reality i recognize. i've been in a cabinet in two different roles, and there are times when a president disagrees with something that a cabinet member has done and has every right to have a conversation about the cabinet member's performance. but generally and i think properly those are conversations that take place eye to eye, knee to knee, inside the oval office. and believe me, when that happens, cabinet members listen. but to do it in a public way is -- well, let's just say it's a different management style than i think we're accustomed to. >> and one of the things you've noticed as we have noticed is there are a number of republican senators who are former colleagues of jeff sessions, a number of conservatives rallying not only in the senate but in the media as well, rallying to jeff sessions' defense. i'm not sure how smart politically this is for the president. what does it project in terms of what kind of loyalty that he would give to his own people? >> well, presumably donald trump recognized the quality of jeff