>> so, heilman has joined the table. i saw that last night. i missed the beginning. i thought he was talking about donald trump. >> the great thing about it is, first of all he's saying -- >> i was flabbergasted. did he get fired? >> we can't take the testimony of a proven liar who is the personal lawyer to the proven liar because, well, how would you possibly know what do? i will say somebody made the point this morning, i believe it was joyce vance who said when you're prosecuting a case, you you don't get to pick your witnesses. your witnesses are chosen by the defendant. the defendant chooses who to commit crimes with. often they choose liars to commit crimes with so you get witnesses who are liars. the question what you do in a court is demonstrate why certain people who are proven liars are believable in this instance because of the accumulation of evidence and others who are proven liars or should not be believed because of another accumulation of evidence. the fact that anyone, the president, michael cohen or anybody else has a history of lying is not relevant to what they're saying in any given instance is true and what the