saying he was essentially pushed out by general kelly. i remember the early days of the obama administration. this problem where they had all these problems with the economy and financial crisis. you knew about that in the end of the bush administration. frankly, they sometimes felt like they were doing too much. you're right, spinning plates. the system ends up getting short-circuited. this president has talked about taking on the swamp. if it's a whole bunch of issues at once, he wants to go right at it. >> jesse: i want to talk to you about the pardon of arpaio. bill clinton famously pardoned the biggest tax cheat in history. and then obama pardoned bradley manning, a huge traitor. and cocaine offenders --