don't know any russians, i have nothing to do with russians. he talks about everybody that got involved with the russians as being crazy and treasonous in this book. steve bannon has created -- his contribution is something -- >> absolutely. you don't goad yourself into these meetings with russian operatives, you spoke with michael wolff, you said the sons had a forced infantile relationship with their father. if they're taking meetings. if donald jr. is taking meetings with some lawyer. the idea that he didn't run upstairs to trump tower, wherever the father lives and tell him about the meetings, that goes against everything that we've now learned about the son. >> and ezra, we discovered in michael wolff's book about that famous meeting, donald trump's jr. motivation is that he wanted to move up and take over the