know heartbreaking at the same time. And i remember while we were carrying struggling with his coffin down the steps of Saint Patricks , a very, very Saint Patricks, a very, very large black woman collapsed on the steps and then she was waving a handkerchief at him at the coffin and saying to him, look, youve done your best. Youve done your best. It was very it was a moment that just, you know, stabbed me in the chest. Chest. That was us. Documentary filmmaker daphne barak interviewing Robert Kennedy jr as part of an upcoming documentary for the 60th anniversary of the assassination of jfk. If you want to see the full interview with Robert Kennedy jr. Go to gbnews. Com. I wont be back next week because im taking a well needed holiday. Tom harwood is going to be filling in for me. Hell be back next week at 930. Back next week at 930. The temperatures rising. The temperatures rising. Boxt solar proud sponsors of weather on. Gb news. Weather on. Gb news. Hello there. Im Greg Dewhurst and welcome to your latest news weather forecast. Weve got rain coming up through the next 24 hours. Could be heavy at times, but the good news is that it does start to turn drier by the middle of the week. Low pressure in charge at the moment, but that moves out the moment, but that moves out the way as we head towards wednesday and High Pressure replaces settling replaces it, settling our weather evening. We weather down this evening. We have outbreaks of heavy rain pushing in across west pushing in across the west country, wales spreading north and eastwards we move through and eastwards as we move through into early hours. Into the early hours. This turning heavy times over turning heavy at times over parts northern wales , parts of northern wales, northern metoffice Northern England and metOffice Warning here. Clear warning in force here. Clear skies for Northern Ireland, scotland, some showery rain in places and temperatures generally remaining in double figures. So a wet start across england and wales monday morning. Heavy across trans. Heavy rain across trans pennines routes in particular. If youre travelling here, rain heavy as well across parts of wales, just slowly pushing eastwards through the day. Sunshine showers for sunshine and showers for northern and scotland Northern Ireland and scotland again, these heavy at again, some of these heavy at times too , and temperatures times too, and temperatures generally high teens to low generally the high teens to low 20s a muggy feel where we 20s quite a muggy feel where we do see any sunshine across central western parts of central and western parts of england and wales later on tuesday, a much calmer picture, High Pressure starting to build in as that low pressure moves out of the way. Still fairly unsettled. So a day of sunny spells and scattered showers. Some of the showers on the heavy side. And then it settles down wednesday into thursday. Plenty wednesday into thursday. Plenty of sunny spells and temperatures starting to rise. The starting to rise. The temperatures rising. Temperatures rising. A boxt solar proud sponsors of weather on. Of weather on. Gb news. Now then lee anderson here join me on gb news on my new show , the real world. Every show, the real world. Every friday at 7 pm. Where real people get to meet those in power and hold them to account. Every week well be hearing your views from up and down the country. In the real world. Join me at 7 00 on gb news britain on news. Channel the live desk with news. Channel the live desk with me , Mark Longhurst and me pip tomson. Its here monday to friday on gb news. From midday well bring you the news as it breaks whenever its happening and wherever its happening from across the uk and around the world. Refreshing, feisty , but with refreshing, feisty, but with a bit of fun too. A bit of fun too. If it matters to you, well have it covered on tv, channel hi there. Its 7 00. Im Aaron Armstrong in the gb newsroom. The government is newsroom. The government is facing renewed criticism of its immigration strategy after six migrants died when their vessel sank off the french coast yesterday. A total of 509 people yesterday. A total of 509 people crossed the English Channel in ten small boats on saturday, bringing the total for the year to more than 16,500. Campaign groups have described it as an appalling and preventable tragedy. It is also a further setback for the governments stop the boats pledge, which is one of Prime Minister rishi sunaks five key policies as people in scotland and wales could soon be able to access nhs treatment in england. Health treatment in england. Health secretary Steve Barclay has ianed secretary Steve Barclay has invited his welsh and scottish counterparts to discuss different approaches that could be taken to tackle the backlog. Be taken to tackle the backlog. More than 73,000 people in wales and more than 21,000 people in scotland have been waiting for more than a year for treatment. More than a year for treatment. Pubsin more than a year for treatment. Pubs in england and wales will be allowed to continue selling takeaway pints after the government decided to keep covid licencing rules they were due to expire in september. But its understood the Prime Minister has listened to the industry loud and clear. As first reported in the sun , pubs were reported in the sun, pubs were allowed to sell alcohol through allowed to sell alcohol through a hatch during the pandemic and the move is set to help the hospitality sector boost its sales to recover from the pandemic relative lives of those who died in the omagh bombing. 25 years ago have held a