>> bill: why? >> i thought he was a man of strong character, honest, clear-eyed in his approach to the -- >> bill: hold it. let me stop you. >> okay. >> bill: you like eric holder. clear-eyed, honest guy, right? >> right. >> bill: three words. marc rich pardon. you can explain that to me? >> they all pardon the people who kiss their butts. >> bill: do you not take that into account? do you not take that into account? >> i take -- >> bill: the big picture. so let's let the biggest tax cheat in american history let him off and give him a pardon. you, geraldo -- how much of a bigger picture do you get than the biggest tax cheat in history? >> let me agree with you about fast and furious and his role in this. >> bill: okay. >> it's like roger clemens who went before congress and allegedly lied. if eric holder when he said i'm not sure of the exact date but i probably heard about fast and furious for the first time over the last few weeks he said that in may of this year.