all right, i'm sure you saw the obama interview with o'reilly on sunday, the president sort of dismisses the entire thing as an isolated incident, boneheaded decisions by a handful of bureaucrats. isn't there an e-mail now that belies that, and what does it show? >> yeah, there is an e-mail that belies it. the president says there was not a smidgen of evidence of corruption, yet two days ago the house ways and means committee released an e-mail they got through their investigation which shows from the very highest level of the chief counsel's office, the office i used to work in of the irs, where deputy chief counsels and associate chief counsels were in communication with lois lerner to develop new rules regarding 501c4s to restrict those groups. they wanted to do what they called, quote, off plan which means off the books so it's not on the public calendar. and all of that was taking place while the targeting was going on. so this whole concept that a somehow we're dealing with a