give -- to pack up and give someone else a chance. >> all right. okay. anton, now i'm going to need you to keep it real. you worked with kathleen sebelius. i have been literally on my blackberry since last night. the sense that i'm getting just from people that i have talked to is that essentially it was a combination. that essentially she was -- the clock was kind of ticking from the time the health care.gov website stopped working and there were factions that really wanted her fired, essentially, or thought she should be, but that the thinking in the white house was that she shouldn't leave on a low note. she should leave on a high note. she should delay until they got to that deadline. is that what you are hearing? tell me what your friends are -- you don't have to name them by name, but we want to know what you know. >> i think you're correct. kathleen has been a tremendous leader at the department, and everybody knew that her task would not be done until we got through the first open enrollment period of this marketplace. so it was a natural time for her to make a decision to leave because her job was to get us through the first open