at these, so many of the president's enemies are saying, hey, look, you weren't cleared. your individual number one. the campaign finance violations are somehow this immense deal. it doesn't feel that way though when you look at the law and the john edwards situation. >> yeah, i mean, i think it's a defensible case. and i'm never going to say it's a minor thing when the president is essentially accused of directing a felony. that's not good for white house or the president. if this were a case tried in court, which it's not because you can't indict the president, there would be all kinds of defenses to the campaign finance violation, this is my modus operandi when i'm not campaigning, and i have situations to pay or women and that's note totally defense-- >> and the team mueller indicates that michael cohen is a garbage human being.