you were kids? something that shows your competitive -- were you always a guy winning the squash match or whatever you played? >> i didn't play squash, that's for sure. where do you get that in midland, texas. played baseball, played all the sports. we made up our own sports. we were just competitive in nature. very competitive amongst siblings and also competitive when a sibling is under attack. >> reporter: yeah? you seeing that now? >> huh? >> reporter: you seeing that now? >> yeah. i love the fact that george is stepping up to defend his little brother. so is neil and marvin and my wife is in reno today. it's a family trait that i think is a real blessing. we are a competitive family for sure. >> pretty fascinating sit-down there with jeb bush and msnbc's kasie hunt joins us now to talk about that. one thing we want to put out there, we got a statement from donald rumsfeld about what the discussion about the book is and rumsfeld said bush 41 is getting