real fears that capitol hill could end closed for business. julienne epstein, joel watkins, an msnbc analyst. good to have you with us. can anyone really win here? if we get to the shutdown, boehner's point is that he wants to draw the line in the san with federal spending. but what wouldnins? >> what he has to realize, he wasn'ts his constituents to realize, the fact they were elected, majority of the members, new members of house elected by constituent whose wanted them to bring about change and cut the rate of spending in government. he wanted to cut back programs. wasteful spending was the key issue. these folks are doing what constituents want. it may not be popular with everybody but doing what constituents wanted them to do. >> can you explain to us where it's this game of chicken with the federal government at stake? >> i think tis goes on typically