better phrase, to use a gun metaphor, they come at it with a shotgun approach rather than a single-minded scope, let's go after the magazines. let's go after the 30-cartridge clips. let's ban those. no one's interested in taking everyone's handgun away from them. >> i don't understand that argument for two reasons. one is just because something might not be 100% solution doesn't mean it might not help. it's setting up a false hurdle for arguments. the other is part of this deb e debate, the slippery slope, if you do something, it's going to necessarily lead to the end of the world. no. you can do small steps that don't necessarily take away all guns, and you can do small steps that make a difference even if they don't solve the entire problem. what's wrong with that? >> there's nothing wrong with that. coming up, "new york times" columnist frank bruni will be here with his new column on what's really important this holiday season. plus, things get a little awkward in an interview between the obamas and barbara walters. we're going to show you that