This set of men because they are sick but the husbands still wants them to keep giving birth. Africas population is growing fast predictions say that by the 2100 bill before point 5000000000 africans thats about a 3rd of the entire global population so were here in kano the most populous state in the most populous country in africa to find out how exactly that future will look for africa and id like to begin by asking my panelists a general question do you think that the population growth in africa will be a blessing if you believe so please raise your hand interesting do you think its going to be a cause species raise your hand. Oh wow so it looks like were really split 5050 lets see if its the same answer at the end of this debate its my i want to begin with you because you work for the Population Reference Bureau here should we trust these numbers are they accurate and where do they even come from for me the numbers because when you look at the investment the agencies like unicef are putting into into into research and i think you have no other reason than this. Statistic. Is something i have thought about but you dont trust your local government or you even your National Government figures i dont think because. Its going to be an. Interest you know so the numbers might not be extremely precise but we know that africans are going to increase and i want to come to sign up because youre an advocate for children and adolescents and specifically against Child Marriage and i want to find out from you why do you think africans are increasing in population where the rest of the world the trend seems like theyre decreasing where because there are some months. Population is increasing day by day and we are not doing anything about it in. The increase. Of brains. Age and. This is causing a lot of problems. And let me come to you because youre working for an organization that actually deals with young boys who have been sort of abandoned or left by the wayside to what extent is overpopulation already affecting the state of congo yeah i think in so many positive and also very many negative you know just like the working on which is that much of the education. Bin can you just explain to all of us who might not understand what is an out of marjories someone who travels from one point to another in starts focus on the education that is what is so over time due to so many factors overpopulation inclusive you know this margery system has been abandoned by the government and the numbers are too high the children are too much so the infrastructure stretched and the moslems that is there tootles can no longer cutoff for you know the basic needs of the hence the turn into child street bagus thats a very good description thank you for that a so mr director general were hearing that resource is a stretched thin are you feeling it when you are governing are you feeling that you dont have enough money to get to the last person enough schools enough hospitals indeed it is very true that facilities stretched at the moment we have 3000000 children in public primary schools this is a side of the number we have and schools as well as schools to which means a little forms needed to my needs the education of these children and the government at the moment there is no top of these funds so if the government doesnt have money to take care of the people that it has right now how is nigeria going to take care of itself in the future zeinab i want to come back to you because i really want to get to the heart of this why then are we not we having 5. 7 children thats the average age of number of births paul woman in nigeria compared to one point something in europe why are we still having so many children if its not working if we cant afford it because we lack i think access to probably plenty and i think you are a product that has rights and we are growing to leave without any need like. I said in the post place and also do. Really jones im quite tired proctors that is a pity in that also because of the way they do do you see some of my rage and the parmalee seized him all day not so all these contribute to debt you will find out that some even have to have the access because of the. Inclination that be at touched they still holds on to dads so what does the slum see about this islamic the number of feet for a given area is thompson to do is the resources exist and there nigeria being one of the poor for this nation in africa has abundant resources that can for everton but we have been serious problem is management this is why things are going there we seeing it. As far as religion is concerned you can have many children so long as you can take care of them all what are you trying to say in islam. That is the court has the will of the teton number of children that 1 may get because he his actions his books and what type you is welcome. To create it then you cannot have a mistake in what. He says why eve you have to drink no matter the number of children if there is Good Governance there would be no problem let me come back to the director general of media at the Governors Office we are hearing that you are actually the reason why overpopulation could be a problem its not the number of people thats a problem its the fact that youre mismanaging the resources that are available no jury as a country is likely in terms of quality population data if you do a top quality population data there is noone we you can pull on for the people you misgovernance all. Please rule in the type of population we have in the quality of population we have what do you mean the quality. Of quality population of an educated. Population that can initiate ideas for the good of the general society let me come to me because you have an initiative that sort of m. Powering young people with regard to this do we have the quality people that the director general is talking about what i think we dont have quality people we dont have the quality we have everything absolutely poor people are too much of making noise or making the actions we produce the number of children. Because desist them does not provide that and if you come to Northern Nigeria you have over 1000 women dying just because. You dont have access to those facilities and that Family Planning is one of the key thing that we must remember to conceive. Family planning is providing a woman to have the opportunity to space pregnancy from one delivery to another one so that she can be strong. But the major problem is that the government who is supposed to be actually do your research and then the Civil Society organizations who is supposed to come together be complementing the government effort the onus will be. On the government as it was so i took another chance to look hard disk issue its not about the Government Community people that parents have to role if you dont see every individual have a role to play in the community to make this change if we dont see that we continue having a go between disown them part of this country developing on the northern part of politicians spend more time fighting them some of the detriment of the future of young people and the ok so youve given me quite a number of points but i want to go to the in my media key because youve mentioned Family Planning and this sounds like its in contradiction to what your teachings are saying so weighs the balance between religion culture and really just being rational. For lenin islam is allowed when there are problems but it is not allowed when it is intentionally mad to check the wheel the idea of let me how 2 people or 3 people relate how other people are doing in their culture is prohibited so youre not agreeing with this yes i am against what the human is saying about the religion is saying you can get as much as children there you want their religion says you can get shouldnt but you can you can get shouldnt they you can get out for so i am against that whats the in saying that you can have a lot of children yes i know muslims in the islamic it says we should have children but we can have that you know we can take care of them is again was a point of correction the what i said is almost contrary to what she said because i believe in islam islam does not allow you to marry more than what you can afford. You either one. If you cannot even if you cannot marry one you are instructed to. But the issue of having a law like they are seeing theyre trying to impose it will able to produce because i know its so general. So this is what i want people to know this is why the law is having problem in house of assembly is National Assembly is because you come up with a law partly religiously accepted practically religiously and not accepted so this is why people are allowed to come up with that will be in line was a religion even the issue of but surely should the law be secular it should be bias i mean unbiased so that it can be followed by people of what all walks of life we in can know we have the right to operate our according to the dictates of our culture and that cannot be in line with those who are not like this so this is way house of assembly is it going if you have us laws that has some contrasts in it cannot pass so what then happens if we continue to have all the number of children that we can and as we are hearing the resources are still not going to be available what next then the next is said Good Governance that is through Good Governance that we will report and now for resources to education if we put enough resources to education that will give sound education to people and will sound education we will be able to develop other sectors of life i just want to read a quote from mohammed so no see the 2nd who you all know here the enemy of congo and he was recently of the Un General Assembly and other side event he said and i quote the resources have shrunk and the population has increased youre not going to stop that by having government spend money youve got to address cultural attitudes what age to girls marry how many children do girls have how many wives do men have so hearing this from the enemy and hearing what youre telling me it sounds like youre speaking from 2 different pages exact. Really you know one thing going if you will be allowed was one child if they mismanagement of resources you will end up in for betty unemployment and hungry so whatever the case maybe if the little resources we have dismissed money its so no matter the number of children yourself ok so youre not agreeing with this ismael you see let me give us a very very disturbing statistics and condom we have over 10000000 people live in kind of state and out of that at 1000000 people in kind of state almost 3000000 children are out of school and out of that 3000000 lets give this one aside and talk about the number of unemployed youth we have over 3000000 unemployed youth in congo but go out and look at the number of marxists we have around and look at the number of just we have what we have almost 370 fortresses and kind of state we have almost 45404000 bucks in chemistry the 50 functioning industries the center of Commerce Center of commerce we have 30000000 out of School Children kind of state but we have a government that when too far we china. To collect of a list 2000000000 not to Beauty School for the children but to be used as a life really and you see in that you know you have you have countered that in judea almost all 50000000 girls. Might it out before the age of 18 and 15000000 deals in means the nestea going to produce and the 50000000 children what is the government doing for these kids it is known by everybody here that our government or the government of coniston recently declared free and compulsory education for every child from pretty basic to basic to Senior Secondary School there is a special focus on girls it is meant to give some amount of cash to parents of girls on condition that these girls will attend school continuously ok allow me to talk to because i know you talked about quality people who go through quality education and i heard it said that in some classrooms up to 400 pupils in one class so it can be Free Education but is it quality education we came to government about 4 years ago and met this situation and road we decided to devote a substantial amount of our budget to constructing additional classrooms in primary secondary and even intensity is true since this is an issue you will address gradually its not something that you can just say ok it was today let me construct 2 classes for all the children in town let me ask for them because were hearing the governor say the government is trying give us time maybe by the year 2030 itll be a ratio of one to 10 students in the classroom but by that time more children have been born one of the immediate risks yeah the media at risk of yours that is why. It is a chunk of number for young people abusing drugs that is why we have so many unemployed youth and some of the things i feel the government needs do is 1st of all to cop corruption because i dont agree that we dont have enough resources in that you know in kind its just not the way it was the resources are poured down you know along the line every hour every Office Something would be caught out so you see by the time it comes down to implementation you will not see any in part. By the government to stop thinking out of the box there are so many opportunities that we work in in development a scene you know advise in the government to latch on to this opportunity you know in terms of funding in terms of Technical Support ok but thats because were looking at now and the future where then should we had let me speak to him so i think is a listen to any country it depends on do with the government is managing the affairs of the government for example agreement with. Him for example in china most population. And the most important part of any country. Now is the most important and. You have i could because we would have expansion in the mystic market investment in our. Resources to the issue is just. Unfair on what. Id like to come to you because were talking about having children and i want to understand to what degree do women have the agency not necessary for Family Planning but even to space their children how much of a say do women have in this country actually i do think they have a lot of say because i just had a baby 5 months ago so i took awfully immunization and there were like 200 women in the queue so i was like my husband and i decided to space you know to birth and i like lets go and. Check out the child spacing unit honestly. 5 to 6 women. Out of that 5 to 6 women i think 3 of them came on their own but the hospital said do you have to bring the husband or a written letter from him signed that he has agreed you know for them to do this piecing why or why is i dont you know maybe. When you talk about these issues. Because of the issue of gender equality. And in disagreement. And just say it like he went out talking about education because it goes i educated all these issues will go down so they are not have actually because. This is something that we have been yet when we. Realize even if this it is realized. Is not even sustainable because. The ladies to go see young guys will be getting married its like 1415 even if. It was caught up on you with good might even if you said there are people just but its a lot of young girls going to see we. Dont get the opportunity to complete its. All these problems and they are not even making any effort to have a bill and to sign a bill of rights and so that it will address at least these. Education ok let me come to the director general because you spoke directly to him that the idea of Free Education is really incompatible with whats happening right now because youre not even addressing things like Child Marriage indeed things like child murders i should mention that we have this arrangement. Supported by the deify d i v condition the grand scheme where we give monies person goes to allow them. Continue. To secondary school level let me find out what is that what it will a consequence is if a parent is found to have given their child out for marriage when theyre too young you refused to take your child to education. Process would be. A. Legal process. Im not a lawyer. I thought it would be like a well known law but ok i want to come back to i should because i. Might my worry here is this set of women like i met a woman at the child spacing unit she said shes 31 years old she came without without her husband and she was like please can my husband write the letter and signed so they should just give it to them i was like why i like whats happening like shes 39 and the last press she had she had she had complications and shes just tired she has 8 children so she doesnt want to you know do it anymore but the husband is insistent that she has to do it again and his salary is just 15000 naira a month so. Its not even realistic so my worry is what is going to happen to this set of women because a lot of them are out there the are tired sick but the husbands which are not even able to take care of them still wants them to keep giving birth. To let me just quickly. We dont have because by definition a concept of a population is when. A country or a place is. So if you look at for example. We have. A lot of opportunities and then the other part of it is not. Just. By the way have you have been the mom which is actually right its not against that. What is some of the. If it is for the improvement of the health of your mother because by the time when is pregnant no and then she give birth to the after 3 months 4 months she could become pregnant the body is not back to its normal and this is where we have many months now mortality in Northern Nigeria so i think its now time for us to start coming together government sponsibility is not only law but implementing the people that are closed doors that we elected were presenting was our representative from the state to decide if you would and im looking forward to see that we are calling them back on them to say desist what we want guys if not next number is not going to be taken you know we are going to impeach you and dump you in prison so i havent you done that already because nigeria has been independent for many years because the way it would to to do it would succeed in dividing the whole population of the young people people to do this political groups and then you see the other one when by themselves calling themselves to increase themselves many many dead to descend go friends sort of descend out of syria ok ok one second i want to come to you because i read something you said that the mindset of north of nigeria is about 200. 00 or 3 years olds it needs it needs to be updated ok what can we do then to change this mindset so that the number of young people who are coming into the population a productive innovative all these things were talking about we have to do our values you know from thinking like my brother was seen from thinking that ok if im poor im married to another wife to knowing that im responsible for my family for their clothes for what they eat on where they live you know and after that we have to also encourage young people to not just good through formal schools you know basic education is ok so let me give you a story just like this. There is too high they are too high that is why you see you know crime you see violence kidnapping bundy tree you know. That is where you see all these things and i think it has a lot to do with population but it also has a lot to do with orientation because according to sean hows that rick link with population so i think these 2 things out have to be done because this risk are too high and you know the danger is too much real intimate like to come back to you. Allow me to ask what would happen if the government of Nigeria Today the federal government said that the problem of population growth is too big in nigeria and we now have to cap the number of children to one per woman without work. Is is just an assumption the question is based on assumption yes of course but im asking you is this something that you think could work in nigeria in cannes or even in africa it will walk somewhere and it will not walk somewhere what is your prediction my prediction is. That. People that is in line with their culture will accept and those that see it as negative will reject this is my assumption its one who we were able to do one thing that is empower and creates awareness and 1000 began to change give them education because these had people that are given by it so if you want a light in them and give them a when is that if you need this is the point is that will happen if there is a population crisis in the country so its left for you to lead the type of the number of children that you are going to be giving birth to you can talk to the husband look im not able to get married because of im not ready to go but because of my Health Condition because you can enlighten them even to people in the areas and once in the city so information for you is what would they mom is refusing but im not going to stay there because i dont want to start a war i would like to ask the question i started with is the population growth in africa were talking about 4000000000. 00 people in the year 2100 is that going to be a blessing who agrees. Is it going to be a curse. It looks like this debate has not swayed anyone left or right i wonder what do you think its been a very exciting debate here in ca no im edith kimani thank you for watching. What keeps us in shape what makes us see. My name is dr costly i talk to medical experts. Watch them at work. And i discuss what you can do to improve your health. Stay tuned and lets all try to stay calm and change. This time on night. Germanys night. Vision contest winner the beloved singer nicole teams up with the hip. British band right said fred and the scene. For. This. Little prayer. In 75 minutes on w. Was the speech of his life perhaps his best certainly his most difficult chancellor helmut kohl and addresses the people of east germany shortly after the fall of the wall. Climbers for germany. Journalist peter lim borg was at the scene. 30 years later looks back on the. Starts december 19th. W. Welcome to the book is the game here. To talk about. The coverage. 3 more. Little we have played lets have a look at something of a must the romney team still shaking in that the breathe a sigh of relief so you dont want to miss. This guy. W. Cut cut cut. Cut. Christmas time double. Play. This is due w. News live from berlin burning out of control bushfires in Australia Combined to form a mega fire near sydney which crews say is too big to put out the countrys largest city is shrouded in a cloud of toxic smoke speak to a correspondent in sydney also coming up swedish climate action