a death mill for babies essentially born. being tried now we'll see how it goes. this is a story that is haunting about the implications of decisions made by courts. the abortion issue will not go away if you think it is the taking of a human life, and so it's going to stay there and get itself worked through in the courts again and again. >> it does seem there is a strategy now that republican governors and legislators are basically trying to push the supreme court to retake up the issue. >> i think peggy is right that abortion won't go away the way gay marriage i think will go away in a few years and we'll get past immigration. the best we ever get to on abortion is a truce. the country is -- >> what's the new truce? >> well, we're in one of those periods where maybe the sort of truce line people are trying to move it one way or the other.