white house lawyer who is responsible for the pardon process. so that sort of puts this in a whole different category when you are looking at it from the criminal perspective. and the one other point i would say that does make it remarkable, regardless of whether it could be part of a technical obstruction of justice charge, it goes to the whole consciousness of guilt that we keep coming back to of what are they trying to hide and why. what were they so afraid of it? i know you asked that and many people have weighed in on that and -- but it is certainly making it clear that they are afraid of what flynn and manafort and likely gates are talking about. >> so nice to speak with you. thank you. miriam rocca here in new york. and turning back to another major story, focuses on north korea and the president tweeted he he is looking forward to meeting with kim jong-un and spoke with xi jinping and saying