very clear. the billionaires who are behind this, the venture capitalists, the wall street guys, are out to make money on public schools. >> so -- i'm sorry -- >> -- there's a vast -- there's a vast difference in quality with charter schools and some of them are fabulous wonderful places and some of them are scams. the issue is when did we stop talking about making sure that every public school is as good as our best public school? when did we stop talking about making sure that every kid had what they needed in their neighborhood public school? it's one thing to talk about a choice. but what if the only choice that these kids are never given is the choice they have to get in a public school in their neighborhood and that is by intention. it's exactly what devos did in michigan. they did it in the poorest