most lawyers, the vast majority issue of you and others have those proposed discussions would not have been a violation of the law. >> the point if it does show willingness, perhaps not collusion because apparently none of us know what really went on during the meeting. assuming at least i'm not point everyone is telling the truth. doesn't it show intent and willingness on the part of don junior and garrett and paul manafort to collude with the russians? when they play now, it was not just some russia not the street. she had close ties to the people in the kremlin. >> number one, the discussion if it was going to be about russian opposition research that the lawyer had, the fact is, you know that goes on in campaigns all the time. >> it doesn't go on with russians all the time, jay.