nobody knows about yet. and mueller is going to have a lot to answer for. >> seems kind of easy to send warning shots to somebody you know isn't going to fire back. >> absolutely. this is a pr o fenffensivoffens been negotiating on this interview for eight months now. it's -- it's an exceptionally long time and in that time, you've seen the president's legal team while it's undergone different changes and various phases, they just launch an increasingly aggressive assault on the investigation and so in many ways, you know, you can see how there's a whole school of thought that the president was never going to do an interview, even if he wants to, that was never going to happen and there's been a lot of stalling and that's part of the tactic here. you can see even if he -- if he does decide ultimately that there is no interview, that he's mounted this whole defense about why that is and he's made it so normally in a political sphere,