at the very least, under the '94 law, those larger magazines were not legal. and in large part, didn't exist. it doesn't mean that, you know, some of them didn't somehow get somewhere but they didn't exist by and large. and just as in the '30s, machine guns wam about and criminals got machine guns and we decided people shouldn't have machine gups. guess what? we don't see that type of weapon. people shouldn't have grenades. we decide that was illegal and we don't see a lot of crimes committed that way and that's what the '94 bill did. now, it was too broad with respect to the definition of an assault weapon and that was a weakness but other than that, it did some really good things. >> but the devil is in the details here. i want to play the vice president talking about the specific issue of magazines and their capacity. and then, talk about the ways in which the definition of what assault weapons are and were actually mattered in the details. we can't say assault weapon ban