extreme. >> bill: you know, i don't even bother with the constitutional stuff. that's for ron paul to say he knows about the constitution, nobody else does. what i bother with is civil liberties. okay. so civil liberties includes reproductive rights. reproductive rights, which means in the aclu's parlance, that a woman should have the right to abort a fetus any time, any place for any reason and i'm going, i don't know if that is really taken into account rights of the baby, you know. reproductive rights, i mean, is there baby rights anywhere? apparently there isn't. so that takes the aclu out of contention for me. >> well, i don't know where they're getting immigration for the 14th amendment is one class of people. they're illegal immigrants and born here, then the baby doesn't have the right to be a citizen. i don't know how they make that into one class of people. but nevertheless, babies have rights as well. >> bill: not according to the