Or thanks so much for being with us and my guests here in the studio are stacey burns from de w. C. U. S. Election team. Who says joe biden must realize that americas allies are looking for a team player a no. A team leader also with us is jamie fly from the German Marshall Fund to form a visor on Foreign Policy to president george w. Bush. Who argues that america will remain divided and distracted under President Biden. And that will harm its ability to partner with allies. And a very warm welcome to the crew. So far, marshall, chief Diplomatic Correspondent of the berlin daily times should be go. He argues that under President Biden, relations with germany, and europe might be a little less abrasive. But do monks greater commitment from brussels will remain and thank you all 3 for being here today, this plenty to talk about. So lets get going. Stay, see, is there any doubt in your mind that joe biden has won the president ial election . Not at all. The numbers are just not and president chavez favor, and i think he knows that. But as my angelou said, when somebody shows you who they are, believe them and he was a sore winner. He was a leader. And now he is an extremely sore loser. Who is essentially spitting in the soup as hes leaving the numbers just dont support him still being in office and what hes doing is potentially detrimental. Ok, jamie, you are well connected in republican circles. How would you gauge the mood among the Party Faithful . I think its a mixed right now because we obviously have a republican president who is not refusing to leave yet he doesnt have to leave office until january 20th, but hes indicating that he perhaps thinks that he is going to serve another 4 years. So thats obviously very concerning. I think even so many Congressional Republicans on the flip side, this is a president who did much better than anticipated and brought more than 72000000 americans out. So vote for him. And honestly has charted, i think, a path forward for the republican party, even in 4 years in terms of some electoral gains in key constituencies. And so people, thats why i think you see many Congressional Republicans reluctant to push him out because they think that donald trump is going to be part of the conversation for the next 4 years. Ok, christopher christopher, emotional. How much of a fresh start . Do you expect from washington, do you expect a transition or something much more profound . A transformation . Well, im at the moment confident joe biden will be inaugurated as the 46. 00 president , but we are not yet out of the woods. And i think its extremely now the extreme, but it is somehow concerning and even dangerous. That president ial is not giving and not admitting, and that sets a very bad example. It undermines institution, you say dangerous. So normal things should be, as we have seen, for example, the transition from george w. Bush to obama, from obama to donald trump. That when the election result is clear, you invite your successor to come to the white house to discuss what is from your point of view, the situation and the most important problems you allow your future companions to get to see if you could serve as briefings to be informed. So you try to have a smooth transition in order to secure security of the United States and in a broader sense, the democratic world and that is missing. That is why it is dangerous, and that is just decided that this transition doesnt happen, but he also does damage to the institutions. Because half of the population in United States or at least half of the voters might believe that he considers himself to still be the elected president. And that undermines our belief in the democratic process in the state of law and in the division of power, which is a set. What is different in our countrys western countries from dictatorships. Ok, thats the mood in washington at the moment for his part presidency like to joe biden has already been speaking to some World Leaders. His message is unequivocal. Oh, were going to be number one. Ive had the opportunity to speak with 6 World Leaders and their response has been very forceful, energetic, and theyre all looking forward to being able to from Great Britain to france, to germany, etc. So i feel good about the ability to stay. America is back, says joe biden, its not a boast, a stretch or a rallying call. It comes from us and me when Michael Jordan returned to basketball, im from so and so you know, he was the best player in the league and, you know, people admired his leadership and his fight. And when he came back to the team, people were a little bit weary. Things had moved on. He was gone for a bit, playing baseball, and the team shifted. Some people had gone away. Some people had taken over a leadership role. And all of a sudden, this great player hansen is here to boyden is already out. And he hasnt even not saying hes out data. What im saying is that the makeup of the landscape has changed. And so he wants to come back and be at the head of the table. Thats what he said. But when you listen to uncle americal saying that she wants germany and europe to work side by side with the United States and European Commission, president ursula burns alliance. Saying that she wants that europe should take more initiative. I dont think that europe now the European Union wants to be the robin to americas back now. And i think that they want to be an equal partner in helping to reshape the world in order to try to shake off some of this. Trump ism, thats made its way overseas and to try to strengthen the importance of multilateralism. And these Democratic Institutions that the United States once supported. Christopher joe biden chose to speak to americas best friends. Its transatlantic partners in these are these early conversations that joe biden has been having. Hes not. How should we say hes not playing it safe . Well, it is a very different set of friends. If i take a Great Britain which united kingdom, which means boris johnson, he runs up the reelection of donald trump and hope for a good traits of court. And now he has to change to flip sides very quickly and say, you know, joe biden, im on your side. I want to be a good ally. Thats very different position from, lets say france or germany who are reluctant relationship with President Trump. And we have very much hoping that there comes a change in the United States. If i look at my country germany, i think the biggest danger seeds, the biggest mistake would be that we again hope that the president changes and everything will be fine. We just cant continue with our set of policies, and this would be a huge mistake. We of course, we expect that there comes change from washington, but we also have to give some change from berlin to make it work. And if we just think the change should come from washington, and we dont have to adapt or change, then we run into deep disappointment in if in a few months. So i hope that the German Government has a plan what to offer to President Biden in order also to ask for some changes on the u. S. Side. Ok, well find out a little bit more about the plan in just a 2nd. We just mentioned chancellor Angela Merkel and she this week reiterated the Transatlantic Partnership between the u. S. And europe is irreplaceable. She also listed the challenges that the partnership is facing and we can if i didnt start in the United States of america and germany as part of the European Union must stand together to meet the great challenges of our time side by side in the severe test of the current virus pandemic, side by side in the fight against Global Warming, and its global repercussions in the fight against terrorism. Side by side for an open World Economy and free trade. Because these are the foundations of our prosperity on both sides of the atlantic prosperity on both sides of the atlantic. But lets be honest, america is frustrated with jim just hearing, tell us about the frustration and well see what you know germany can possibly do. I think the one last thing legacy of the trump ministration, when it comes to germany will be that he has shifted the us conversation about what is expected of allies. And germany has been perhaps the leading example of trump rallies, receiving criticism from the president for not spending enough on defense for being a free rider. And i honestly think that thats a good legacy for the relationship. I dont think trump often approached the issue with the right tone, but i think americans given the pressures that existed even prior to the pandemic, want to see allies that are paying their fair share that are stepping up and being partners not just in word, but also in deed, and thats going to be the real, a real test for the, by the ministration they want to repair relations. But i think the biden team also wants to see germany continue to make progress in defense spending on issues like north stream, too, with russia doing more as the u. S. Confronts china. And at some point, if germany doesnt do enough, the bottom ministration may end up being critical, just like the ministration. Well, its not just like the top ministration, because the Top Administration had no tact. They treat at their end, their friends like they were enemies. And thats a problem. So when youre trying to, he didnt, he had more of an isolationist kind of view of the world anyway. And, and i feel just the way he spoke about merkel that he has a problem with strong women. And so sometimes his policies, his rhetoric was more of an attack on her than on what the country should be doing. Of course, all partnerships should contribute more and in the way that the world is now, the United States cant carry the load, but you have to have tact. You have to have diplomat, you have to be diplomatic. You have to be respectful because you need your friends in order to rally in order to move in the world forward. Yeah, but i think we have to seize a situation together with whats happening in germany. And america has been chancellor for many years and she is on the way out next year will have a new coalition. And if you read together the outcome of the american of the u. S. Election and see general election, i think we can expect the next government, which from todays perspective talking is probably green and black means see Christian Democratic Union was a chance lens, a green party. They will be more critical in the relationship with china and the relationship with with russia. A sudden these agreements are not eager to spend more on defense, but here again, i think the perspective to discuss it as a way, what are the americans expect your friends is not see. Best way we should say, what is in germanys interest and what is your partners expect . What trump in, not very good terms threatened and what probably will ask for is also the hope of france, of poland, of the Baltic States of the netherlands. And our partners in the defense issue of germany is very much isolated. Its not just a u. S. President who is asking that germany should shoulder more responsibility. Its also a huge part of our european partners. And i think in order to convince the german public that theres a better way to have to debate. We shouldnt be in positions where we are close to a minority, and that is, for example, Energy Policy was not stray into the pipeline with russia. It is certainly defense and there are a few other issues and it would be for that reason, it would be rather smart to come up with an offer to come up with. And we want to read all 3 in tool to make sure that ukraine, poland, they are not well that are not left out of the game. We are willing to do more in defense. We will not do 2 percent in the next year. Certainly not, such would be clear, but we are willing to do more. We are on the way we have an offer in china, russia, and so germany has indicated that they feel that they agree with you. When you talk with European Commission president was talking about europe needs to take more initiative. I think that thats what shes talking about. Bringing more ideas to the, to the table and not just being a passive partner, but at being an active one, youre absolutely right. Stacey, but it should be more the lip service if i now look how do i make that happen in Coalition Governments . The social democrats, i know, we all know that they are not eager to do is that what they are asked to do . So as a is the willingness of the thomas law and of c. Minister of defense. She was even more outspoken, but seem to have to make a texan, its not just that you say we are willing. So there is no political will to look, lets bring jamie because i mean, im interested. We, you, we heard the joe biden said america must lead lead in what direction . Well, joe biden wants to kind of reintegrate america into multilateral institutions. He wants to tackle global issues like Climate Change. His team also talks about picking up where the trumpet, ministration left off on china and working more with allies. So these are all topics which i think theyll be a lot of, you know, heads nodding in europe and here in berlin. Support of that sort of agenda. My question about setting aside the tactics where i think President Trump often inserted himself unnecessarily into our allies politics and made it difficult for them to work with us. Joe biden take a different approach, but Americans Still want to see results, and thats the unfortunate we had 8 years of the obama administration. Obama was beloved and greeted by the crowds of thousands of people at the sago soil, a very close relationship with chancellor merkel. But he still privately criticized germany and other allies as free riders. He was frustrated by the same things. The president was frustrated about President Trump just vocalize those concerns and started to produce some results. And so i think the, the question is going to be after a change in tone will abide, administration be able to produce results on any number of these issues. And i think thats what americans across the political spectrum are going to be looking for, given that the biden team seems convinced that this different approach will also be successful and producing results. Ok, so just as joe biden clearly and understandably believes his primary domestic responsibilities, protecting americans from the corona pandemic, he apparently sees protecting the planet from Global Warming, is his number one Foreign Policy challenges and wants to get serious on the very 1st day of his presidency. And bring the us back into the paris Climate Action agreement. Climate change climate to Global Warming is a nexus, its a threat to humanity and we have no moral to do with leading scientists who world we dont have much time is a supporter of the democrat has several times that he wants to from which with on trade policy, confrontational stance with china in the hope that this will bring jobs back to the us and boost the special immediately. What does joe biden good question, big question, so much to talk about down to come to mind around the world at the moment, afghanistan, yemen, ethiopia, libya, syria . Yes, joe biden, going to make the world a safer place . Well, i think that hes going to try, and i think that hes going to try to Work Together with allies that pushed, pushed aside. I think challenge joe biden is going to face a similar challenge. The one that barack obama faced, he wanted to work with allies, he wanted to lead, but the American Public is still in a disengagement mood. Its not just trump voters that are less interested in whats going on in the world. If you look at polling prior to the elections, very few americans were factoring in Foreign Policy when they went to the voting booth. And so i think hes going to not just reach out, need to reach out to allies, but also needs to convince the American People that these are crises that require American Leadership. Especially when it requires some sort of economic or military commitment from the United States and countries working together, nations working together, what is what is going to be thinking as he looks on and sees all these events unfolding in the u. S. At this point in time . Biden is not a good message for putin because donald trump week, for reasons we dont totally know, maybe was a terrific person, for example, this is kind slogans. So it will be a world for putin. But generally, i would say as the conflicts you mentioned, i mean, the biden is a good president. We dont make that judgment whether there will be war in syria in 5 years in libya or not even more important question is, will the west, the old west come together again and have a common interest and a common policy . China Climate Change, maybe also iran, but thats already is a 2nd from, from my point of view. It is important, but most important things is unite domestically the American Population and unites the west in a partnership. Not in the American Leadership with some fellow us. Youre very right about that. Stacey and Climate Change isnt good. Opened up was a conversation, for example of those germans more has to come and we have to agree on a common approach to china to Climate Change and trade. Ok, jamie, you have, you have spent some of the time in your life studying Great Power Competition between the u. S. On one hand and russia, and china on the other. How should joe biden stand up to vladimir putin, xi jinping . I think in both cases, honestly, despite the rhetoric you often heard from President Trump, his administration actually laid up path that joe biden going to follow both with russia. Where the u. S. Reassured our Central European allies deploying to help defend them from russian aggression. And on china, laying out a strategy about how to deal with chinas use of technology against the west and its efforts to infiltrate or to i think joe biden just want to pursue a different tone, will want to actually reach out and insult allies. But i dont actually dont think is a significant course correction from where the u. S. Was already headed under donald trump. And to what extent is trade policy Foreign Policy . To what extent are we going to see more trade war, memorial, trade confrontation, or are we going to see some trade reconciliation and some job growth creation . I think theyll be an attempt from the, by the ministration to pursue trade reconciliation, especially with the e. U. However, the era of grand ambition and trade, i think, is, has gone for the forseeable future. If you look at joe bidens platform, hes very clear that hes focused on shoring up the u. S. Economy. On making sure the trade is fair, that it doesnt deprive americans of jobs. And so in terms of transatlantic trade agenda, i think its going to be a very many of minimal agenda focused on repairing some of the damage the donald trump. And we began with talking about Climate Change not being very important on joe bidens agenda. And hes also facing the challenge of bringing americans together. Thats a classic Foreign Policy field where americans couples agree surely on Climate Change. I mean, well i think that there are so Many Americans and im still puzzled by this that i dont believe that Climate Change is actually a thing. So i think part of his challenge is to try to explain to them what it is and how it affects them. And then also if he can bring and more jobs, that maybe that will even if you dont really care about the climate in the planet which everybody should, maybe this will be an incentive for people to do so because they see that, oh, most of these jobs are coming into and to my area. The hard thing about Climate Change will not agree on a European American agenda that will be hard enough. Thats a really important challenge. The important part is to get china into a climate. China is the biggest polluter. If you let china out of the game, we cant do anything really important in Climate Change. So that will be the new challenge. And also that we need to pressure from europe and the United States together on china, not to beach climate neutral in 2060, that fata late have to start now and they have to get sansa chinese, the chinese when they see joe biden coming down wages. I think this is a tough guy. Oh, this is it. This is a pushover for us. It is a polite, tough guy. I think the chinese would love to get the, by the ministration wrapped up in 4 years of negotiations related to climate. Because thats 4 years where the by the ministration will then not have the bandwidth to be talking about human rights abuses about hong kong about chinese technological infiltration of western democracy as leaders of the weaker. So i think thats going to be that could be an early tactic. You see from beijing to act like theyre very interested in a climate discussion and kind of put out the bait for joe biden to take you to an extent you are in terms of a lot of the things youve done in your career. Youre been a bit of it insulated. You have any clues for us about sort of where joe biden is going to go for who the who his secretary of state is going to be some clues as to where, you know, this is going in the, in the, in the next couple of weeks. Well have to see whether theyre concerned about a republican senate, if theres a republican senate, he has to get his keep his cabinet positions through the senate. And so he might go with someone like tony blinken, his long time Foreign Policy advisor, a secretary of state whos seen as a rather centrist choice. So i think would get a lot of republican support as you well know, just just just a word of what you need expect immediately from joe biden, because he is easy. Hes dyed in the wool in terms of being of Foreign Policy expert. He was in the Senate Foreign Affairs Committee even think, 36 years, 12 years that yemen, you know, was going to do 1st things. The 1st thing he will do is open the arms to whats europeans, all trust of allies. He will send an envoy to go to brussels to berlin, paris as barack obama was then was president ial biden in 2009 at the beginning. So that will be the 1st step. But then we have to follow up with substantial agreements, what priorities . And in the end, we might end up that our priorities, both priorities lie in asia and how to handle china. I think thats the way biden sees it. If you see, i think he sees china is his number one concern for the years to come. Its a same way stacey is joe biden, going to make the world a better, a safer place by it cant be any worse than donald trump in my view. Well leave it to that kind of story. Not going to go on the next in the way that the american Foreign Policy is going to develop in the next couple of weeks and months by, by and chips. Sprint, a man to nice for single mothers in albania is especially difficult. The organization but different we can provide support to families in need for donations and volunteer efforts. Little treat those 30 minutes on a d, w. It was the 1st International Tribunal in history. The nuremberg trials, 75 years ago, high ranking officers of the nazi regime were indicted by the allied forces. They were the 1st war criminals to be held accountable for their crimes. Our 2 part series, the 3rd reich in the talks. In 75 minutes on t. W. Who else of the morning can i sleep because youre for using love in this law. Rude small all over to me. Oh, goodness knows theres no use. No love for the wicked was a real world accusing the cloak and sleep are accustomed to swallow. This is data news lines from the day in france marks the 5th anniversary of one of the worst terrorist attacks in its history by islamist militants killed, 130 paid to live venues across paris, including at the back home theater, told to a survivor. And also ask if theres ways to stop counting people from becoming batticaloa. Honest, also coming up as the conflict in a field appears north until region intensifies and Government Troops say theyre making gains, reports are coming in that a large number of so
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