blower a threat to national security or is he an american hero in your mind? >> to begin with, i find it very interesting that he goes to hong kong to get a little security. it's a pretty strange going to hong kong. and frankly, i don't think you have any winners here. i didn't like him. to me, he looks like a grand stander. he's been there three months. i didn't like him. at the same time, i mean, that's a lot of information that people are getting, and that our government is getting. you say where does it stop? it's a mess. there is no question about it. i don't like him. i don't like what they're doing. >> gretchen: yeah. my concern this morning is i don't want our country to have infighting as a result of it. i fear that now the country is going to be separated on what they think about him, what they think about the nsa, what they think about how we treat terrorism, and do you have that feeling at all? >> i don't know that there is any answer. i'm as strong as it gets on terrorism, yet when you're just going into everybody's records