so he may have known about the closures while they were happening. >> right. so that's the -- that still doesn't get us to whether he planned the thing. >> the big danger has always been from the moment chris christie uttered the words that he had absolutely no knowledge of this and when he walked out from behind the podium after the two-hour press conference, he had entered into the record basically his testimony. if anyone could call into question the veracity of that testimony in the months ahead with lawyers and an investigation, this would crumble completely for chris christie. i agree with chuck. the notion that we're talking about this as what is this going to do to his presidential campaign, the largest newspaper in the state says if this is true, he should resign or be impeached. i think the clock is ticking on whether he's the chair of the rga. why wouldn't they get rid of this now and whether or not in a year we'll still call him governor christie. >> big leadership moment, that's what you think about his leadership over time. >> it certainly was a bravura