>> katie: i think that represents how difficult it is in this day and age to engage the debate. you go to the college campus, conservatives are spending thousands of dollars on security, they're being threatened by leftists to bring a different perspective into the conversation, ben shapiro included. he brought the money in to trynd say, you won't debate me based on the merits, what if i give incentive to have a conversation. >> harris: we have campaign laws. >> lisa: he was innocently looking for a hook to draw her into the conversation. but he has shut down consistently on college campuses, or attempts, why do you think that is? he is a brilliant guy and his words have an impact and people, college students listen and he offers a counter position that a lot of these college students aren't getting on the college campuses. >> tom: if she were quicker she would have accepted the challenge and satisfy let's give to it charity. >> harris: but then she has to do it. she's chicken.