insist that this was what was going on? >> maybe this is the little log that he is able to hold on to keep the river from just whooshing him away and over the falls. i don't know. this is the best he can come up with. this is a guy who we have looked at as a talented politician. it is hard to fight a multifront war. he has dawn zimmer coming in this way and the gww in this way, and the u.s. attorney coming the other way. the guy is just one e-mail, one leak, one more mayor away from the whole thing imploding. rev, the only thing that is really keeping him alive is the folks down the street at that other network, they don't talk about this. they talk about benghazi way more than they talk about bridgegate. so if you live in that bubble, this story barely exists. >> well, let me ask you this, susan. he has also said during the interview that it only matters if he knew before the bridge closing. watch this.