more digital consulting firms. there's still a belief that ads work but as television habits shift, the question is how do you get ads online. we're seeing the emergence of persuasion advertising online in the circle. before it was just getting people into the funnel to become field organizers -- >> or donors. >> this sort of transitions us to this kind of what the next frontier is. the thing about broadcast ads in general is it's essentially a 1960s technology, which doesn't mean you shouldn't do it, hi, advertisers, keep doing your thing, but that there are other more specific ways to -- >> yeah. the possible of targeting particularly online right now is really incredible. not only to get potential supporters so that they become more excited and potentially become donors but to actually find those people who the campaigns know need to be persuaded in a swing state while they're watching a youtube video and converting them at that