chapman, who is a corporate lawyer, and daniel cloak who was a head of hr, i think that they would -- they if called to this committee, that in their experience and their knowledge and when they looked through the file and felt that the harbottle & lewis letter was correct. >> okay. i've got just a couple of final questions. the silence eye cross fleet street apart from a few newspapers. the garden, the independent and the ft and "the new york times" in the coverage of this affair, can you remember calling any editors after the guardian story in july 2005 to discuss how they might cover or not cover the story in order to downplay the