man, how he's taking this in a way that's very unusual from the typical person under criminal investigation, when i used to investigate people they weren't outside of the courtroom smoking cigars, laughing it up with their friends. they were very concerned, took it in a serious manner. >> which tells you what? >> it suggests to me he doesn't think this is something he should be afraid of. he has a more powerful friend than the prosecutors and perhaps he's expecting a pardon. >> to that point whether he is acting easy breezy because he thinks at the end of the day he's going to get bailed out by trump, asap rocky said i hope the lord takes collect calls. will the white house take a collect call for michael cohen for a pardon before this is over? >> he has to assume that's the only legal problem he's dealing with. there are many people that feel that you have the feds and the state looking at him. and if eric snyderman is looking at him, i have no way of knowing, and you look at state time then you cannot be pardoned