joyce vance, what do you make of this, we've been through nixon, we've been through cases where they've tried at the white house to say we can't talk almost like a husband can't testify against his spouse or something like that. how hard is that principle of executive privilege here? >> you know, executive privilege is one of those amorphous legal topics not fully fleshed out. it develops over time in the case law. so the question, does it protect these kinds of testimonial experiences that the white house is trying to apparently shut down? the most interesting aspect of this problem is that so far, the white house has gotten away without having the president actually invoke the privilege. and so none of these witnesses can --s are obligated to avoid answering the questions. bannon could have gone ahead and testified because the white house had not invoked it. we won't see a real test of the privilege until it's invoked until it comes before a tribunal. one thing i do think is correct