"they don't put it quite like that but he's normal, not a gadfly. >> i'd go with authenticity. i don't like the upbeat ad. it's so conventional. >> it's very conventional. >> "i'm a crochety old guy." that's worked for him so far. i don't think making him into george romney let alone mitt romney is going to work. [ laughter ] >> i agree with that but i think the strength here is the weakness. my gut is a lot of people saw him in that first debate and he was an abstraction to them, just this guy. even if you saw him an arena with 10,000 people, he was a little speck, the anti-clinton and what they saw was a guy who seems older than her with a thick brooklyn accent who's angry and shouting and i think that didn't strike -- my gut is, i don't have the data -- it didn't strike people as presidential or not enabling him to continue on the force he's been. >> i don't know how to describe it, helene. it is -- it may have been the