In this turbulence arena but of course its both a party to the conflict as in syria and to peace efforts so our question is moscow in the middle east who is in the power broker and. Thanks very much for joining us on to the point and my guests here in the studio include her get up on arm who is a freelance journalist from lebannon she says russia wants to be in a position to ease all worsen tensions in the region that will deepen migration flows to europe and continue kyra saying america and its allies are also with us is about american support for the w. s Russian Department and he points to a russian saying that goes wholly space its never seen russia has filled the vacuum created by others. And a very warm welcome to Daniel Gallup editor in chief of the middle east course of the senate and the new argues that in the middle east russia is making 30 efficient use of its a very limited resources which can be said for countries in the west intrigue you heard that thank you all 3 for being held like to begin with your akita full blown war between the u. S. And iran appears to have been avoided for the time being but where does that leave us in the middle east and what can you tell us about the role of russia in the region. Well of course i mean if we look at the last few years in the middle east of course we can all agree that russia has gained more weight. Recently especially in places like in syria and recently in libya but i think this is all because the americans have chosen to step back from the region at least militarily and at the moment politically they dont seem to be interested in and they coming any any peace deals or being involved much so when russia so that void i mean we can go back to this and the course of the conversation to speak of all started but the russia saw an opportunity that its can step in and try and really embrace the fact that it was once a big power in the world at once a big power and been really still a snow is once again the german magazine cicero described russia or is the central actor in the whole mideast region is that over the top result plausible i think it is a little bit over the top i mean it is as i said it is only a big part of the moment because the americans have chose to be if the americans decide to step back and decide to be involved as they once were then the russians would not stand a chance to stay the big powers the big the big players they out at the moment but want to be russia is resurgent at the moment moscow has a real clout in this region were without a doubt how do you explain the return to power and influence from your perspective while russia has a very strong and very long history of military presence in syria and libya from the soviet times Russian Troops and Russian Defense were delivered to syria from late if you 2 years you know very base there until the collapse of the soviet union the same for you the russian government soviet government was one of the 1st in the world to recognized. Qaddafi as a hint of state after the putsch and the year after. That Russian Troops are present in libya as well so its a quite the historical link but theyre both country and now we have 20 years put in the power in russia last year in december so huge doing step by step reconstruction of the russian influence not to the soviet level of course but im quite agree with you that the russian trying to use does not limit not more putri sources its have but limited resources but very very smart very very small indeed i just wonder. At the beginning of the show we have this quote from you holy spaces never empty was not all of it its about if you leave some space its not about geopolitics its a general life. Rise from the altar icemans saying if you leave a space rich is very attractive to many parts many many participants someone will jump on the so if america leaves a place or europe leaves someone didnt jump jump in and try to them in the space and its those not only for me though its just done you know theres a certain fascination for russia even i have to admit among the analysts among the people that are dealing with the middle east professionally. Sometimes the middle east experts jokingly saying that the reason why we are so fascinated with russia is because one of us made it to the top of the country because im talking about of course they used any pinnacle was very influential in very influential soviet leader and it was a middle east expert and very eloquent arabic speaking but beyond this. There is myth and there is reality of course and the russian role is important but the strategies and tactics that russia applies are not so difficult to decipher and secondly i think it would be easy to follow the example of russian policies in the middle east europe could do that very easily but then it would have to stop caring about human rights it would stop caring about values whatever the russians challenged is well used and it would have to abandon certain of its Foreign Policy principles and thats the dilemma because what russia does basically is stabilizing governments they consider legitimate and. We thought we handled it well no its something i think about values based policy of course not of course none of this is something that is completely i would say anathema to the russian Foreign Policy but its something that they consider hypocritical and a western idea and so they say our the Foreign Policy argument goes we are with the state we are with the government regardless of expenses and. Russia is not limited by our limitations or so from imitations of the reservoir theres no talks of democracy in russia or very loose russia is very pragmatic and their Foreign Policy. Having thats why is that actions were never bothered by all the massacres that happened in syria. And there were facilitated by the russians made when when decided in 2015 when he said the russians will never go that he talking about the russian the russian policymakers the russian the very there is i mean because of the russian going to help me by having that russia has no one who is a true bite i am if you look back in the 2nd tour and just now for the same script apply to syria which was a player purchase now in a 2nd for your destroy the mother rights and then you destroy the extremist and then you establish a stability of it nor regret it in no cost and that you have people involved by the way because it was putins war at least with regard to the 2nd message is not no its not a new script its quite right all for us or us to have no limitations no very lives but just clearly russia is here to stay reflecting what you were saying about the just the fascination that some german commentators have with really germans by the way and also became really didnt want to see one senior german spokesman recently describe russia as indispensable so clearly russia we mightnt i dont know im not im not sure whos going to break the lines here for a lot of my putin today but we might not like. Policies but the but theyre here to stay i think i think they have put in has and this is probably the strategic i dont want to call it genius but the strategic advantage of food in your daily. Genius is really i dont want to step back for from this dont want to express that too much admiration for this because if you analyze it as a few notes of difficult he put himself in if into a position from which he can benefit from all the mistakes that others make in the region and he can somehow he can digest. Something that the others cannot and and by and by these Means Project power and this is a situation of really unique situation and also what is interesting is like weve been probably we will talk about the war of narratives that a boy on is the syria war is it a western conspiracy as Many Russians believe is it just like a terrorist uprising an attempt to destabilize the region or even to to oust russian interests in the region we have a lot of narratives going on my fascination my main rather intrigued i have to say also when i travel to moscow to talk to russian experts about this is that it doesnt really matter there is kind of you know theyre going to go there that is that they seem to be comfortable with with with these conflicting narratives as long as there is no western narrative that dominates and. I find this very very interesting aspect of Foreign Policy also if is it true that assad used chemical weapons or is it not true is it true that ever there is a conspiracy against the Syrian Government because the western countries wanted to allegedly establish a gas pipeline from the gulf to the mediterranean which would compete with russian interests no matter there is a lot of theories and a lot of narratives around and my feeling is that russia the russian the official russian state lets say or proponents of the official russian state narrative can very well live with these conflict narratives because it helps them to project their power in the region. Putin may or may not be a genius but he has certainly played a county game and filling the vacuum thats come with this slow withdrawal of the United States from the middle east and as a result russia is now perhaps the key broker in the rich. In turkey syria iran israel saudi arabia in egypt and libya more and more strongman around the mideast are building closer ties with Vladimir Putin. And he provides incentives in syria his troops are fighting to defend Bashir Al Assad regime in return russia gets to military bases on syrian territory nato southeastern tip. Countries in the region are buying russian Weapons Systems even nato member turkey. Russian Nuclear Plants are also in demand russia provides them fully operational to egypt for example and promises investments along the suez canal. Offers Diplomatic Services as well mediating for instance between arch enemies iran and saudi arabia and between syria and turkey and between war torn libya and german chancellor angela merkel. Has russia ousting the United States as power broker in the mideast. Just in a moment we were talking about the methods being employed by the russian leadership. Tell us a little bit more about what the strategic goal where does he want to take all this. Well 1st of all as mentioned there establishment russia is a major original power not the worlds power but the major Regional Power in the middle east back to the old soviet not to the golden age of the soviet influence and in the region that we are closing to loose security 1st varity peace theres not talks about democracy or human rights from russian side and what i wanted to mention as well that in the russian Public Opinion syria doesnt play a huge role so there are politics do what they were they want in russian army as well on the ground but there are public is not as much as concerned of the happenings in syria or leave as it wasnt its now not concerned or they actually applauded then and not really consider their own time to time have messages from russian contractors killed didnt leave it on the office level denies the involvement because its a private contractors which are on the ground in libya from private companies. Theyre time to times news about People Killed or injured in libya really were back 2 or 3 men to russia but on the offer solutions of the numbers are very low really has to be said you know i have no because of the number because the russians dont deploy like massive troops like the american thats in the movie miracle where they just send mainly experts and they deploy small number of troops maybe because russia is incapable of sending like a big number of troops its ministries is lots of very well. Went tell you and it lacks way behind the American Military when it comes to to financing it so it doesnt really have that much money to be able to fund all its ambition in the region and militarily its cannot its cannot support that i mean aside from sending experts and trying to politically play on long. Use its leverage to mediate between some parties its i mean its better if its aimed at the moment from if it has managed to have. To be said that has managed to bid good the relations with the gulf is with the gulf countries especially saudi arabia despite all the differences between them on several topics just how it was in syria but they managed to agree on the oil market to be able to Work Together to stabilize their own life markets and were look at this is you just wrote off like how theyre dealing with their potential opponents and enemies the the friendship or lets say the very very personal and at the same template technical relationship between the other one and putin is something really fascinating to see like how those heads of state in the region that are really afraid of russia because they say like the americans are far away but the russians can do us harm and we and we know they can do us harm and so they go to moscow and this is a fast and if you look at the Syrian Opposition the Syrian Opposition has i think rightfully claim that russia is responsible for many casualties many dead in the war in syria actively and directly responsible however the Syrian Opposition has always gone to moscow its always been open to moscow never tried to alienate moscow too much because they were afraid but also because they thought that its absolutely important to to entertain relationships with moscow the russians have also brought up the negotiations and the attempts to bring in some Political Solutions alongside the military solution. The Constitutional Committee in syria thats being much talked about that is currently meeting or not currently but that that has started before geneva thought it maybe felt failed to be 40 even started but this committee was a russian project and the United Nations implemented this because they said that if the russians want this we will do it in order to be able to have the initiative doesnt mean that its a successful as it has recently youre right there might have the initiative has but doesnt mean that theyre capable of making them get to places all right but theyre but theyre theyre trying to offer a different scenario ive recently talked to a. Pretty i think influential Foreign Policy expert from russia was that the war in syria for us was a successful startup. But as every start up can be considered a cynical statement about if you look if you look at what would have the consequences but whoever he said it was it was a successful start a bit like every start of you need to have an exit you need to sell it and we havent actually found a way to sell the start of successfully so they are trying theyre trying to keep the political process ongoing also to Gain International legitimacy and at the same time during this time they have bought try to find a military solution but i think the russians are honest about something they know that just conquering every bit of syrian territory with the bashar assad is not enough they need to find a political solution and they havent found it so its an extent as a vacuum within a vacuum and a lot of people are saying the read the europeans should be doing more is there are they right to say thats and if yes what should the europeans be getting up to what he has of course the europeans should do more because the of the europeans are the 1st suffered hours of anything that happens in the middle east and we saw the consequences of the syrian war on europe that it did not did not suffer from from the consequences it was germany particularly that suffered from the over 1000000 refugees from syria thats came here so of course that appears to me to do more but if we look at the history of Europe Europes relation with russia its been really like nonexistent because we were the member in 2008 when russia had her small war with georgia and it was over a few days reprieve europeans response was not like major and then there was also the other russians adventure in ukraine when they took over crimea and the europeans only imposed some small sanctions but russia 5 that it can get away with anything its doing basically and this made her feel empowered to go further and start in syria as well the 1st kind of country which was harmed by war and sort of was not germany but was turkey which got 2 millions of refugees red letter and if you want job done like my i dont know if jordan in almost 1000000 but there was no much talk in your about the refugee cry. Jordan lebanon or turkey before 2015 because it was not us but it was a very matter what magneto cited politics sure didnt lets just talk continue on the theme that the europeans they have tended traditionally to stand aside and leave the dominant role in the middle east in diplomacy at least to the more influential americans take one look at the current conflict in libya and you can see why after all they dont even have a shared strategy. Libyas defacto strongman is cozy for have tar the fieldmarshal was long an asset of the cia he and his Libyan National army large parts of the country under their control and routed the islamist militias now his troops are poised to take the capital tripoli. Internationally recognized as libyas president. But his power is limited to the greater to poly area he receives military support from turkey and libyas former colonial power italy. France and russia back qatar the putin denies sending military support. If there are russian citizens there they do not represent the interests of the russian state and do not receive money from the russian state new belief. In the coming days the warring factions will tempt to negotiate a cease fire in berlin. In the squabbling european players and russia agreeing on a common approach to libya. The crisis in libya. Together calling for u. S. Libya peace conference in this coming weekend what can we expect for realistically you know well both both have so far failed in there to solve this conflict and its interesting that are now standing together russia has tried to broker a peace deal between sessions russia will supported the general. Operation took on the other side. Refused to sign this. For the moment. Of the cease fire lets say he said he needs to get the backing off his tribal allies in libya before maybe he didnt want to be seen also as as a sort of a to russian interests and like show that he has a certain degree of independence the german approached. Was to talk to all the parties involved the United Arab Emirates saudi arabia Turkey Russia egypt algeria. France and italy and others to make sure that they do bilateral talks with all of these parties before somehow understand their interest and then bring them together to one table and this happens happening now i think there is a realistic chance that they could force the warren potus into a cease fire because the government of the internationally recognized government has has no option has to agree with it because its militarily very weak and on the other hand made. All his supporters if you refuses to sign this ceasefire but what were not sure about to what degree his supporters is that cars are honest about about this because it could very well be that they speculate that house would conquer tripoli the capital of libya and then goods just like broker a cease fire according to his own terms and so they have to make sure that his supporters his backers are really honest about wanting the cease fire and then i think this conference can ultimately be successful. Yeah i mean this is another this is an authentic actually by russia to prove that it can broker a deal it is or it is a big player and it can be seen as a mediator and working together with germany could that be a template for other peace initiatives or peace efforts in the region while the germans or the russians have a good worker relations anyway its a little its a growing relationship. To the noise of the americans mostly but i mean we didnt we have to not forget that this process is also headed by the United Nations and the knobs nations have seek the help of the europeans when it failed to get an agreement in the in the Security Council because of the big divisions between the russians and the western allies so yes it could i mean this could get to places and if it does then russia would feel more empowered basically as a big player on the international scene. We come back to the same question of Vladimir Putin is he a war monger over a peacemaker not has been the theme of the show im very interested in in the light of these initiatives around libya and possible other all initiatives you know tell tell me about what his role really means i think this summit than burning there will be a success for russian diplomacy because putin aura is back on the war stage this time and there will be huge no no reason how the result of the conference will be if any results at all but that distracting the Public Opinion in the war from the ukraine from the crimea on the book involved in your korean drama theyre going to mark norman the approach of completely gun youre talking about iran syria and libya and its a more politics and middle east is much more important to small regions and that is the new principle in this part of the russian political arguing thats a success. But whats got me the price we should be we should really be aware of this and i think and its realistic just of so. Put in well ask for a price able ask for for a compensation for his effort also to support a European Initiative that is going to be set like he wants to talk about sanctions against russia because we always talk about sanctions against libya against syria but lets not forget that what is really harmful in video hurting russian establishment lets say about russian leadership are the individual sanctions against Many Russians because of. What happened in ukraine and crimea and i think if the russians side with the europeans in their peace efforts they will. Will will have to pay a price for that and i think thats what putin is going to demand and probably a whole has already something to look forward to going through to the weekend to greggy to just one more question that we said that we would come back to weve got trump the impulsive american president theoretic american president weve got Vladimir Putin the opportunistic russian leader if you so will the genius dog gene. This these 2 gentlemen is going to whip out i mean definitely out of the traps administration have made it much easier for russia to be involved more in the middle east of course the started before with obama when he broke his the deadline threats and he didnt offend syria but made it much quicker when he decided to pull out his the american soldiers from syria and left the scene for the russians who is going to weigh in with depends if another one is the elections next year again. Going to stay in power. For. The one thing we do know for sure apparently. We speculate. Very much for joining us on the point today. Showing up. Back next week until. Tomorrow. Come. On. Board. Or. Where i come from will have to fight for a free press and was born and raised in a military dictatorship with just one t. V. Shadow and a few newspapers with official information as a journalist i have worked on the streets of many can trust and their problems are all of the same 14 the social inequality a lack of the freedom of the press and corruption we can afford to stay silent when it comes to the fans of the human sense in the microphones who have decided to put their trust in us. My name is jamie paris and i work a day w. Our. Favorite. And the book that in our new combativeness america. Told us that. Im. A. Parent who has family. And im appalled when. I woke. Up. There my i was. Well were arming. The gallo who were at the mall and i. Went out i met. This guy out. This is g. W. Newsline but from berlin tonight an historic moment in the United States as the impeachment trial against president almost trying to get to. The floor to. Present and ready to present the articles of impeachment which have been conferred by the house of representatives against donald john from the president of the United States. The chief prosecutor adam schiff formally begins from this impeachment trial as new evidence for