insurance, there are millions oof people who will have health insurance but will have even higher deductibles than today. you know, obamacare's not perfect. everybody admits that. it needs improvement in a lot of areas. but relative to what we have today, pass the senate bill, pass the house bill, you will have substantially more americans, in the millions, who will be struggling relative to today. >> mr. binion. >> it's faulty logic to say every dollar the federal government spends on health insurance is the only dollar that could help people. we know from 200 years of american history that the free market and free enterprise delivers the best products. why would we take that out of the health care market? >> you're giving us theoreticals when we're telling you if you take the absolute dollars that you spend to cover people with medicaid, to give people insurance cards and you reduce that by a trillion, that if you -- i mean, in absolute dollars that means fewer people can be helped by the program. if you repeal the medicaid