door then for me to make good decisions. so i'm grateful for that. >> mike: you brought your family an enormous level of humiliation and pain and your congregation that you had literally started in your own basement. >> well, and the national national association eevangelicals. i was serving as their president. i had a network of churches that were wonderful. i was serving them. i brought shame to everybody that was associated of with that. actually, i brought shame to everybody who called on the name of christ because i was in many ways the highest elected representative of born-again christians. and, of course, that was very embarrassing. but the foundation of our faith is that all have sinned and fallen short of the glory of god. and certainly jesus died on the cross for a reason. it's because all of us need that. and so i was embarrassed that i went through that. now that that's over three years old, i am grateful because it opened the door for me to be healed. >> mike: you were at the pentagon call and pentagon call and on a pedestal.