think that the significance of ty cobb's statement if that's what you're referring to -- >> but finding out if the president knew -- this is an interesting point heidi raised. we know that flynn was fired because pence was kept in the dark and pence was mad and the president stood by his vp. we never learned whether or not donald trump was blindsided by any of this information. >> and that is something mueller is going to be interested in. what did donald trump know about what mike flynn was doing? was there discussions that if mike flynn was fired that he might reveal what the president knew? those are the sort of things i would be interested in if i were on mueller's team. that's why i would be making this document request. not so much because i think that you'd fire flynn to an obstruction investigation but because the discussions around what they knew about what flynn knew and what -- and concerns about what he might say about others might reveal a lot about their state of mind and make