lot of time in the news today, for decades. and maybe that's how we need to be thinking about afghanistan. >> all right. and general mccaffrey said afterwards we need to play a bigger role in nation building. this is something the trump administration has said they don't want to do. right? there's a whole contingent here who said it's not our business, we're good at taking out dictators or leaders or bad people, we're not really good at the second part of this. and what we're seeing in libya, in syria, in iraq, in yemen and in afghanistan is our failure to be able to direct that part of the process when you go into a place where there are bad leaders. >> yeah, i don't think we should be trying to remake afghanistan into some sort of a jeffersonian democracy. but i think we can help them battle corruption. i think we can help the ghani government become more effective in governing the country. i don't think our goal should be nation building. again, what's at stake for the united states is making sure it doesn't become a safe haven for al qaeda and the taliban. but i think we can help the