>> well, sad. >> the audience will decide. >> okay. it will certainly be interesting. you're going to see everything just went through this little green visor guy where this huge -- supposedly huge corporation, there is no finance department. there is no controllers. there's no budget directors. when you are running either a ponzi scheme or a dishonest criminal organization, it's got to be very, very isolated. this was very isolated and you're starting to see it here. >> let me get you, donny, to the pardons, because you would know more about this than anyone who can talk to us. these stories that we're getting tonight saying that people -- lawyers saying we're close to rudy giuliani are approaching michael cohen shortly after the raid and they're talking to him about possibilities -- staying in the tent. this kind of code language. what do we know about that? >> well, i'm not at liberty to talk about that, but i will talk about trump as an autocrat. if you're an autocrat and you also operate above the law, what is the most autocratic tool a