as failure, i guess. it's quite extraordinary. but, you know, you didn't hear a lot about their fannie mae past when they took these positions. >> and extraordinarily, a number of these guys who are in legal trouble, the u.s. federal treasury is bank rolling their defense. >> the taxpayer is bank rolling their defense against shareholder lawsuits, yes, even now after we're into the companies both fannie and freddie for $154 billion, the added insult is that taxpayers are paying their legal bills. >> should there be criminal charges against any of these guys where someone ends up going to prison? >> there was a big accounting scandal at both companies and there were no criminal charges and, of course -- >> how is that possible? >> well, you know, i'm not a prosecutor. you got to ask the doj. >> are we talking about political favors? we can't go after those guys. those guys are our friends? >> who knows? they don't have the appetite to do it. that is clear. but there were, you know, obviously misdeeds. >> well, it's a great new book. check it out. "reckless endangerment" gretchen