to play into both the dimensions of this debate and the outcome. you've long held that when i was trying to figure out how will i do this, how will i do this, you said basically on the show, in the end they'll lie about what they did. >> the problem they'll have, though the president just discovered this is complicated and really hard to understand, people will understand when the insurance policies they buy for, let's say, a premium that doesn't go up that much in cost, it's not going up in cost because the benefits have been cut back. the deductibles have been raised. people will get that. the thing about health insurance is as complicated as it is, the cost, the toll on individuals, every consumer, every person in this country, is really clear. that stuff's not complicated. >> and that's when -- when you have statements going out there as donald trump has done, as kellyanne conway has done at different times saying no one who's a current beneficiary of obamacare will suffer in any