about the budget may happen around that date. so maybe november 15th could be something that doesn't have the pushback that we've seen on this particular continuing resolution. >> okay. david, so we could hit the debt ceiling as early as october 17th. if congress doesn't vote to increase the ceiling, the u.s. would default for the first time ever. how much is at stake here for the president if not the country? >> a lot's at stake. even though the president is trying to project an air he's going on with other priorities and going to draw the line, especially the debt ceilinging is a big deal. not only the budget but the debt ceiling could affect the u.s. economy. we saw two years ago, even though they made the deadline and they did lift the debt ceiling, you recall in the summer of 2011, they were downgraded by one of the wall street rating houses for the first time ever. that did hurt the economy to some extent analysts say. if it took longer, there is more uncertainty in the economy. the president's talked a lot